Cleveland Indians Offseason News, Notes, and Rumors

Juicy D said:

2012 is the year everyone was looking for the Indians to contend, if they think they can go into next season with Laporta, Santana, and Brantley platooning at 1st base then its another 2nd place finish.

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If they're lucky. They may not overperform for a month and a half like this year.

cmstophe said:

If they're lucky. They may not overperform for a month and a half like this year.

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They might not underperform for three months like they did this year.

Who really knows.

I know the Rangers went to the World Series with Mitch Moreland as their 1B, so if the Indians fail....it won't be because of one position.

They also had Nelson Cruz, Josh Hamilton, Adrian Beltre, Michael Young, Ian Kinsler and Mike Napoli, so it wasn't exactly that important for them to have a quality first baseman.

b00bie said:

They might not underperform for three months like they did this year.

Who really knows.

I know the Rangers went to the World Series with Mitch Moreland as their 1B, so if the Indians fail....it won't be because of one position.

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That is terrible logic. However, as to the first part of your post, seeing as they've 'underperformed' since 2008, I wouldn't place bets on them not doing it at all next year.

cmstophe said:

That is terrible logic. However, as to the first part of your post, seeing as they've 'underperformed' since 2008, I wouldn't place bets on them not doing it at all next year.

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I don't think they underperformed at all really.

And nobody should be more cognizant of that fact than you, considering you think this team is a bunch of no talent pussies.

elcheato said:

They also had Nelson Cruz, Josh Hamilton, Adrian Beltre, Michael Young, Ian Kinsler and Mike Napoli, so it wasn't exactly that important for them to have a quality first baseman.

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While this point is certainly valid, it doesn't change the fact you can win without adequate production from a traditional power position.

Especially if you have power at non-traditional position (Kipnis 2B, Sizemore CF).

Santana, Cabrera, Kipnis, Choo, Hafner, Chisenhall, Sizemore. All of those guys have the potential for 20+ homers and 70+ RBI...this season.

I certainly don't expect that from all of them, but I don't think you can argue that if healthy the above players aren't capable.

b00bie said:

I don't think they underperformed at all really.

And nobody should be more cognizant of that fact than you, considering you think this team is a bunch of no talent pussies.

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I do? When did I say this? They have a handful of good players, definitely.

Aren't you the one always talking about how they underperformed from 2008-2010 because of injuries and shit and not because the team lacks talent? I thought that was you anyways.

Anyhow, I'm trying to think of something less exciting than an Indians offseason/Winter Meetings as an Indians fan, but I just can't.

b00bie said:

While this point is certainly valid, it doesn't change the fact you can win without adequate production from a traditional power position.

Especially if you have power at non-traditional position (Kipnis 2B, Sizemore CF).

Santana, Cabrera, Kipnis, Choo, Hafner, Chisenhall, Sizemore. All of those guys have the potential for 20+ homers and 70+ RBI...this season.

I certainly don't expect that from all of them, but I don't think you can argue that if healthy the above players aren't capable.

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The problem is that without an adequate first baseman, there is no way they can over come bad production.

bigjmac0815 said:

If you guys havent realized it yet, i dont care what u think about me and my posts.....and ill keep posting

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Did anyone else laugh reading this?

cmstophe said:

I do? When did I say this? They have a handful of good players, definitely.

Aren't you the one always talking about how they underperformed from 2008-2010 because of injuries and shit and not because the team lacks talent? I thought that was you anyways.

Anyhow, I'm trying to think of something less exciting than an Indians offseason/Winter Meetings as an Indians fan, but I just can't.

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I don't really consider injuries underperforming.

Underperforming to me is when the team is healthy and they play like shit.

And if you can't think of something less interesting, I suggest you turn on NFL Network tomorrow around...say...8:30.

That might have a shot at making the cut, yes.

I was playing around with the payroll figures for next season, and with all the arbitration-eligible players on the roster who performed well last season, I can see where people like Lastoria and Hoynes are saying the Indians are running out of money to sign free agents rather than looking to be part of a trade. (I should note that Pluto said during one of his chats that he felt the Indians payroll heading in to 2012 would be between $70-75M, so take that for what it is worth). Here's what I have so far:




This assumes a lot on my part, of course. The players highlighted in yellow have been added or removed from the 40-man since the end of the 2011 season. The cells highlighted in red represent those eligible for arbitration. I had to guess at their salaries for the upcoming season - pure guesses on my part, but partially based on Pluto's weekly chats on cleveland.com and partially based on what I see happening around the league so far this off season. Certainly they are not figures that are written in stone. Might be more, might be less.

The other red highlighted cell is Sizemore's incentives, which it remains to be seen if he will receive any of this money. His performance leading up to the trading deadline during the first part of the season will be very interesting to watch to say the least.

But it is easy to see where the Tribe could benefit by trading say Carmona or Chris or R. Perez, instead of openly competing on the free agent market at this point.

All the FAs suck so if they don't sign a single FA that's fine with me. Trades would be nice however.

Damage said:

Hanley may be buddies w Reyes but he definitely doesn't want to play 3B. And how would it suck the momentum out of the spending spree? They have Reyes, they're looking at Pujols, Buhrle, Fielder...ascab isn't some slouch.

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The Marlins asked Hanley if he would move to 3B if they signed Reyes and he said he would. How do we know he isn't willing to move? I read speculation, but very little hard evidence of this. He is a butthead, but he has Loria's ear and I would shocked if he was forced to move completely against his will.

It sucks the momentum because Hanley is their original superstar- and while we love Asdrubal, he isn't well known around the league and he definitely isn't in the same class of talent as Hanley Ramirez. It immediately calls into question the Marlins' FO- both because they are dealing their superstar AND because their biggest signing is what made his departure a necessity. Regardless of who the Marlins get back, it would look bad and be second-guessed until the season was well underway. Just the nature of a move like that.

Pujols isn't going to Miami, Fielder isn't either.

And even if they did, the Marlins only have enough pitching to finish third in that division anyway.

I'd lay solid odds that Reyes is dealt within four of those years. Poorly constructed spending spree centered around a owner who is all show and no backbone.