Tristan Thompson

[Drifter]

A lot may depend on how much Mozgov is willing to accept in a deal (will he play below his market value) If he's offered the max by another team are you 100% certain the Cavs will match the offer?

I am, yes. Because they can't win a title without him, and they are over the cap and can't buy another UFA to replace him. They HAVE to sign him. He knows that. So does every other team in the NBA. The Cavs will be able to offer him the most in years/money, and they might have to do that to keep him.

 

[Drifter]

This is wrong for numerous reasons that have been detailed before.

We may not be financially able to keep Tristan and Mozgov at near-max contracts.

Please do not assert something like this as factual when many others on this board not only disagree but have good reason to.

You are welcome to disagree, of course. It may not be factual, but it certainly is common sense. Your assertion we may not be able to keep both is no less conjecture than mine is that we will. It's a tax penalty discussion. And Gilbert is attempting to retain the entire team while willingly accepting that tax penalty. They're gonna balk at the tax next summer and let their fourth-best player walk? No way. IMO it would be absurd for the Cavs to not retain Mozgov. People are suggesting LeBron would be pissed if TT walks. If the Cavs let Mozgov walk, that would really shake LeBron, because there won't be any titles without a combo rim protecting/offensive center.

 

[gourimoko]

You are welcome to disagree, of course. It may not be factual, but it certainly is common sense.

It's not common sense.

Saying something is common sense is a logical fallacy, it doesn't support an argument, but instead, invalidates it.

IMO it would be absurd for the Cavs to not retain Mozgov.

I think most would agree if at all possible, but reports are that Mozgov will likely use Tristan's contract as a starting point for negotiations.

Again, the Cavaliers are very likely near their financial limit with respect to spending.

You're talking about having 5 max or near-max contracts on the team, that is very likely not sustainable for the ownership group.

People are suggesting LeBron would be pissed if TT walks.

He very likely would be, yes.

If the Cavs let Mozgov walk, that would really shake LeBron, because there won't be any titles without a combo rim protecting/offensive center.

I'm sure it would.

The argument here isn't about how best to please LeBron, but how to best field a contender.

LeBron is siding with his own agency; so I'm not really shocked or surprised when he comes out defending Tristan and Rich Paul.

But the point of this is that by signing Tristan to a near-max/max contract there is a very real possibility that we will be forced to place him into the starting lineup as we might not be able to retain Mozgov.

There is not an unlimited supply of money to sign these players, tax be damned.

 

[Tlyons]

Maybe the Browns will sign Braylon Edwards to come punch this dude in the face again.

 

[mds]

You are welcome. Now wait 5 minutes and start spewing " TT doesn't cost 60 million this season" all over again. I will come to your rescue again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Paul]

Look at our alternatives at the 5 and then tell me what you propose. Gilbert is too committed to NOT pay Mozgov. He put all of his chips in the middle; he can't at this point take a stack or two back and go 75% all in. He's in 100% and that means paying Mozgov.

...what I'm getting at here is that we NEED Mozgov to win, plain and simple. Everything else that Gilbert and the FO have done is for nothing if you let him walk.

Mozgov is going to be better than anyone we can get via trade or free agency. It would be a shame to lose him. As with Tristan, none of the alternatives are likely to look as good, but if Gilbert leaves Griffin no choice, he will have to figure something out.

One possibility would be to start Kaun. We should know more about how realistic that is soon enough. Kaun's known as a good defender, at least in Europe. He's familiar with David Blatt. Stranger things have happened.

We also have the TPEs and we have some pull in attracting a ring chaser to Cleveland.

It's not ideal, but if Gilbert won't sign off on a huge contract for Mozgov, Griffin will have to make the best of it.

 

[Cavatt]

I don't know what you're trying to say here. Do the max without the tax level? How?

I think they have offered 80M for 5 but would they offer 32 for 2? Probably not. That is my point.

 

[gratefuldead]

 

[cavsfever]

View: https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/651531080806342656


This is an interesting listen. Windy is towing the Rich Paul line. Lowe basically knocks it all back as bullshit.

Windhorst is so full of shit in this podcast it's incredible. The 76ers will give TT a max contract! The Cavs will play badly and need to pay TT whatever he wants! Draymond Green settled for less than his market value!

If all the garbage he's saying really represents how TT/Rich Paul are thinking then this thing is going on a long time.

 

[cavsfever]

Windy also seems to claim that TT is more valuable than Kevin Love and will play more minutes than him in the playoffs.

 

[Nphan]

I am, yes. Because they can't win a title without him, and they are over the cap and can't buy another UFA to replace him. They HAVE to sign him. He knows that. So does every other team in the NBA. The Cavs will be able to offer him the most in years/money, and they might have to do that to keep him.

they can win one without him

 

[castor777]

Windhorst is so full of shit in this podcast it's incredible. The 76ers will give TT a max contract! The Cavs will play badly and need to pay TT whatever he wants! Draymond Green settled for less than his market value!

If all the garbage he's saying really represents how TT/Rich Paul are thinking then this thing is going on a long time.

Well lets be fair, Windhorst is by no means passing that off as his personal take (he seems to know it's ridiculous), rather this is how Rich Paul is approaching the Cavs in arguing for a max contract. The whole market value thing is how Paul looks at it, and is disregarding any numbers or stats that clearly say TT is not a max contract player. To Rich Paul, the direction of the market should completely dictate TT's contract and they believe he clearly will be worth the 5 year, 94 million contract going forward.

But man do I LOVE Zach Lowe's reaction to it! His quote as they were wrapping up the TT talk:

"The play to me has always been, Cleveland gives Tristan a little charity bump to 5 years 83 million, 84 million. Tristan signs it knowing it's the greatest contract, it's ridiculous that he's getting it. It's unbelievable, it so far exceeds his ability as a basketball player and he's lucky to have it. And everyone claims victory and we move on because... look I know there's too much cap room next summer for not enough good free agents. Someone estimated to me there's some 600 million dollars in cap room - which do the math, that's almost 20 million per team, that's almost a max player per team. So I get that, everyone knows the dynamics now. But if Tristan Thompson had signed the qualifying offer, which is now off the table, but lets imagine a scenario in which he did, and comes back on a one year deal aiming for free agency next year. He comes off the bench, he plays 25 minutes a game, he averages 8 and 8. And still can't shoot, and still doesn't finish all that well, and is still doing all what is set up by LeBron and Kyrie which is like gravy, I mean you can't be in a better situation than that when you're a mooch on offense. It's the best possible... He's not getting a max! I just, I know what the cap situation is, I don't care! He's not going to get a max contract coming off an 8 and 8 year! He's a nice defensive player, he doesn't change your life as a defensive player. That to me is the outcome that makes sense. Maybe they'll bump up that offer anyway, and we can all stop talking about Tristan Thompson. Can we all stop talking about Tristan Thompson now, can that be all we talk about?"

 

[spydy13]

Windhorst is so full of shit in this podcast it's incredible. The 76ers will give TT a max contract! The Cavs will play badly and need to pay TT whatever he wants! Draymond Green settled for less than his market value!

If all the garbage he's saying really represents how TT/Rich Paul are thinking then this thing is going on a long time.

That last part is very much true, and I can't see how it's not when Rich has used other media members to make similar arguments.

As Lowe points out in the podcast (which many on here have said as well but it's nice to hear a national perspective say it too), 80M/5 is already an overpay for a player like TT, so this idea that it's all about future value is insane. If anything, they should have done this last year with Bledsoe because he's far more likely to be the type of player that someone would offer max money to even if he's not worth it.

 

[cavsfever]

But man do I LOVE Zach Lowe's reaction to it! His quote as they were wrapping up the TT talk:

"The play to me has always been, Cleveland gives Tristan a little charity bump to 5 years 83 million, 84 million. Tristan signs it knowing it's the greatest contract, it's ridiculous that he's getting it. It's unbelievable, it so far exceeds his ability as a basketball player and he's lucky to have it. And everyone claims victory and we move on because... look I know there's too much cap room next summer for not enough good free agents. Someone estimated to me there's some 600 million dollars in cap room - which do the math, that's almost 20 million per team, that's almost a max player per team. So I get that, everyone knows the dynamics now. But if Tristan Thompson had signed the qualifying offer, which is now off the table, but lets imagine a scenario in which he did, and comes back on a one year deal aiming for free agency next year. He comes off the bench, he plays 25 minutes a game, he averages 8 and 8. And still can't shoot, and still doesn't finish all that well, and is still doing all what is set up by LeBron and Kyrie which is like gravy, I mean you can't be in a better situation than that when you're a mooch on offense. It's the best possible... He's not getting a max! I just, I know what the cap situation is, I don't care! He's not going to get a max contract coming off an 8 and 8 year! He's a nice defensive player, he doesn't change your life as a defensive player. That to me is the outcome that makes sense. Maybe they'll bump up that offer anyway, and we can all stop talking about Tristan Thompson. Can we all stop talking about Tristan Thompson now, can that be all we talk about?"

Yet more evidence that Zach Lowe is the best NBA writer/commenter going.

 

[Kbiz]

Philly eh? Man, they must love to stockpile F/C's if that's true. Noel, Embiid, Okafor....Tristan Thompson, come on down!