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Game Thread | Game #15 | Hornets @ Cavs | Nov. 18, 2022

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Hope they know what they're doing. Demoting LeVert is bad for morale, he has done everything the team asked of him. He got the bigs involved and was responsible for much of the team's ball movement (leads team in secondary assists). If we start seeing our guards walk the ball up and not involve the bigs, this team will be worse.
 
Rozier going off is almost guaranteed
 
If we don't come out motivated to get it done tonight, we might have a problem.
 
Jscc said:
Hope they know what they're doing. Demoting LeVert is bad for morale, he has done everything the team asked of him. He got the bigs involved and was responsible for much of the team's ball movement (leads team in secondary assists). If we start seeing our guards walk the ball up and not involve the bigs, this team will be worse.
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I think it's more a matter of having Garland, Mitchell, and LeVert on the court together doesn't give them enough physicality.

Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen is a -9.3 points per 100 possessions. But what happens when one of the guards is replaced by a forward?

Mitchell, LeVert, Wade, Mobley, and Allen is a +24.5 in 105 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Mobley, and Allen is a +25.8 in 66 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Love, Wade, and Allen is a +73.1 in 36 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Love, and Allen is a +29.1 in 25 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Wade, and Allen is a +51.1 in 24 possessions.

But with three guards...

Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Stevens, and Mobley is a -16.1.
Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Love, and Allen is a -12.5.
Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen is a -9.3 (212 possessions).

The Garland/Mitchell/LeVert threesome isn't working no matter who the other two players are.

It seems clear that units with two guards, two forwards, and a center are working really well, whereas our most used unit of three guards, one forward, and one center is not horrible, but is getting outscored by about 9 points per game.

Unfortunately, Wade is out so they are going with the next closest thing - Stevens. We'll see how it works out and if JBB is going to stick with Stevens for a while to get a valid sample or whether this is just to give us more bulk until Allen gets back. The Cavs were killed on the glass against Milwaukee.
 
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Wham with the Right Hand said:
I think it's more a matter of having Garland, Mitchell, and LeVert on the court together doesn't give them enough physicality.

Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen is a -9.3 points per 100 possessions. But what happens when one of the guards is replaced by a forward?

Mitchell, LeVert, Wade, Mobley, and Allen is a +24.5 in 105 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Mobley, and Allen is a +25.8 in 66 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Love, Wade, and Allen is a +73.1 in 36 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Love, and Allen is a +29.1 in 25 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Wade, and Allen is a +51.1 in 24 possessions.

But with three guards...

Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Stevens, and Mobley is a -16.1.
Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Love, and Allen is a -12.5.
Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen is a -9.3 (212 possessions).

The Garland/Mitchell/LeVert threesome isn't working no matter who the other two players are.

It seems clear that units with two guards, two forwards, and a center are working really well, whereas our most used unit of three guards, one forward, and one center is not horrible, but is getting outscored by about 9 points per game.

Unfortunately, Wade is out so they are going with the next closest thing - Stevens. We'll see how it works out and if JBB is going to stick with Stevens for a while to get a valid sample or whether this is just to give us more bulk until Allen gets back. The Cavs were killed on the glass against Milwaukee.
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I thought Allen is playing tonight.
 
Wham with the Right Hand said:
I think it's more a matter of having Garland, Mitchell, and LeVert on the court together doesn't give them enough physicality.

Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen is a -9.3 points per 100 possessions. But what happens when one of the guards is replaced by a forward?

Mitchell, LeVert, Wade, Mobley, and Allen is a +24.5 in 105 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Mobley, and Allen is a +25.8 in 66 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Love, Wade, and Allen is a +73.1 in 36 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Love, and Allen is a +29.1 in 25 possessions.
Mitchell, LeVert, Osman, Wade, and Allen is a +51.1 in 24 possessions.

But with three guards...

Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Stevens, and Mobley is a -16.1.
Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Love, and Allen is a -12.5.
Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen is a -9.3 (212 possessions).

The Garland/Mitchell/LeVert threesome isn't working no matter who the other two players are.

It seems clear that units with two guards, two forwards, and a center are working really well, whereas our most used unit of three guards, one forward, and one center is not horrible, but is getting outscored by about 9 points per game.

Unfortunately, Wade is out so they are going with the next closest thing - Stevens. We'll see how it works out and if JBB is going to stick with Stevens for a while to get a valid sample or whether this is just to give us more bulk until Allen gets back. The Cavs were killed on the glass against Milwaukee.
Click to expand...

Well I hope you are right Wham. The numbers look good, but I am apprehensive about a quick fix.
 
Levert with Mitchland was always a disaster in waiting.
 
I think LeVert needs his own space.

Hasn't been nearly as effective with Garland in that lineup.


But I'm nervous this still doesn't fix the Garland+Mitchell pairing.
 
Rich said:
I think LeVert needs his own space.

Hasn't been nearly as effective with Garland in that lineup.


But I'm nervous this still doesn't fix the Garland+Mitchell pairing.
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Garland & Mitchell are elite offensive players who require high usage. Neither is any good at defense. To get the most out of what they do well on offense, we need a 3 who spaces the floor, but is very low usage - someone who the defense has to honor, but not someone who keeps the ball away from Garland/Mitchell. That person also needs to be at least above average on defense to help cover their deficiencies. Its why Wade works. He's not necessarily a better player than some of the other guys, but he has the skillset and the mentality we need. We've seen it for 3 years now. It doesn't show in the stat sheet a lot of the time, but we usually play better when he plays.
 
Rich said:
I think LeVert needs his own space.

Hasn't been nearly as effective with Garland in that lineup.


But I'm nervous this still doesn't fix the Garland+Mitchell pairing.
Click to expand...
Wade is the only guy that works. But he’s never shown he can stay healthy.
 
Also beyond the stuff mentioned, Hornets have a bunch of players that should probably be available within the next couple weeks that could help the Cavs. I would imagine just about anyone on the roster is available aside from Ball.

I’d think guys like McDaniels, Jones, Plumlee, and maybe Washington could come available if they’re dumping Rozier or Hayward.
 
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