2015 Cleveland Browns Training Camp Thread

The reason so many early first round QB's are forced to play right away, because they are paid a lot of money, and generally, you don't usually draft a guy so high if he's not ready to play.

But drafting say a guy in the late first round, or second round? Maybe he's not quite ready to play right away, but you believe he has the tools and talent to eventually be that guy.

It's different for each player and situation. Some are ready to come in and play right away, some need a bit more time. Drew Brees was an example of someone that needed a bit more time.

Johnny just blows. We can give him all the time we want. He just can't play in the NFL, at all. You got to have some tools in the shed, and I don't see any with him.

I don't have any tweets or anything to put in here, but I was listening to Nathan Zegura on Browns Daily today. He is a mouthpiece for Farmer (they talk a ton, Zegura wants to be a scout someday). I found a couple of things he said today interesting:

- He pretty much guaranteed that Marlon Moore (WR) will make the team again.

- Said he wouldn't be surprised to see Pryor go on IR because he wouldn't be ready to start the season off anyways.

Interestingly, these comments leave Vince Mayle on the outside looking in. There's a chance they can try to let him go through the wire, but another team may still like him from the draft.. That said, it says something that a 4th rounder couldn't make the Browns... I've felt like Mayle would make it because he's been on Special Teams to start both pre-season games, but I might be wrong.

As of today. This will change, but it's worth looking at.

Notable:

• Bowe is a #3 WR (behind Benjamin)
• Gabriel behind Hawk still (Marlon Moore behind Mayle)
• Bibbs still behind Housler
• Charles Gaines looking like a good investment
• Kirksey ahead of Robertson
• Desir going to be on the field a lot this year

godfather said:

Praise? I don't think anyone's claiming he's Tom Brady exactly.

He's a smart and sharp veteran though. He knows how to play, he just doesn't have a lot of talent.

He's a journeyman QB, there's no denying that. Despite what some people think, it's still important to have a QB that at least knows how to run an offense and put everyone else in the best position to execute well.

For a development standpoint for the young players around him that's still important.

McCown might not have a lot of talent, but he does have the brain. Johnny has neither.

I think our offense could sputter altogether with Johnny. Where with McCown, we could at least be functional.

McCown should easily be the starter. But don't worry Johnny fans, you'll probably get to see him by mid-season.

And when he fails, again, that can finally be the book on him as a Brown and we can just move on.

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So you are a Johnny hater, that explains it.

Figured the McCown backers were either Cleveland biased or against Manziel. Just digging for the truth, thanks for providing.

SanduskyCav said:

So you are a Johnny hater, that explains it.

Figured the McCown backers were either Cleveland biased or against Manziel. Just digging for the truth, thanks for providing.

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Dig deep enough and you'll find that Manziel is currently an atrocious NFL QB with a depressingly mediocre ceiling.

McCown sucks too. I'm neither a McCown backer nor a Johnny hater. I'm an awful-QB hater.

I await your Old rating with bated breath.

SanduskyCav said:

So you are a Johnny hater, that explains it.

Figured the McCown backers were either Cleveland biased or against Manziel. Just digging for the truth, thanks for providing.

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Dude, you asked a question, and after receiving an answer you didn't like you went directly to attacking the person as biased rather than the arguments that person made. I'm not high on Manziel, but I don't have a horse in the race with McCown either... I just think you should discuss the point someone makes rather than immediately going personal. You asked.

Soda said:

Notable:

• Bowe is a #3 WR (behind Benjamin)
• Gabriel behind Hawk still (Marlon Moore behind Mayle)
• Bibbs still behind Housler
• Charles Gaines looking like a good investment
• Kirksey ahead of Robertson
• Desir going to be on the field a lot this year

Click to expand...

The big news flash I'm seeing is Justin Gilbert soundly in third string or worse at both CB and kick returner. That's not so good for his career with this franchise.

I expect career worsts out of Bowe.

I think he's in for a bad, bad year. Like 600yds, 3 TD bad.

How long till the Cavs start?

The Oi said:

I expect career worsts out of Bowe.

I think he's in for a bad, bad year. Like 600yds, 3 TD bad.

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Still will be the leading reciever.

I made a quick check on The Browns financial investments in their receiving corps.

Highest paid receiver in 2015 is Andrew Hawkins, pulling in 5 million this season. Interestingly, he drops to 1 million in 2016. Bowe is second making 4.5 million, but it jumps to 8 million if he is on the roster in 2016. Hartline makes 2.25 million this year and 3.75 in 2016. No other receiver is making more than $900,000. If you also factor in the dirt cheap tight ends - Barnidge at 1.2 million, Dray at 1.9 million, and Housler at 1.7 million - this is a bargain basement investment in weapons.

Other offensive skill positions are also a low investment. All the running backs are on rookie contracts that are bargain basement cap hits. For all the shit we give Manziel at times his contract is only a 1.8 million cap hit, signing bonus included. That is a backup quarterback investment, financially. McCown is the 3rd biggest money out of the non-offensive linemen at a whopping $3.9 million cap hit after the signing bonus, which is of course veteran backup QB money.

So if you think this offense resembles the clearance rack at an Old Navy, its because we are paying Old Navy prices at every non-offensive linemen position.

The Oi said:

I expect career worsts out of Bowe.

I think he's in for a bad, bad year. Like 600yds, 3 TD bad.

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That's a 300% increase in TDs and only a 20% decrease in yards from last season.

I'll take that 280% improvement with a much worse QB.

chrisrich91 said:

Dig deep enough and you'll find that Manziel is currently an atrocious NFL QB with a depressingly mediocre ceiling.

McCown sucks too. I'm neither a McCown backer nor a Johnny hater. I'm an awful-QB hater.

I await your Old rating with bated breath.

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I dont think McCown is awful, i think he is merely bad.

SanduskyCav said:

So you are a Johnny hater, that explains it.

Figured the McCown backers were either Cleveland biased or against Manziel. Just digging for the truth, thanks for providing.

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Hater? Nope. Skeptical, yes.

If he ends up being good, I've stated I'll probably be happier than all these Manziel fan boys.

Just calling it like I see it.

I've stated numerous times we don't have a viable option at the position right. But, you obviously missed that part.

Lord Mar said:

That's a 300% increase in TDs and only a 20% decrease in yards from last season.

I'll take that 280% improvement with a much worse QB.

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Um, that is an infinite improvement in TD's (or undefined, depends on how you look at), he had zero last year. I know math isnt your thing though.

Lee said:

Um, that is an infinite improvement in TD's (or undefined, depends on how you look at), he had zero last year. I know math isnt your thing though.

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Touche bae

Here's another math solution for ya - Johnny Manziel is infinitely better than Josh McCown.

MIND BLOWN.