Maggette and Jackson want out of Golden State

[Sir Charles Barkley]

What are the tradeoffs between Stephen Jackson and Gerald Wallace? Both seem to be fairly similar players, and both seem to be available?

They are both great defenders and primarily score off the drive. They are both subpar jumpshooters, which hurts our ability to spread the floor. Jackson is a slightly better 3PT shooter (.338 to .299), but neither are going to earn their money in that respect. Wallace is a much better rebounder, and Jackson is a much better passer. Wallace tends to be a generally more efficient scorer (TS% of 56.5 to 48.5 last year).

Wallace is 4 years younger and has one year less on his deal, but makes about a million more per year. Wallace also has a history of injury troubles.

That's what I see by glancing at them, based on the info, I'd prefer Wallace if both can be had for a similar price. What do yous see, and who would you take?

~Lyuokdea

Don't let Captain Jack's percentages fool you. He is a wayyyyyyyyyyy better shooter than G force. His percentages are bad because he plays in GS where they shoot for fun.

 

[Zone]

Pretty sure that there was a rumor earlier this summer of Captain Jack for Snow and a #1. I think it came from a poster named Rowell on the RealGM or Hoopshype boards. But this was before Jackson signed his contract extension.

What does everybody think about Jackson's defense? I've seen opinions on both sides.

Also, can someone please merge or delete the thread I started about the same topic? This hotels 56k internet hookup is bunk. Thanks in advance and happy holidays.

 

[Smooth]

No way would we be interested in Maggette... I believe we were rumored to be over the off-season but I don't think we'll be interested in him now that he's owed $48 million over the next 5 years... He's not the type of guy that I think Ferry would be willing to pay past 2010, with what we stand to gain/lose that off-season... Not only that but Maggette doesn't defend, can't shoot, is a selfish player, doesn't understand the team concept and is always hurt... I don't think we'll be looking into him..

SJax certainly is a guy that could fit in but he's not worth nearly $42.5 million over 5 years.. Especially not for a guy who's a career role player and will turn 31 in April...

Don't let Captain Jack's percentages fool you. He is a wayyyyyyyyyyy better shooter than G force. His percentages are bad because he plays in GS where they shoot for fun.

???

Have you ever looked at SJax's shooting percentages? He's a career 41.6% shooter from the field and 33.8% shooter from 3... He's never been an efficient shooter and never will be.. Even when he was in more structured systems (IND, SAS) he was never a good shooter... So using the 'run and gun' argument isn't going to work.. Plus, usually playing in the run-and-gun systems inflate your stats--not deflate them..

Compared to Gerald Wallace the past 3 seasons:

Wallace
FG% - 50, 45, 46
3PT% - 33, 32, 25
FT% - 69, 73, 78
TS% - 56.8, 54.7, 56.5
eFG% - 48, 49, 52
Jumper eFG% - 36, 41, 42

Jackson
FG% - 43, 41, 38
3PT% - 32, 36, 28
FT% - 81, 83, 78
TS% - 54, 53.6, 48.5
eFG% - 42, 48, 50/47
Jumper eFG% - 36, 44, 44/39

While I certainly agree that SJax is a better shooter, it's not nearly the gap that one would think..

Wallace is much more efficient from the field, while SJax is a better "shooter" (from 3, mid-range and 3)..

 

[sam_slam911]

My opinion of Maggettes totally changed this season. Hes about as selfish a player as you'll get and doesnt do anything to actually influence the otucome of a game.

Jackson is actually someone that could really add some swagger to the team. But to be honest, hes still a huge risk to the team chemsitry. Brown might love him but hes still a big charecter and not exactly a guy that just blends staight into a team with developed chemistry.

And also, D-West is playing so well I really dont wanna replace him at the 2 unless its for a pure SG stud like Joe Johnson or Michael Redd.

Jax cant play the 2 much anymore and definitely cant start there, and Im not sure hed be happy with bein a 6th man, whereas I can see someone like Gerald Wallace relishing the oppurtunity to play the Manu role.

Him and Gerald Wallace are definitely similar options. Both excellent tough defenders, both 3s not 2s, neither are good shooters (though Jax is better from outside), both are great slashers, both bring intangibles that dont count on a stat sheet.

Buth the big differences are that Wallace is an up and coming talent in his mid twenties and Jax is a veteran still maybe in his prime but could easily drop off severely in a year or two. And both are signed for 5 years for alotta paper.

I personally wouldnt risk the contract or the player in S-Jax now that we've developed a great chemistry and young core, UNLESS its a hell of a deal for us.

But Gerald Wallace...wouldnt hesitate to pull the trigger.

 

[Three6Pavia]

My opinion of Maggettes totally changed this season. Hes about as selfish a player as you'll get and doesnt do anything to actually influence the otucome of a game.

Jackson is actually someone that could really add some swagger to the team. But to be honest, hes still a huge risk to the team chemsitry. Brown might love him but hes still a big charecter and not exactly a guy that just blends staight into a team with developed chemistry.

And also, D-West is playing so well I really dont wanna replace him at the 2 unless its for a pure SG stud like Joe Johnson or Michael Redd.

Jax cant play the 2 much anymore and definitely cant start there, and Im not sure hed be happy with bein a 6th man, whereas I can see someone like Gerald Wallace relishing the oppurtunity to play the Manu role.

Him and Gerald Wallace are definitely similar options. Both excellent tough defenders, both 3s not 2s, neither are good shooters (though Jax is better from outside), both are great slashers, both bring intangibles that dont count on a stat sheet.

Buth the big differences are that Wallace is an up and coming talent in his mid twenties and Jax is a veteran still maybe in his prime but could easily drop off severely in a year or two. And both are signed for 5 years for alotta paper.

I personally wouldnt risk the contract or the player in S-Jax now that we've developed a great chemistry and young core, UNLESS its a hell of a deal for us.

But Gerald Wallace...wouldnt hesitate to pull the trigger.

They might not be all that far apart when it comes to drop off considering Wallace is once concussion away from never playing again.

 

[Lyuokdea]

They might not be all that far apart when it comes to drop off considering Wallace is once concussion away from never playing again.

Who exactly has said that? I keep hearing it come up, but nobody here is a neurologist who has examined Wallace, and no neurologist who has examined Wallace has ever said that.

Every player is one concussion away from never playing again, if the concussion is bad enough.

Wallace just happened to have already experienced one bad concussion, and a few minor ones. Everybody who plays in the NBA long enough has a few minor ones. Could be that he's more succceptable than the average player, could be bad luck. I don't even think that the neurologists who examined him could tell you that.

~Lyuokdea

 

[Snowblind]

Dont want Maggette, or S-Jax. Both contracts suck and Im not really that high on them. Im starting to think that the only players that might be available that we can get fairly easy is Mike Miller and Gerald Wallace. Both bring different things to the table, but we can use either one.

Miller will give us better shooting, he also seems like a good person, he also was on the US team in the summer of 07 so Lebron and him could be good friends. There is other things I could list under him, but this thread isnt about him plus im to lazy to write anything else.

Wallace can give us defense through the 1-4 spot. He is an athletic freak and a good rebounder for his size. He is injury prone, not a real good jump shooter, and his contract kinda stinks. He can bring us scoring off the bench along with lock down defense and he is younger than Miller too.

 

[JJ Smooth]

Take note Cavs fans on what happens when you make dumb executive moves and have an unflinching coach. We need to be thankful that we have an executive who doesn't pay up big to role players and a head coach that can bend a bit.

As for the Cavs taking on either of these guys...PASS. There are certainly better assets out there, some of which may become more available towards the deadline.

 

[Maximus]

Maggette I would agree with your opinion. I've heard very much different in regards to Stephen Jackson. Mike Brown has a great admiration and close friendship with him, and Jackson even has Brown as one of his kid's Godfather's I believe.

Wouldn't be surprised if we would, at least, explore what it might take to get Jackson here ... The contract could very well be seen as an issue, though ....

Great admiration? Maybe, but I'd find that to be very surprising...he's just a very bad guy in my opinion. I could rattle off a handful of stories about him, so I'd have to assume Mike Brown has heard 10x as many as I have. I'm guessing their relationship might be similar to my relationship with my cousin. My cousin gets in trouble a lot and just lacks self control when he's drinking. I still bail him out when he's in a jam, give him advice when he seeks it, talk him up to potential employers...I love him. That said, I told my wife I'd divorce her if she invited him over to my party tonight. :chuckles:

 

[PIP]

I never understood why some members here had dreams of Maggette ??

 

[PIP]

No way would we be interested in Maggette... I believe we were rumored to be over the off-season but I don't think we'll be interested in him now that he's owed $48 million over the next 5 years.

Not only that but Maggette doesn't defend, can't shoot, is a selfish player, doesn't understand the team concept and is always hurt... I don't think we'll be looking into him...

Smooth Criminal -

You have the absolute best hindsight posts, my man...:chuckles:

I'd definitely take Corey, I just hope Ferry extends some type of offer that would generate some type of interest on his part... But you never know, he may not be interested in coming here and there's nothing as a GM you can do about that...

I'd definitely be for Maggs... He's probably as good as it's gonna get right now and really it's not too bad... He's a pretty good player and I think someone that's undervalued...

He's a poor shooter but he does shoot efficiently from the field and the line... It's the mid-range game and 3PT shooting (although he did do well last year) that kills him... Although his TS% has always been high (around 58-59% consistently)...

But I'm not too worried with that since that's not what we need necessarily... It'd be a plus if he'd be really good at shooting the ball but the thing that I'm most worried about is whether or not he can create his own shot... He's shown that he can do it and do it pretty well, having a usage rate around 24 or 25 the last few years (tied for 18th last year)...

The thing that I love most about him on offense is that he's a pretty good clutch player and shows up against good competition, which is always important...

People may look at him and say "well he's not a #2 option, he's only averaged 20 points 3 times in his career"... That's very much true but he never got many shot attempts during his career in Los Angeles... Whenever he got around 14 shots a night from the field and 9 or more attempts from the line, he scored over 20 points per night...

Look at all the players who scored at least 20 points per game last year... Only Dwight Howard attempted less field goals than Maggs did (and Maggs was 11th in scoring last year).... He was also tied for 3rd in getting to the line in the 25 scorers (or so)... The other thing that you gotta like is that he was at the bottom of 3PT'ers attempted in the 20-point scorers last year...

So what's my point with all that crap? The guy knows his game and sticks to it... He gets to the line, converts and doesn't try to force his shot from where he knows he's not a good shooter from...

My concern here is that Mike Brown may try to make him into a jump-shooter, like Larry Hughes, and not take advantage of his strengths... Hughes excelled in the open-court, and it looks like it's the same with Maggs as the Clippers were 11th in Pace last year while the Cavs were 22nd...

Defensively, I'm really not that worried about him... Defense isn't really a big deal in my mind at the SG spot... I know it is in Mike Brown's, but I don't think having a great defender at the SG spot is too important... We did fine with Szczerbiak there and I think Maggs is a significant improvement there... I think MB will like Maggs because of how many offensive fouls he draws (37 last year)...

My biggest concern is injuries... He's not getting any younger and injuries usually hit older guys harder then they do younger guys... It's a big concern BUT I am encouraged with him playing in 75 and 70 games the past two years... Throw in playing for a competitive team and maybe we see a guy who plays around 75 games...

It's definitely something to look at but right now any option we look at, their going to be injury prone... Whether it be Maggs, Artest, Wallace, etc., they're all going to be injury prone... And out of all of them I like Maggs the most...

Guys don't freak out over us not rumored to be interested in him... Were we rumored to be interested in Devin Brown, JJ Hickson, Ben Wallace, Wally Szczerbiak, Joe Smith, etc.? Just because we aren't listed by some columnist doesn't mean were not... I think it's more so that the Cavs are a very tight-lipped organization that doesn't let much get out...

The nice thing about this situation is that it's completely realistic... If we can work out a S&T, the Clippers and us match up really well.. The Clippers would likely just trying to get what they can... But if S&T isn't a option, we can always offer the full MLE and hope he wants to be the #2 option here...

If he doesn't come here, then I'd be disappointed in Ferry... But, I'm reserving hope for Ron Artest... I think he brings us the swagger and toughness we need.

I'm just messin with ya... Always enjoy the read...

 

[Gimme Some Mo]

Stephen Jackson is way overrated. No thanks. He just has way too long of a contract for his age.

 

[glockcoma]

I keep hearing everyone talk about S Jack's contract. What are the specs? 5 years for how much $$$$??