Cleveland Browns Quarterback Position

[AZ_]

I consider Dak Prescott a good example of why an elite running back makes a rookie quarterback's transition a whole lot easier.

Don't forget the elite offensive line he played behind either...

Would have been a nice addition for Bortles as well, instead of blaming the spread offense he played in.

Which was kind of my point.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Would you prefer Derek Carr or Marcus Mariota, then?

Carr had a lot of exposure to drop back system early on at Fresno, but then DeRuyter came in with a spread attack. Carr also had the advantage of a pro quarterback in his brother helping him with the mechanics of his position.

I'm fascinated by Mariota's development, can't say I'm following it as closely as Carr's. Seems like he was a running QB tailor-made for the college game who has taken very well to all the coaching to become a dropback passer.

I'm not saying all college quarterbacks are fucked, just that they are forced to learn important footwork and mechanics of their position too late compared to other positions, like the defensive side of the field.

 

[Los216]

Would have been a nice addition for Bortles as well, instead of blaming the spread offense he played in.

Which was kind of my point.

One of the reason they have been linked to Fournette.

 

[AZ_]

Carr had a lot of exposure to drop back system early on at Fresno, but then DeRuyter came in with a spread attack. Carr also had the advantage of a pro quarterback in his brother helping him with the mechanics of his position.

I'm fascinated by Mariota's development, can't say I'm following it as closely as Carr's. Seems like he was a running QB tailor-made for the college game who has taken very well to all the coaching to become a dropback passer.

I'm not saying all college quarterbacks are fucked, just that they are forced to learn important footwork and mechanics of their position too late compared to other positions, like the defensive side of the field.

Learning footwork isn't limited to the type of offense a player runs.

Jared Goff has had the best footwork of anyone in the draft since Peyton Manning, but he's going to struggle if he's throwing to a bunch of jamokes and is being led by an offensive coordinator who is working at Chili's now.


You're seeing more and more spread guys come in and have success, the "spread" as we know it in college is far more pro-style than it used to be and that's a big part of the reason why guys like Prescott, Carr, Mariota and others have found success in addition to where/how they're developed.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Learning footwork isn't limited to the type of offense a player runs.

Jared Goff has had the best footwork of anyone in the draft since Peyton Manning, but he's going to struggle if he's throwing to a bunch of jamokes and is being led by an offensive coordinator who is working at Chili's now.


You're seeing more and more spread guys come in and have success, the "spread" as we know it in college is far more pro-style than it used to be and that's a big part of the reason why guys like Prescott, Carr, Mariota and others have found success in addition to where/how they're developed.

I'm trying to get some work done on the day of the first round... So obviously all I've accomplished is deep dives into the past decade of the draft. Thanks bro!



I did it to myself, goddamn it.

Anyway, Fisher had an affinity to the Dave Wannstedt coaching tree, and his offense always mirrors some out-of-date dinosaur like Dave Wannstedt. People rush to judgement too quickly in pro sports in general. Goff is far from screwed long-term... but did you watch his play with the Rams? He had some supporting cast disasters, especially on the line, but he wasn't ready to start period.

 

[Triplethreat]

I'm trying to get some work done on the day of the first round... So obviously all I've accomplished is deep dives into the past decade of the draft. Thanks bro!



I did it to myself, goddamn it.

Anyway, Fisher had an affinity to the Dave Wannstedt coaching tree, and his offense always mirrors some out-of-date dinosaur like Dave Wannstedt. People rush to judgement too quickly in pro sports in general. Goff is far from screwed long-term... but did you watch his play with the Rams? He had some supporting cast disasters, especially on the line, but he wasn't ready to start period.

It says a lot that he didn't even DRESS the first game of the year. Goff is a project at this point.

 

[AZ_]

I'm trying to get some work done on the day of the first round... So obviously all I've accomplished is deep dives into the past decade of the draft. Thanks bro!



I did it to myself, goddamn it.

Anyway, Fisher had an affinity to the Dave Wannstedt coaching tree, and his offense always mirrors some out-of-date dinosaur like Dave Wannstedt. People rush to judgement too quickly in pro sports in general. Goff is far from screwed long-term... but did you watch his play with the Rams? He had some supporting cast disasters, especially on the line, but he wasn't ready to start period.

But why should I believe it was the spread offense's fault in college for such a notion?

I would argue it was the supporting cast, over-complicated offensive system and the coaching prowess of (and I had to look up his name) Rob Boras.

 

[Randolphkeys]

But why should I believe it was the spread offense's fault in college for such a notion?

I would argue it was the supporting cast, over-complicated offensive system and the coaching prowess of (and I had to look up his name) Rob Boras.

There's just so little to base a Goff discussion on. I watched him a lot at Cal and he made great reads from the pocket, he was under center quite a bit... then he looked awful in the preseason game I watched for the Rams, and I only watched one half of a regular season Rams game and he was still struggling. I like Davis Webb if he ends up lasting through the top half of the third round because Cal did work some pro style into their offense, but Webb has more to work on than Goff did at this time last year. Air Raid has a lot of prescripted plays that are almost hand-offs which rack up big completion percentages and yards without reading the defense post-snap.

Tangent: I'm intrigued to see what Tedford does in Fresno State. He always trained the Cal offense well in a pro style offense, and that part of California loves football. Dark horse program again.

 

[CosmoKramer]

Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes, Webb, and Kizer (every one of the top five QB prospects this year) basically all operated out of the shotgun in spread systems.

Sam Darnold is the next best thing and USC instilled a bunch of spread principles and zone reads for him last season.

Considering 90+% of QB prospects are coming from spread systems nowadays I don't see how this is still a discussion.

 

[Los216]

Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes, Webb, and Kizer (every one of the top five QB prospects this year) basically all operated out of the shotgun in spread systems.

Sam Darnold is the next best thing and USC instilled a bunch of spread principles and zone reads for him last season.

Considering 90+% of QB prospects are coming from spread systems nowadays I don't see how this is still a discussion.

I can't find it right now but someone posted on twitter yesterday how much more the NFL runs shotgun now compared to 10 years ago. Running plays from shotgun is up 40% since then. If I find it I'll post it.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes, Webb, and Kizer (every one of the top five QB prospects this year) basically all operated out of the shotgun in spread systems.

Sam Darnold is the next best thing and USC instilled a bunch of spread principles and zone reads for him last season.

Considering 90+% of QB prospects are coming from spread systems nowadays I don't see how this is still a discussion.

It came up because we were discussing Bortles and whether he is salvagable. He might be because he appeared close to NFL ready a few years ago, he has some things to work on. It seems like almost all of the prospects in the draft do. We also haven't seen a really good quarterback class since 2004. We can discuss the obvious about preparation for the pros on offense or ignore it.

 

[CosmoKramer]

I can't find it right now but someone posted on twitter yesterday how much more the NFL runs shotgun now compared to 10 years ago. Running plays from shotgun is up 40% since then. If I find it I'll post it.

I just read a PFF article from four years ago saying teams run 3 WR sets about 50% of their offensive snaps. I'd imagine that number, and snaps from all shotgun formations, has only gone up. If you can find that link that'd be great.

It came up because we were discussing Bortles and whether he is salvagable. He might be because he appeared close to NFL ready a few years ago, he has some things to work on. It seems like almost all of the prospects in the draft do. We also haven't seen a really good quarterback class since 2004. We can discuss the obvious about preparation for the pros on offense or ignore it.

Just a guess, but for a QB whisperer like Hue I bet he'd love to get his hands on Bortles. I don't know if I'd be willing to trade anything more than a midround pick for a guy on an expiring contract, but the arm talent and ability to extend plays is there in spades.

 

[Lee]

Carr had a lot of exposure to drop back system early on at Fresno, but then DeRuyter came in with a spread attack. Carr also had the advantage of a pro quarterback in his brother helping him with the mechanics of his position.

I'm fascinated by Mariota's development, can't say I'm following it as closely as Carr's. Seems like he was a running QB tailor-made for the college game who has taken very well to all the coaching to become a dropback passer.

I'm not saying all college quarterbacks are fucked, just that they are forced to learn important footwork and mechanics of their position too late compared to other positions, like the defensive side of the field.

Cam Newton another spread QB doing well.

I used to agree with you on the spread QB's, but too many are doing well now. Most top QB's any more coming out of high school seem to go to a school that runs a spread or almost exclusively out of the shot gun.

PS, Drew Brees was a spread QB too.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Cam Newton another spread QB doing well.

I used to agree with you on the spread QB's, but too many are doing well now. Most top QB's any more coming out of high school seem to go to a school that runs a spread or almost exclusively out of the shot gun.

PS, Drew Brees was a spread QB too.

...but how many highly touted spread QBs fail compared to the few who make it? That's the problem. It's still a good thing that NFL scouts have caught on and fewer QBs who stack up tons of yards without the skills squeak into the first two rounds.

 

[Lee]

...but how many highly touted spread QBs fail compared to the few who make it? That's the problem.

Over the last 10 years? I would bet the same amount who fail coming out of a pro offense.

Its really about mechanics, arm strength and ability to read a defense.