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Isaac 3 & D Okoro - A Two Way Playing Basketball Savant

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Who is Isaac Okoro's Favorite Eastern Roman (Byzantine) Emperor?

  • Arcadius (if one does not count Constantine as first)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Justinian the Great

    Votes: 8 14.3%
  • Zeno

    Votes: 2 3.6%
  • Heraclius

    Votes: 3 5.4%
  • Basil II, the Bulgar Slayer

    Votes: 6 10.7%
  • Nikephoros II Phokas, the Pale Death of the Saracens

    Votes: 7 12.5%
  • Alexios I Komnenos

    Votes: 4 7.1%
  • John II, the Beautiful Komnenos

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Constantine XI

    Votes: 4 7.1%
  • Jim I Chones, the Magnificent

    Votes: 26 46.4%

  • Total voters
    56
Just seeing the same things I saw with Porter last year and getting similar vibes. Did you tell me last year there were hundreds of players of Porter jrs caliber or was that Nathan?

Vassell is my 2nd pick at 5, and I would be happy with him

I don’t know if it matters who said it but Porter was a horrendous analytical case, no matter how you slice it. Do some of those guys succeed? I mean, sure.......but they succeed at insanely lower rates.

I’ve never claimed to know who will and won’t succeed, I just point out guys who are more likely candidates to do so. If Porter succeeds, he will buck a trend....Okoro isn’t in the same tier as Porter, he’s several tiers above, so he’s not an extreme.....but he is still in the gray area where it is really tough in the top 5. Porter was a shot in the dark on pure talent......at 30, take a swing......at 5, that seems like an unnecessary risk to me, relative to the other options available.

Again, I wouldn’t mind Okoro....I get the allure of his frame / athleticism.......I just don’t understand why you would take him over a very similar player, who has proven to be a more impactful defender, who’s also a proven shooter. It’s tough for me to see an argument centered around free throw rate for example, in a league where wings who can’t shoot are barely even playable in the postseason.
 
Have not paid too much attention to some of these guys.

Okoro passes the eye test better than just about anyone. Clearly already has above average NBA finishing ability with either hand. He will be very good with the additional spacing in the NBA. Looks bigger than 6'6 or at least plays bigger. He screams very high ceiling to me.

If he really has that Sexton, Delly dog-like mentality I would like him over Vassell.
 
Have not paid too much attention to some of these guys.

Okoro passes the eye test better than just about anyone. Clearly already has above average NBA finishing ability with either hand. He will be very good with the additional spacing in the NBA. Looks bigger than 6'6 or at least plays bigger. He screams very high ceiling to me.

If he really has that Sexton, Delly dog-like mentality I would like him over Vassell.
Have not paid too much attention to some of these guys.

Okoro passes the eye test better than just about anyone. Clearly already has above average NBA finishing ability with either hand. He will be very good with the additional spacing in the NBA. Looks bigger than 6'6 or at least plays bigger. He screams very high ceiling to me.

If he really has that Sexton, Delly dog-like mentality I would like him over Vassell.

He looks smaller than 6'6. looks 6'4-6'5.
 
In the modern NBA there's a height range of like 8+ inches at every position. Can't imagine how an inch or two makes a big difference either way. If you like Okoro, you should like him even if he measures 6'4". If you dislike Okoro, you should dislike him even if he measures 6'6".
 
In the modern NBA there's a height range of like 8+ inches at every position. Can't imagine how an inch or two makes a big difference either way. If you like Okoro, you should like him even if he measures 6'4". If you dislike Okoro, you should dislike him even if he measures 6'6".

His length matters when his strong suit is attacking the rim and converting on a high volume on the offensive end. Theoretically he may not be as good finishing inside against bigger, stronger and lengthier players.

Length also matters on the defensive end. His standing reach looks average, but luckily he relies on quick feet, good positioning and having a strong frame so it he will be ok. But if he were bigger, he would have been able to guard more positions.
 
In the modern NBA there's a height range of like 8+ inches at every position. Can't imagine how an inch or two makes a big difference either way. If you like Okoro, you should like him even if he measures 6'4". If you dislike Okoro, you should dislike him even if he measures 6'6".

Standing reach is important on the defensive end moreso than the offensive end. Length allows more switching and versatility. The Cavaliers front office has forced length to be a part of the conversation by drafting two undersized guards in back to back years. You tend to look at the draft for a non-Cavaliers specific lens, so I understand your opinion... it just neglects some very important fit concerns for this front office to address.
 
His length matters when his strong suit is attacking the rim and converting on a high volume on the offensive end. Theoretically he may not be as good finishing inside against bigger, stronger and lengthier players.

Length also matters on the defensive end. His standing reach looks average, but luckily he relies on quick feet, good positioning and having a strong frame so it he will be ok. But if he were bigger, he would have been able to guard more positions.

It matters a little, but I still think it's getting down too much in the weeds. He's going to measure at least an inch taller than Wade, for instance, who's one of the great slasher/finishers in NBA history. Similarly, it's not hard to find examples of 6'5" guys who're among the most versatile defenders in the league.

Standing reach is important on the defensive end moreso than the offensive end. Length allows more switching and versatility. The Cavaliers front office has forced length to be a part of the conversation by drafting two undersized guards in back to back years. You tend to look at the draft for a non-Cavaliers specific lens, so I understand your opinion... it just neglects some very important fit concerns for this front office to address.

I kinda see that? But what does Okoro's ability to defend 4's and 5's have to do with our small backcourt? If Okoro can defend 1's and 2's that's arguably more important in terms of fit than if he can defend 4's and 5's.
 
Have not paid too much attention to some of these guys.

Okoro passes the eye test better than just about anyone. Clearly already has above average NBA finishing ability with either hand. He will be very good with the additional spacing in the NBA. Looks bigger than 6'6 or at least plays bigger. He screams very high ceiling to me.

If he really has that Sexton, Delly dog-like mentality I would like him over Vassell.

Yep. You can't discount motor either and he is all over the court disrupting the offense. From an intangibles point of view, Okoro and Haliburton are those guys that when they are there, the team does well, and when they aren't the team struggles.

It's important when a guy is gone and his team can't function properly.

Cultural piece, defensive anchor, leader.
 
It matters a little, but I still think it's getting down too much in the weeds. He's going to measure at least an inch taller than Wade, for instance, who's one of the great slasher/finishers in NBA history. Similarly, it's not hard to find examples of 6'5" guys who're among the most versatile defenders in the league.



I kinda see that? But what does Okoro's ability to defend 4's and 5's have to do with our small backcourt? If Okoro can defend 1's and 2's that's arguably more important in terms of fit than if he can defend 4's and 5's.

I"m not saying that his length is going to break or make him. He has a sturdy build that will allow him to still do what he does, but let's not pretend like SR does not matter to a guy that two of his strongest suits are inside finishing and defense.

I do think however, that for a guy like Vassell who is a toothpick measurements, and length are far more critical. There is no denying that. He does not have Okoro's lateral quickness and sturdy build.

I don't think that Wade is a good comparison at all. You are comparing one of the most explosive 2 guards with a gazillion in between moves to a guy that currently only his main calling offensively is attacking the rim in the paint and defensively, a player that projects as a multi positional defender. But it may prove, that these 2 inches may determind if he can guard 4's and 5's effectively or not. Even 3's(do not believe so, but who knows).

His length may help with his floor, but if he improves offensively, then sure, it may not mean much at all.
 
Not sure if yall knew this but

But Okoro reportedly being close with Sexton is definitely a nice thing to hear about; Okoro is from Sexton’s hometown of Atlanta/its surrounding areas, and the two are close. So to reiterate, to me, that further drives home that Okoro, who has a nonstop motor, would fit right into the hard-working culture the Cavaliers are trying to build.

Also can't find it now but Auburn's record with and without Okoro was pretty staggering.
 
Which, granted, you would expect out of a potential top 5 pick in the draft :)
 
I"m not saying that his length is going to break or make him. He has a sturdy build that will allow him to still do what he does, but let's not pretend like SR does not matter to a guy that two of his strongest suits are inside finishing and defense.

I do think however, that for a guy like Vassell who is a toothpick measurements, and length are far more critical. There is no denying that. He does not have Okoro's lateral quickness and sturdy build.

I don't think that Wade is a good comparison at all. You are comparing one of the most explosive 2 guards with a gazillion in between moves to a guy that currently only his main calling offensively is attacking the rim in the paint and defensively, a player that projects as a multi positional defender. But it may prove, that these 2 inches may determind if he can guard 4's and 5's effectively or not. Even 3's(do not believe so, but who knows).

His length may help with his floor, but if he improves offensively, then sure, it may not mean much at all.

I'm just pointing to Wade because his size obviously didn't hinder his ability to drive strong to the rim and take contact in the NBA. If Okoro fails in that regard, it'll be due to a lack of skill, not due to a lack of physical tools.

As for standing reach...yeah, it matters, it's just not a major data point for me. Brandon Clarke and his 8'6" standing reach just shot 77% in the restricted area. He was a great finisher and a great defender in college, and it looks like he'll be great at those things in the NBA too. Sure, he'd be even better with longer arms, but measuring a few inches short of the positional standard didn't break him as a prospect or make his transition to the NBA any more difficult than a typical prospect's transition to the NBA.
 

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