To Tank or not to Tank, that is the question

[Pyro]

It's a shame. I was so pumped for this season too. But basketball like the kind that was on display tonight is just unbearable to watch.

 

[UncleDrew]

Its just 1 loss. Lets see how the team responds before we lose our collective shit over it.

Can I give more than just one like for this comment? We are 1-1 right now, with the Cavaliers just being given their first loss. Game 2 of the damn season and people are already believing the sky is falling. Come on guys, seriously.

By the way..I sure in the hell hope you guys won't be having these kind of threads at all next season after this being a "tanking season" again.

 

[gregdawg]

this roster is hot garbage. i don't think a "deliberate" tanking is necessary. it will just happen naturally due to lack of talent.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Just out of curiosity, exactly what veterans are we going to play that are going to give us a better chance at winning? By all accounts, our best shot at winning is to play Irving and Waiters big minutes along with Varejao and Thompson. Of them, only Varejao is a veteran. At the SF we've got Gee, Casspi, and Miles. Miles is the only one of the three that would be considered a vet and he's a role-player at best. We've got Walton, who is probably the worst player on the roster. We've got Gibson, who like Miles is a role-player at best, and isn't exactly going to be leading us to any victories. Are there even any other vets on the roster?

I've been realistic about this team from the start. They're not going to be very good. We're going to lose a lot of games because our team is just too young and inexperienced. When you've got two sophomores, a rookie, and a former D-Leaguer in your starting line-up, you're going to lose a lot of games. This season is about developing the young talent, figuring out which bench guys are actually worthy of a spot on an NBA team (spoiler: not Luke Walton), and just seeing what happens.

The plus side is that Waiters has looked pretty good through his first two games, so I don't see much cause to be concerned about him developing into a good NBA player. He's also incredibly fun to watch.

 

[Shakalu M.D.]

I knew this thread would pop up. I didn't expect it to be game 2. The Cavs are playing .500 ball, that's enough for an 8 seed in the east.


See how ridiculous it sounds when you use such a small sample size? If you didn't expect an incredibly young team with no real veteran talent to struggle against a great defense, well then I just don't know what to tell you.

 

[Amherstcavsfan]

The problem here is that the Bulls are one of the worst matchups in the NBA for the Cavs and do everything the Cavs do best but the Bulls do it at elite levels. They will probably embarrass us every time we play them.

Still, the bench is frightening and the defensive scheme is, IMO, seriously flawed.

 

[rabman_gold]

Can I give more than just one like for this comment? We are 1-1 right now, with the Cavaliers just being given their first loss. Game 2 of the damn season and people are already believing the sky is falling. Come on guys, seriously.

By the way..I sure in the hell hope you guys won't be having these kind of threads at all next season after this being a "tanking season" again.

If you haven't noticed, the guys who are posting here are mostly the regulars in negativity. And some are posting more than once. Our core group isn't really posting because they already know how they feel internally, "it's just two games". Just ignore it if you don't like it. I'm sure not feeling anything negative from this loss...

 

[theSTEREO.]

2 things:

1) Jason Lloyd's article pretty much gave us the answer. Yes, we will tank. Grant and co. are planning on another top 5 pick, and the roster and rotations seem to fit the bill.

2) I don't mind losing, but losing like we did tonight is unacceptable. Rebuilding should be about losing while learning how to win. We didn't learn anything tonight. Play your hardest, and if your hardest isn't enough that's fine for now. But I'm actually pissed I wasted money on tickets to this.

 

[Huber.]

I don't see us making the playoffs for another 3 years. Two at least.

 

[Frank Reynolds]

If we're still in the lottery in 2014, we're doing it wrong.

No, what if we're doing it right? What if Tristan Thompson comes on his 4th or 5th season in the league? With a player as raw as Tristan Thompson, you have to be a realist and understand that with these types of players, it takes a long time for them to season their games and learn the tricks of the trade. Some of the little things Thompson is doing this year are very encouraging signs for the future. Once he gets a little more seasoning and savvy he'll be making plays that he simply can't make right now. Some people will argue that if you just don't have it then there is no hope and I'll lend some credence to that. It definitely happens, but more so with players with frail confidence. I believe Tristan Thompson is going to have a moment where he finally just lets the game come to him. Right now he's like a bull in a china shop trying to go out and take it, but great players like Kyrie make the game come to them.

If I were a betting man, I'd bet on Tristan Thompson to have that "aha!" moment over a talent like JJ Hickson. JJ's biggest problem was lack of focus. I don't see the same lack of focus from Thompson. Thompson's issues are from lack of know how. It's actually going to be better for the Cavaliers in the long run. If these players were too good right off the bat, we'd accumulate sub-par talent. You need blue chips to win and the Cavaliers have only had one real shot at a blue chipper. They tried to land Davis, and that's encouraging. But rather than accumulate sub-par talent, you need to remain in the cesspool until you have a minimum of 2 blue chip talents. Jonas Valanciunas, Tristan Thompson, Kawhi Leonard, Brad Beal, Andre Drummond they are all decent players, maybe starters, maybe all-stars but none of them have the superstar, blue chip pedigree of Kyrie and Davis. These next drafts have some serious talent in them and we need to do whatever we need to do, in order for us to land an elite perennial all star prospect.

Dion Waiters could be the same thing. Dion Waiters year 5 is going to be way better than Dion Waiters his rookie season. Hopefully he'll be good enough to be a big impact player on the team, but also not become too good where he James Harden's us. If we get one more blue chip talent, and wait until Waiters and Thompson and Zeller hatch, we should have a squad. By that time we'll have 6-7 legit players that can play a real playoff rotation.

 

[ajz20]

This is not the year to tank! If it was 2014... then we may be talking. Besides Zeller and Muhmmad this draft leaves a ton to desire. With Andy on the team we are too good to really tank. We will probably be drafting in the 6-12 range and drafting a player that has less upside than Waiters. I hope I am wrong but I am not excited about the 2013 draft unless we magically land a top 3 pick.

 

[TopGun]

This is not the year to tank! If it was 2014... then we may be talking. Besides Zeller and Muhmmad this draft leaves a ton to desire. With Andy on the team we are too good to really tank. We will probably be drafting in the 6-12 range and drafting a player that has less upside than Waiters. I hope I am wrong but I am not excited about the 2013 draft unless we magically land a top 3 pick.

That's why Andy needs to be dealt. He's good enough that he's hurting our rebuild but he's too old to be a likely contributor when this team is ready to win in 2-3 years. It would be nice if he could have a few more games like the first, to pump up his value.

 

[Huber.]

This is not the year to tank! If it was 2014... then we may be talking. Besides Zeller and Muhmmad this draft leaves a ton to desire. With Andy on the team we are too good to really tank. We will probably be drafting in the 6-12 range and drafting a player that has less upside than Waiters. I hope I am wrong but I am not excited about the 2013 draft unless we magically land a top 3 pick.

So you're saying we aren't good enough to make the playoffs but we are good enough to be in the 6-12 range where their won't be many good players at. So wouldn't it be smart to tank in a weak draft class year?

 

[Rich]

No, what if we're doing it right? What if Tristan Thompson comes on his 4th or 5th season in the league? With a player as raw as Tristan Thompson, you have to be a realist and understand that with these types of players, it takes a long time for them to season their games and learn the tricks of the trade. Some of the little things Thompson is doing this year are very encouraging signs for the future. Once he gets a little more seasoning and savvy he'll be making plays that he simply can't make right now. Some people will argue that if you just don't have it then there is no hope and I'll lend some credence to that. It definitely happens, but more so with players with frail confidence. I believe Tristan Thompson is going to have a moment where he finally just lets the game come to him. Right now he's like a bull in a china shop trying to go out and take it, but great players like Kyrie make the game come to them.

If I were a betting man, I'd bet on Tristan Thompson to have that "aha!" moment over a talent like JJ Hickson. JJ's biggest problem was lack of focus. I don't see the same lack of focus from Thompson. Thompson's issues are from lack of know how. It's actually going to be better for the Cavaliers in the long run. If these players were too good right off the bat, we'd accumulate sub-par talent. You need blue chips to win and the Cavaliers have only had one real shot at a blue chipper. They tried to land Davis, and that's encouraging. But rather than accumulate sub-par talent, you need to remain in the cesspool until you have a minimum of 2 blue chip talents. Jonas Valanciunas, Tristan Thompson, Kawhi Leonard, Brad Beal, Andre Drummond they are all decent players, maybe starters, maybe all-stars but none of them have the superstar, blue chip pedigree of Kyrie and Davis. These next drafts have some serious talent in them and we need to do whatever we need to do, in order for us to land an elite perennial all star prospect.

Dion Waiters could be the same thing. Dion Waiters year 5 is going to be way better than Dion Waiters his rookie season. Hopefully he'll be good enough to be a big impact player on the team, but also not become too good where he James Harden's us. If we get one more blue chip talent, and wait until Waiters and Thompson and Zeller hatch, we should have a squad. By that time we'll have 6-7 legit players that can play a real playoff rotation.

So you guys honestly want to watch that type of basketball for the next five years? Throw away five years of Kyrie's career? I'll pass on that one. My bet is Dan Gilbert will too.

 

[ajz20]

So you're saying we aren't good enough to make the playoffs but we are good enough to be in the 6-12 range where their won't be many good players at. So wouldn't it be smart to tank in a weak draft class year?

Not sure the season ticket base can take many games like tonight long term. What will the reward be? Only way we are a contender in the next 4 years is to trade for or sign a top 20 NBA talent. I was all about tanking last year, just can't justify it this year. The draft is so weak as of today compared to 2014. I have come to the realization that we wont get another super star in the draft during this rebuild baring a miracle of ping pong ball success. We need to make this an attractive place for other players around the NBA not just in FA but players that tell their agent I would not mind being traded to Cle because of Irving, Scott and team that actually is starting to win games. If you trade Andy for a late 1st rounder this year, you are giving him away for a guy who may have been drafted in the 35-40 range last year.Is it really worth it? You want to tank so we can secure Rudy Gobert in the op 5? I would rather see Waiters, TT, Irving and Zeller develop enough to be win games and deveop confidence going into next year, and then be very active in the trade market.