Glenechocreek
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Let's say Bynum comes back, and is solid for 15-20 minutes a game. With Jack, Bennett, Karasev there, our bench could be as good as any.
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2013 NBA Preseason Game 4 -|- Pistons @ Cavs -|- October 17th, 7:00PM.
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Woosah
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Just from this preseason so far, Karasev satiates my appetite for a lanky wing who can knock down and give good space. As a 2 guard I think he could play right now. Even though he had a few rookie mistakes, his feel for the game is evident. I really feel just like I did when I first watched Klay during his rookie year in the Bay. Young Stojakovic without as much length but with MUCH better mobility and less indifference for the defensive side of the floor.
His playmaking, length and ability to space the floor makes me really like him in a backcourt with Kyrie. I dont think that he'll develop the frame to hold his own on the defensive side with 3's like Bron, Melo, PG but as a 2, I think his length and IQ/ability to play angles will cover whatever quickness advantage other 2's might have.
His playmaking, length and ability to space the floor makes me really like him in a backcourt with Kyrie. I dont think that he'll develop the frame to hold his own on the defensive side with 3's like Bron, Melo, PG but as a 2, I think his length and IQ/ability to play angles will cover whatever quickness advantage other 2's might have.
ajz20
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I still remember all the crazy looks I got in Brooklyn when I started the Ginobli 2,0 chant at the draft when his name was called! ah summer memories!
Tornicade
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thats because it was a dumb chant regardless of any similiairities.
MRMsix6
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Based on what we saw last year and so far this year, Gee should not even be in the rotation. Between Clark, Miles, Karasev and maybe eventually Bennett, Gee just doesn't offer enough as a wing player. He's a huge offensive liability to the point where you're afraid to let him touch the ball outside of alley oops. He's also not an impact defender.
Also, Dellavedova's running flip-jump-push-floater was hilarious.
Also, Dellavedova's running flip-jump-push-floater was hilarious.
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Is Gee's contract guaranteed next year? Seems like a waste of cap space for FA.
Edit: next year is a team option. I got off my ass and Googled it.
So Bynum, Andy, and Gee are all cap space fodder if needed.
Edit: next year is a team option. I got off my ass and Googled it.
So Bynum, Andy, and Gee are all cap space fodder if needed.
Good stuff from Lloyd:
Cavs 96, Pistons 84: final thoughts (part 1)
By JASON LLOYD Published: October 18, 2013
Sergey Karasev steals the ball from the Pistons' Josh Smith in the fourth quarter Thursday in Cleveland. The Cavaliers won 96-84. (AP Photo/Mark Duncan)
CLEVELAND: Final thoughts following a preseason win over the Detroit Pistons at the Q…
* First an opinion: No one has definitively said this, but I’m getting the sense Andrew Bynum could return to the court for the season opener Oct. 30 against the Brooklyn Nets in a limited role. If not in time for the opener, soon after.
* Of course, that’s assuming Bynum doesn’t suffer any setbacks. He hasn’t yet. The Cavs keep giving Bynum guideposts in his recovery and he keeps hitting them. Team personnel seemed pleased to sort of show him off to the media Wednesday by allowing him to play in a 3 on 3, half-court scrimmage in front of reporters. I wasn’t there (smashed up the car driving home from Tuesday’s game in Canton, took the day to talk to 147 people from the insurance company) but from all accounts, Bynum looked great. He's down to his playing weight, as I wrote during the game, so the last step seems to be a return to practice.
* The Cavs have internally discussed the merits of playing him in the preseason, but that seems unlikely. Their last home game is Saturday night and he won’t be ready by then. After that, they’re in Columbus and Cincinnati for games next week, then fly from Cincinnati to Charlotte for the preseason finale. The overwhelming belief seems to be that Bynum is better served to remain in Cleveland for treatment and more work rather than waste three days away from the facility just for a few minutes in a preseason game. If the Cavs had a home preseason game closer to the start of the season, I think there would be a greater chance Bynum could make an appearance. Instead, his debut will likely come when the games matter.
* He’ll obviously be rusty, no matter when he returns. But the belief within the team is he can still have a major impact on a game even if he starts slowly and only plays 15 minutes.
* As Mike Brown said tonight, there isn’t much of a difference between the 3 on 3 half-court game he played on Wednesday and a full-scale 5 on 5 practice. But Greg Oden has already illustrated how fragile this situation is. Oden is trying to come back with the Miami Heat after missing four years, and he already had to temporarily shut it down because of swelling in his surgically-repaired knee.
* Even if Bynum makes it back for the start of the season or early November, there is no guarantee he lasts the entire season without incident. His knees could flare up at any moment.
* With that out of the way, onto the game itself.
* Shortly after the draft, a member of the Cavs organization told me Mike Brown would want to send Sergey Karasev to the D-League at the start of camp and would want to start him at small forward by the end of October. Brown never reached either of those extremes, but it’s obvious Brown is high on Karasev and it’s easy to see why.
* Brown said the veterans will get all the opportunities at the start of the season and rookies like Karasev and Carrick Felix would really have to wow him to crack the rotation.
* Neither Earl Clark nor Alonzo Gee have been exemplary at small forward (although Clark had his best game yet there on Thursday), but it doesn’t matter because Brown views Karasev as more of a shooting guard than small forward.
* The positions are similar, but Brown doesn’t want Karasev trying to guard some of the bigger small forwards. Brown joked with Karasev during practice Thursday morning that he only weighed about 155 pounds. Karasev, not quite yet a master of the language and still learning Brown’s humor, didn’t get that it was a joke and he tried correcting Brown with his actual weight.
* Brown put the players through a Godfather-length film session on Wednesday. He said it included 70 plays from Tuesday’s loss to the Bobcats and was so long, even he started to doze off.
* Among the plays Brown included was Gee’s terrible shot over a double team and Clark’s extensive dribbling toward nowhere. Only hours earlier, Brown said he wanted his small forwards to take good shots when open and not spend too much time dribbling and trying to create for themselves, yet that’s precisely what both Gee and Clark violated.
* Even after Brown pointed out to Clark what he didn’t like on film, Clark doesn’t seem to be backing down. “A small forward has to dribble the ball in my eyes,” Clark said. “What you want me to do? Just stand in the corner and be a power forward? Then I’ll play power forward. I’m just going to play the game and take whatever comes to me. I understand what he’s saying, he doesn’t want me to overdribble … but sometimes you have to be aggressive and make plays for your teammates.”
* Clark had 10 points and four rebounds against the Pistons after struggling miserably with his shot through the first three preseason games, but he was never worried about his awful shooting percentage and said he just needed to stop thinking so much. “The first couple games, I was thinking about the plays, thinking about making other people happy,” he said before the game. “You just have to go out there and play basketball.”
* Gee and Clark are battling for the starting spot, but the loser is probably out of the rotation entirely. Brown said the other night he’d like a 10-man rotation during the season, but only using nine is more likely. Ignoring Bynum for a moment, the Cavs still have Kyrie Irving, Dion Waiters, Clark, Tristan Thompson, Anderson Varejao, Jarrett Jack, Gee, C.J. Miles, Anthony Bennett and Tyler Zeller. That’s 10 guys for nine spots. Gee and Clark are a little too similar, and Miles is needed for his shooting ability off the bench. That means the loser could be out of Brown’s rotation entirely. And if/when Bynum is healthy enough to play, Zeller’s minutes will be chopped.
[/COLOR]
Cavs 96, Pistons 84: final thoughts (part 1)
By JASON LLOYD Published: October 18, 2013
CLEVELAND: Final thoughts following a preseason win over the Detroit Pistons at the Q…
* First an opinion: No one has definitively said this, but I’m getting the sense Andrew Bynum could return to the court for the season opener Oct. 30 against the Brooklyn Nets in a limited role. If not in time for the opener, soon after.
* Of course, that’s assuming Bynum doesn’t suffer any setbacks. He hasn’t yet. The Cavs keep giving Bynum guideposts in his recovery and he keeps hitting them. Team personnel seemed pleased to sort of show him off to the media Wednesday by allowing him to play in a 3 on 3, half-court scrimmage in front of reporters. I wasn’t there (smashed up the car driving home from Tuesday’s game in Canton, took the day to talk to 147 people from the insurance company) but from all accounts, Bynum looked great. He's down to his playing weight, as I wrote during the game, so the last step seems to be a return to practice.
* The Cavs have internally discussed the merits of playing him in the preseason, but that seems unlikely. Their last home game is Saturday night and he won’t be ready by then. After that, they’re in Columbus and Cincinnati for games next week, then fly from Cincinnati to Charlotte for the preseason finale. The overwhelming belief seems to be that Bynum is better served to remain in Cleveland for treatment and more work rather than waste three days away from the facility just for a few minutes in a preseason game. If the Cavs had a home preseason game closer to the start of the season, I think there would be a greater chance Bynum could make an appearance. Instead, his debut will likely come when the games matter.
* He’ll obviously be rusty, no matter when he returns. But the belief within the team is he can still have a major impact on a game even if he starts slowly and only plays 15 minutes.
* As Mike Brown said tonight, there isn’t much of a difference between the 3 on 3 half-court game he played on Wednesday and a full-scale 5 on 5 practice. But Greg Oden has already illustrated how fragile this situation is. Oden is trying to come back with the Miami Heat after missing four years, and he already had to temporarily shut it down because of swelling in his surgically-repaired knee.
* Even if Bynum makes it back for the start of the season or early November, there is no guarantee he lasts the entire season without incident. His knees could flare up at any moment.
* With that out of the way, onto the game itself.
* Shortly after the draft, a member of the Cavs organization told me Mike Brown would want to send Sergey Karasev to the D-League at the start of camp and would want to start him at small forward by the end of October. Brown never reached either of those extremes, but it’s obvious Brown is high on Karasev and it’s easy to see why.
* Brown said the veterans will get all the opportunities at the start of the season and rookies like Karasev and Carrick Felix would really have to wow him to crack the rotation.
* Neither Earl Clark nor Alonzo Gee have been exemplary at small forward (although Clark had his best game yet there on Thursday), but it doesn’t matter because Brown views Karasev as more of a shooting guard than small forward.
* The positions are similar, but Brown doesn’t want Karasev trying to guard some of the bigger small forwards. Brown joked with Karasev during practice Thursday morning that he only weighed about 155 pounds. Karasev, not quite yet a master of the language and still learning Brown’s humor, didn’t get that it was a joke and he tried correcting Brown with his actual weight.
* Brown put the players through a Godfather-length film session on Wednesday. He said it included 70 plays from Tuesday’s loss to the Bobcats and was so long, even he started to doze off.
* Among the plays Brown included was Gee’s terrible shot over a double team and Clark’s extensive dribbling toward nowhere. Only hours earlier, Brown said he wanted his small forwards to take good shots when open and not spend too much time dribbling and trying to create for themselves, yet that’s precisely what both Gee and Clark violated.
* Even after Brown pointed out to Clark what he didn’t like on film, Clark doesn’t seem to be backing down. “A small forward has to dribble the ball in my eyes,” Clark said. “What you want me to do? Just stand in the corner and be a power forward? Then I’ll play power forward. I’m just going to play the game and take whatever comes to me. I understand what he’s saying, he doesn’t want me to overdribble … but sometimes you have to be aggressive and make plays for your teammates.”
* Clark had 10 points and four rebounds against the Pistons after struggling miserably with his shot through the first three preseason games, but he was never worried about his awful shooting percentage and said he just needed to stop thinking so much. “The first couple games, I was thinking about the plays, thinking about making other people happy,” he said before the game. “You just have to go out there and play basketball.”
* Gee and Clark are battling for the starting spot, but the loser is probably out of the rotation entirely. Brown said the other night he’d like a 10-man rotation during the season, but only using nine is more likely. Ignoring Bynum for a moment, the Cavs still have Kyrie Irving, Dion Waiters, Clark, Tristan Thompson, Anderson Varejao, Jarrett Jack, Gee, C.J. Miles, Anthony Bennett and Tyler Zeller. That’s 10 guys for nine spots. Gee and Clark are a little too similar, and Miles is needed for his shooting ability off the bench. That means the loser could be out of Brown’s rotation entirely. And if/when Bynum is healthy enough to play, Zeller’s minutes will be chopped.
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[h=1]Cavs 96, Pistons 84: final thoughts (part 2)[/h]By JASON LLOYD Published: October 18, 2013
Maybe this is where Mike Brown is telling Kyrie Irving that Jarrett Jack tied his sneakers together, not Anthony Bennett. (AP Photo/Mark Duncan)
CLEVELAND: More final thoughts (I mean it this time) following a Cavs win...
* Mike Brown sort of slipped prior to the game when he revealed Anthony Bennett has sleep apnea. The Cavs diagnosed him with it over the summer and gave him a CPAP mask to wear at night. “It’s just something I have to get adjusted to because I never knew I had it before,” Bennett said. “I just found out.”
* Bennett took a sleep test for the team after he was drafted and that’s how it was diagnosed. Bennett was trying to keep it a secret. “This is something I have to take day by day,” he said. “I just started using it, so it’s not going to work right away. I just have to get a routine and keep using it.”
* Bennett already was diagnosed with asthma and Brown revealed he, too, has sleep apnea. ""We have a couple guys who may have it," Brown said. "I think it’s a common thing. It’s not that big of a deal."
* The Cavs have been hit hard with injuries during training camp, but the good news is none of them seem overly serious. Jarrett Jack said the tendonitis in his knee is already feeling better and if this were the regular season, “you wouldn’t even know about it.” That, of course, means he could play through it. But at this point, why bother? Jack doesn’t have any real history of knee problems, so no one is overly concerned.
* Dion Waiters said he landed on his hip during Tuesday’s preseason game. I noticed Waiters rubbing his hip as he ran up and down the floor, but didn’t think much of it because Waiters … to be polite … has the reputation as being a bit of a hypochondriac with the injuries. (He went for an MRI after a game last year -- I think in Phoenix -- and even before the exam, former trainer Max Benton was standing behind him and mouthed to me “he’s fine.” This hip issue shouldn’t keep Waiters out long.
* C.J. Miles was complaining about pain in his leg prior to Thursday’s game, then was a late scratch. The leg has been bothering him for a couple days, then he got kicked in the sore spot during Tuesday’s game. He shouldn’t be out long.
* Jermaine Taylor took full advantage of Miles’ absence Thursday, scoring 10 points in the fourth quarter and finishing with 15 points and three assists for the game. Brown likes Taylor, but I just don’t see where he fits on this team.
* The Cavs have two open roster spots, but they need a third point guard (Matthew Dellavedova) and another big (my guess is Henry Sims). Kyrie Irving’s injury history makes carrying a third point guard almost a necessity, particularly since Brown is committed to keeping Waiters strictly a shooting guard this season. Taylor has played some point in the past, but that’s not his spot. He’s a wing, but the Cavs are already so deep there that Sergey Karasev and Carrick Felix are going to struggle ever seeing the floor.
* Taylor has shown enough this preseason to get another chance elsewhere, but it likely won’t be here. He’d have to beat out “Delly” for a roster spot and I just don’t see that happening.
* Brown was quick to point out Simshad 10 rebounds in 20 minutes. Brown has said throughout camp that Sims’ production doesn’t always show up in box scores because his role is to defend the pick-and-roll, box out and play tough defense inside. If everyone is healthy – or even if two-thirds of the trio of Andrew Bynum, Anderson Varejao and Tyler Zeller are healthy – Sims’ minutes will probably come in Canton.
* Speaking of Varejao, this was the first night I thought Andy looked like Andy. Brown gave him a couple of days off to rest his legs as he continues to work his way back following a blood clot, and the time off was noticeable. He had 10 points and 11 rebounds in 24 minutes and was his old, active self again.
* Teams are already starting to cut players, but the Cavs still need practice bodies. That’s why guys like DeSagana Diop, Michael Lee and Elliot Williams (who have little to no chance of making the final roster) are still in camp.
* A new rule went into effect last year that allows teams to protect their final three camp cuts from the D-League draft. Essentially, the final three cuts off a team’s training camp roster can be placed directly on that team’s Development League roster (after the player clears waivers, of course).
* The Cavs used this strategy last year when they claimed former Cleveland State product D’Aundray Brown late in camp even though they had no intention of keeping him on the final roster. They just liked him enough to put him on the Canton Charge roster. Similarly, the Portland Trail Blazers claimed Justin Holiday off waivers last year after the Cavs released him so they could put him on their D-League affiliate. The whole process adds a little strategy to camp cuts. I’d expect two of the Cavs’ final three cuts to be Kenny Kadji and Taylor. The team is high on both guys and could retain D-League rights to both, meaning they could play for the Charge even though they’d be considered NBA free agents.
* Finally, Jack pulled a pretty good prank on Kyrie Irving prior to Thursday’s game, but it’s a secret, so you can’t tell anyone. See, Irving hid Bennett’s sneakers during the morning shootaround at Cleveland Clinic Courts. So when Irving arrived at the Q for Thursday’s game and tried to put his game shoes on, the laces were tied together in knots. Irving immediately thought it was Bennett, who was nowhere to be found … but it was actually Jack. Bennett and Jack each has a locker next to Irving. Jack was in the middle of doing an interview with the Associated Press’ Tom Withers while Irving was filling me in on the prank war. “It’s OK. His is coming,” Irving told me. Then after Kyrie left the locker room, Jack cracked up and let us in on the secret. He was the culprit. “(Bennett) won’t have any idea why Kyrie is coming for him,” Jack said. Remember, it’s a secret. Don’t tell anyone.
* Jack has some ninja spy qualities to him. While filming a bit with a Fox Sports Ohio television crew, Jack broke into assistant coach Jamahl Mosley's office and ... rearranged some things. He scattered papers around, opened Mosley's giant bottle of water and quickly left before he was caught. Mosley had no idea who was messing with him until he watched the segment air on the scoreboard during a timeout the other night.
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View Larger Version [COLOR=#A80D18 !important]>>
CLEVELAND: More final thoughts (I mean it this time) following a Cavs win...
* Mike Brown sort of slipped prior to the game when he revealed Anthony Bennett has sleep apnea. The Cavs diagnosed him with it over the summer and gave him a CPAP mask to wear at night. “It’s just something I have to get adjusted to because I never knew I had it before,” Bennett said. “I just found out.”
* Bennett took a sleep test for the team after he was drafted and that’s how it was diagnosed. Bennett was trying to keep it a secret. “This is something I have to take day by day,” he said. “I just started using it, so it’s not going to work right away. I just have to get a routine and keep using it.”
* Bennett already was diagnosed with asthma and Brown revealed he, too, has sleep apnea. ""We have a couple guys who may have it," Brown said. "I think it’s a common thing. It’s not that big of a deal."
* The Cavs have been hit hard with injuries during training camp, but the good news is none of them seem overly serious. Jarrett Jack said the tendonitis in his knee is already feeling better and if this were the regular season, “you wouldn’t even know about it.” That, of course, means he could play through it. But at this point, why bother? Jack doesn’t have any real history of knee problems, so no one is overly concerned.
* Dion Waiters said he landed on his hip during Tuesday’s preseason game. I noticed Waiters rubbing his hip as he ran up and down the floor, but didn’t think much of it because Waiters … to be polite … has the reputation as being a bit of a hypochondriac with the injuries. (He went for an MRI after a game last year -- I think in Phoenix -- and even before the exam, former trainer Max Benton was standing behind him and mouthed to me “he’s fine.” This hip issue shouldn’t keep Waiters out long.
* C.J. Miles was complaining about pain in his leg prior to Thursday’s game, then was a late scratch. The leg has been bothering him for a couple days, then he got kicked in the sore spot during Tuesday’s game. He shouldn’t be out long.
* Jermaine Taylor took full advantage of Miles’ absence Thursday, scoring 10 points in the fourth quarter and finishing with 15 points and three assists for the game. Brown likes Taylor, but I just don’t see where he fits on this team.
* The Cavs have two open roster spots, but they need a third point guard (Matthew Dellavedova) and another big (my guess is Henry Sims). Kyrie Irving’s injury history makes carrying a third point guard almost a necessity, particularly since Brown is committed to keeping Waiters strictly a shooting guard this season. Taylor has played some point in the past, but that’s not his spot. He’s a wing, but the Cavs are already so deep there that Sergey Karasev and Carrick Felix are going to struggle ever seeing the floor.
* Taylor has shown enough this preseason to get another chance elsewhere, but it likely won’t be here. He’d have to beat out “Delly” for a roster spot and I just don’t see that happening.
* Brown was quick to point out Simshad 10 rebounds in 20 minutes. Brown has said throughout camp that Sims’ production doesn’t always show up in box scores because his role is to defend the pick-and-roll, box out and play tough defense inside. If everyone is healthy – or even if two-thirds of the trio of Andrew Bynum, Anderson Varejao and Tyler Zeller are healthy – Sims’ minutes will probably come in Canton.
* Speaking of Varejao, this was the first night I thought Andy looked like Andy. Brown gave him a couple of days off to rest his legs as he continues to work his way back following a blood clot, and the time off was noticeable. He had 10 points and 11 rebounds in 24 minutes and was his old, active self again.
* Teams are already starting to cut players, but the Cavs still need practice bodies. That’s why guys like DeSagana Diop, Michael Lee and Elliot Williams (who have little to no chance of making the final roster) are still in camp.
* A new rule went into effect last year that allows teams to protect their final three camp cuts from the D-League draft. Essentially, the final three cuts off a team’s training camp roster can be placed directly on that team’s Development League roster (after the player clears waivers, of course).
* The Cavs used this strategy last year when they claimed former Cleveland State product D’Aundray Brown late in camp even though they had no intention of keeping him on the final roster. They just liked him enough to put him on the Canton Charge roster. Similarly, the Portland Trail Blazers claimed Justin Holiday off waivers last year after the Cavs released him so they could put him on their D-League affiliate. The whole process adds a little strategy to camp cuts. I’d expect two of the Cavs’ final three cuts to be Kenny Kadji and Taylor. The team is high on both guys and could retain D-League rights to both, meaning they could play for the Charge even though they’d be considered NBA free agents.
* Finally, Jack pulled a pretty good prank on Kyrie Irving prior to Thursday’s game, but it’s a secret, so you can’t tell anyone. See, Irving hid Bennett’s sneakers during the morning shootaround at Cleveland Clinic Courts. So when Irving arrived at the Q for Thursday’s game and tried to put his game shoes on, the laces were tied together in knots. Irving immediately thought it was Bennett, who was nowhere to be found … but it was actually Jack. Bennett and Jack each has a locker next to Irving. Jack was in the middle of doing an interview with the Associated Press’ Tom Withers while Irving was filling me in on the prank war. “It’s OK. His is coming,” Irving told me. Then after Kyrie left the locker room, Jack cracked up and let us in on the secret. He was the culprit. “(Bennett) won’t have any idea why Kyrie is coming for him,” Jack said. Remember, it’s a secret. Don’t tell anyone.
* Jack has some ninja spy qualities to him. While filming a bit with a Fox Sports Ohio television crew, Jack broke into assistant coach Jamahl Mosley's office and ... rearranged some things. He scattered papers around, opened Mosley's giant bottle of water and quickly left before he was caught. Mosley had no idea who was messing with him until he watched the segment air on the scoreboard during a timeout the other night.
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It would be cool if Lloyd publishes these sorts of post-game blogs on a regular basis. That was one of the more enjoyable things that Windhorst decided to do his final year or two in Cleveland.