The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread (includes spoilers)

[kosis]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I've read that the Stannis scene was written by the two showrunners and was intended for episode one. Scenes on this show get moved around to other episodes constantly. An example is the scene last year where Theon lost his favorite toy. That was in Martin's episode, but Martin commented on the blu-ray release that he didn't write it.

I do agree to an extent that Stannis has been poorly portrayed on the show. In the books he is a dick, but at least he appears to have some redeeming qualities. On the show you get all of the former but almost none of the latter. I'm not a die-hard Stannis fan like some book readers, though, so it largely hasn't bothered me aside from the fact that I think basically all the Dragonstone scenes last season (and the one they've had this season) sucked.

What are these redeeming qualities that Stannis has in the books? Maybe I missed something. He's a rigid character that spares Davos a couple of times just as he does in the show. I think the redemptive stuff that stands out to me is still in the future... stuff that the show will obviously cover later on.

 

[Rich]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I think they've pretty much nailed Stannis. I don't get the sense he loves Melisandre. They've kept his rigidity. As far as him being a fanatic, last night was a perfect example of him just "putting up with it." His wife asks him about 20 times if he saw their spirits, and Stannis said nothing. There you had a clear view of an actual fanatic, his wife, compared to Stannis. One of them is a true believe and one of them isn't.

Also, I stood up for the non-use of spoilers about the episode last night, but freely giving away who committed the act? I think spoilers are appropriate. So let me do this.

If you are interested in not knowing who poisoned Joffrey until it's revealed on the shows, DO NOT READ THE POSTS ABOVE THIS ONE!

 

[CardiacCavs]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I think they've pretty much nailed Stannis. I don't get the sense he loves Melisandre. They've kept his rigidity. As far as him being a fanatic, last night was a perfect example of him just "putting up with it." His wife asks him about 20 times if he saw their spirits, and Stannis said nothing. There you had a clear view of an actual fanatic, his wife, compared to Stannis. One of them is a true believe and one of them isn't.

Also, I stood up for the non-use of spoilers about the episode last night, but freely giving away who committed the act? I think spoilers are appropriate. So let me do this.

If you are interested in not knowing who poisoned Joffrey until it's revealed on the shows, DO NOT READ THE POSTS ABOVE THIS ONE!

Haha didn't really think it would be considered a spoiler since it technically happened within the episode. Woops. :chuckles:

Ok guys, let's talk Bran visions. What'd you think?

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

What are these redeeming qualities that Stannis has in the books? Maybe I missed something. He's a rigid character that spares Davos a couple of times just as he does in the show. I think the redemptive stuff that stands out to me is still in the future... stuff that the show will obviously cover later on.

Stannis' redeeming quality is that he tries to do the "right" thing -- his duty -- as he sees it. I never got the feeling in the books that he was doing the things he did for his personal benefit. His excessive rigidity in pursuit of that duty is his major flaw, but he's not a dishonest or evil guy.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Also, I stood up for the non-use of spoilers about the episode last night, but freely giving away who committed the act? I think spoilers are appropriate. So let me do this.

Yeah, I put spoiler tags on that stuff since it takes place next episode. But events from last night? Not going to put spoiler tags on that one. Common sense should tell you not to come into a Game of Thrones forum topic the night after a show airs and not expect people to be talking about the episode openly.

It's the same reason why I don't click on the topic for The Walking Dead (which I almost never watch when it airs live) before I've seen the newest episode (unless I don't care about being spoiled, which is usually the case since that show kind of sucks). Still, I recognize that I'm allowing myself to probably be spoiled by clicking on the topic.

Ok guys, let's talk Bran visions. What'd you think?

Seemed like they just wanted to reuse a bunch of old footage. :chuckles:

 

[Chris]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Wow, those snap shots of Sansa's necklace are awesome. Crazy they were that detailed.

 

[kosis]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Stannis' redeeming quality is that he tries to do the "right" thing -- his duty -- as he sees it. I never got the feeling in the books that he was doing the things he did for his personal benefit. His excessive rigidity in pursuit of that duty is his major flaw, but he's not a dishonest or evil guy.

I understand that, which is a big part of me liking his character. I just don't see how his show portrayal is any different.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I understand that, which is a big part of me liking his character. I just don't see how his show portrayal is any different.

Oh, I agree. I think he's been portrayed pretty fairly, though you can always pick nits in an adaptation.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I understand that, which is a big part of me liking his character. I just don't see how his show portrayal is any different.

One moment I would point out is when he begs Melisandre in season three to create another child for him. That was ridiculously out of character for Stannis. He would never beg anyone for anything.

And again, I'm not someone who is all in love with book Stannis. He's not one of my favorite characters, although I do appreciate his super dry humor ("It would seem wedding have become more dangerous than battles"). I just think he's a totally different character on the show. They've stripped him of almost all his authority, and Melisandre seems to be the one making all the decisions, such as when she decides (not him) to spare Davos at the end of season three.

I also think the Stannis/Davos scenes are missing all of the interaction between the two characters, something we haven't really seen since season two. Stannis trusts Davos and values his advice in the books. That dynamic is totally absent on the show.

 

[CardiacCavs]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Seemed like they just wanted to reuse a bunch of old footage. :chuckles:

:fu:

Well we did hear

Spoiler

Bloodraven talk and see the cave where he lives. I'm looking forward to that scene outside the cave where the wights attack.

Although, I'm guessing we will have a detour to Craster's Keep on the way.

For some reason I really like the interaction between the Boltons on screen.

Spoiler

Theon's arc in ADWD was my favorite so I think it will be prime story telling material for the show, seeing his gradual redemption story coupled with everything Pro-stark that is going on just beneath the surface in the North. Show watchers are gonna splooge all over the TV when we have "The North Remembers" speech from Wyman.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I just think he's a totally different character on the show. They've stripped him of almost all his authority, and Melisandre seems to be the one making all the decisions, such as when she decides (not him) to spare Davos at the end of season three.

I also think the Stannis/Davos scenes are missing all of the interaction between the two characters, something we haven't really seen since season two. Stannis trusts Davos and values his advice in the books. That dynamic is totally absent on the show.

I think that's largely a matter of what you take out of Stephen Dillane's performance as Stannis. I personally get an "I really don't like all this stuff" vibe from him, in that he thinks he's doing what is necessary but is uncomfortable with a lot of it. And the really big Stannis/Davos moment is when

Spoiler

Davos convinces him that his duty is to go up and save the Night's Watch at the Wall.

That's not only a kingly, authoritative decision, but it really cements Davos' role.

Just have to say that Davos is just a great character all around. Really liked the bit they added about his relationship with Shireen.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I think that's largely a matter of what you take out of Stephen Dillane's performance as Stannis. I personally get an "I really don't like all this stuff" vibe from him, in that he thinks he's doing what is necessary but is uncomfortable with a lot of it. And the really big Stannis/Davos moment is when

Spoiler

Davos convinces him that his duty is to go up and save the Night's Watch at the Wall.

That's not only a kingly, authoritative decision, but it really cements Davos' role.

Just have to say that Davos is just a great character all around. Really liked the bit they added about his relationship with Shireen.

Regarding your spoilered bit...Melisandre is the one who makes that decision on the show, which again was out of character for Stannis. He basically lets her make all the calls on the show, unlike in the books where he frequently doubts her power and she is constantly trying to sway him and prove herself to be correct.

 

[AKcavsfan]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Oh, here is something else too: The fact that Bran received direct guidance from Bloodraven on where they need to go pretty much eliminates the need for Coldhands entirely. To me, it seems almost certain now that he has been cut.

When bran had his tree-vision, I thought i saw a zombie-like horse.. I was thinking that could be a nod towards coldhands, but now that I think about it he rode an elk so maybe not.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

When bran had his tree-vision, I thought i saw a zombie-like horse.. I was thinking that could be a nod towards coldhands, but now that I think about it he rode an elk so maybe not.

Coldhands never rode a dead animal in the books. The elk was alive. That, really, was what separated him from your average wight.

However, there would be basically no chance of him riding an elk on the show, as that would either require an actual elk or expensive (and ultimately pointless) CGI. I assume if he is included on the show (which is looking very unlikely at this point), he'll just ride a horse.

There was a shot in a couple of the trailers for this season that showed a white walker riding a horse, so the shot in Bran's vision could have been from that, or it could have simply been footage from a previous season where we saw the dead horses.

 

[kosis]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

One moment I would point out is when he begs Melisandre in season three to create another child for him. That was ridiculously out of character for Stannis. He would never beg anyone for anything.

And again, I'm not someone who is all in love with book Stannis. He's not one of my favorite characters, although I do appreciate his super dry humor ("It would seem wedding have become more dangerous than battles"). I just think he's a totally different character on the show. They've stripped him of almost all his authority, and Melisandre seems to be the one making all the decisions, such as when she decides (not him) to spare Davos at the end of season three.

I also think the Stannis/Davos scenes are missing all of the interaction between the two characters, something we haven't really seen since season two. Stannis trusts Davos and values his advice in the books. That dynamic is totally absent on the show.

I don't think she's making any of these decisions though. I think he's convinced that what she's recommending is ultimately going to get things done, just like in the books (specifically in regards to Blackwater Bay).

Prime example: He listens to Davos and doesn't take Melisandre with him to Blackwater. Melisandre was very adamant about being involved in that battle but Stannis put his foot down and left her in Dragonstone. The fact that she's been right about a few things (aforementioned example, Robb Stark dying through leech prophecy) has swayed him to allow her a larger voice. It's still all very much his choice, though. The minute he thinks she's wrong he's going to make it known i.e. choking her until she proves there are visions in the flames in season 2. Again, he also refused to allow for Shireen to be punished by Selyse last episode. Stannis is still very much in control.