Wedge Not Getting Fired

[Corey]

CLEVELAND (AP)—Eric Wedge’s job is safe for the rest of the season.

Cleveland general manager Mark Shapiro said Sunday that the manager and his coaching staff would remain in their jobs with the last-place Indians.

“As I’ve said all along, the responsibility for the disappointments of this season don’t rest on one person,” Shapiro said. “The responsibility is spread equally throughout the players, the front office, Eric and his staff.

“I thought it was important for the second half to remove a potential distraction that exists from that speculation.”

The Indians, expected to contend in the AL Central Division, are 33-49, the worst record in the league.

Wedge, in his seventh season as Indians manager, is signed through 2010. The Indians are 529-525 under Wedge. They won the Central in 2007 and came within a game of reaching the World Series and Wedge won AL Manager of the Year.

Source.

 

[AZ_]

Now or the end of the season, doesn't really make much difference to me.

 

[elcheato]

Now I have to hope we don't have a good 2nd half like last year, because if we do Wedge is staying and the same thing will happen next year, and the trend with continue.

 

[Brother Redbush]

the pressure is off now. they will play good now, when the games are no longer meaningful.

thi s is stat building time, this is when the indians really kick it in.

 

[fudd]

He's been doing something right these last couple of games.

 

[col63onel]

Firing Wedge and/or Shapiro will do little, if anything.

The reality is, the Indians have been an average/above average team for most of the Wedge/Shapiro era, despite having average/below average resources.

Shapiro is working with an invisible salary cap. What he can do is limited by Dolan's pockets, so we are going to have areas of our team fixed with duct tape as opposed to a legit solution. Firing Wedge and Shapiro WILL NOT CHANGE THIS!!!!!

If we had a different manager, we still wouldn't have been able to keep CC, we still wouldn't have kept Thome or Ramirez, and we still would be relying on retreads like Pavano or Jason Johnson or Paul Byrd or Kevin Millwood to fill out our roster.

There are things that both could do better (for example, SHapiro's draft record is spotty), but thinking that "new" blood will re-energize the franchise is pretty naive.

 

[BlueSeats626]

Firing Wedge and/or Shapiro will do little, if anything.

The reality is, the Indians have been an average/above average team for most of the Wedge/Shapiro era, despite having average/below average resources.

They are now in their eighth year under this FO, and we will have two winning seasons and one playoff appearance to show for it.

Inexcusable. The lack of resources isn't much of an excuse at this point. Name one draft pick under Shapiro that has had any semblance of an impact at the major league level.

 

[col63onel]

They are now in their eighth year under this FO, and we will have two winning seasons and one playoff appearance to show for it.

Inexcusable. The lack of resources isn't much of an excuse at this point. Name one draft pick under Shapiro that has had any semblance of an impact at the major league level.

2003 was by any account a rebuilding year. Since then, they've been about .500 3 times and won 90 games 2x. The worst year was 2006, when they won 78, but their Pythagorean W-L was 89-73, making them about the unluckiest team in the last half decade.

Shapiro's draft record has been spotty, but he's made a few killer deals that replenished the farm system.

If he's fired, the Indians will look for a cheap GM, one who knows he's working with a limited payroll. Basically, they'll be getting Shapiro from 8 years ago. Tell me how that makes the situation any better?

The same thing with Wedge. We'll be hiring a career minor league manager, who would be similar to Wedge in 2003.

I am not saying Shapiro and Wedge are great, but given the situation, we aren't going to find anyone better, unless Dolan radically loosens up on the purse strings.

 

[InBoobieWeTrust]

Tank! Get the best dominican guy in the draft! Do it Ferry!

Let's convince Dan Gilbert to buy the Indians

 

[col63onel]

Let's convince Dan Gilbert to buy the Indians

Honestly, this is a solution that probably would result in actual, positive change.

 

[GreasySpread36]

2003 was by any account a rebuilding year. Since then, they've been about .500 3 times and won 90 games 2x. The worst year was 2006, when they won 78, but their Pythagorean W-L was 89-73, making them about the unluckiest team in the last half decade.

No such thing as "luck" in sports, at least not over such an extended period of time. This club hasn't been unlucky. This team has had lousy bullpens that have given up leads, an inconsistent offense that is slow, overreliant on the long ball, underreliant on run manufacturing, and strikeout prone (the kind of offense that will win one game 14-2 and lose the next three games 3-1) and a brain-dead manager that has no feel for when to pull a starting pitcher. Those are the reasons this club has underplayed its Pythogorean. Not luck.

BTW, how come the Browns never get the rebuilding excuse? I mean, one would have to consider 1999, 2000 and 2005, 2006 at least as rebuilding years for them. But you never hear excuses made for the Browns like that. Everyone knows they're a trainwreck. But hell, they've had as many winning seasons since 2002 as the Indians.

Shapiro's draft record has been spotty, but he's made a few killer deals that replenished the farm system.

Definitely. Problem is, those killer deals are the kind clubs make when they're out of the race by the All-Star Break. You don't trade established players for prospects if you think there's a chance to win something. Those are white-flag deals almost every time. So basically, it's when his club sucks that Shapiro really shines as a GM. A mixed blessing. And unsustainable as an organizational strategy.

There's a ripple effect from the poor drafts as well. Shapiro constantly wastes resources on tomato cans like David Dellucci, Joe Borowski, Todd Hollandsworth, Aaron Boone, Kerry Wood et al is because those roles aren't being filled from within by players who have come up through the organization. Draft better, and those resources can go someplace else. It isn't the money Shapiro can't spend that concerns me. It's the money he does spend- and who it goes to.

If he's fired, the Indians will look for a cheap GM, one who knows he's working with a limited payroll. Basically, they'll be getting Shapiro from 8 years ago. Tell me how that makes the situation any better?

Maybe they'll find a GM who can actually draft. The late '80s and early '90s Indians were just as hamstrung as the present-day club, if not more, yet they managed to produce Albert Belle, Jim Thome, Manny Ramirez, Charles Nagy and Brian Giles out of the amateur draft during that period- among others. Shapiro hasn't drafted a single player who is as productive as any of those guys. Not even close. Who is the best position player drafted under his watch? Ryan Garko? Come on. He's got to do better than that.

As for the payroll, how limited is it, really? Last I checked it was up over 80 million dollars, which is roughly middle of the pack in MLB. Actually, the payroll is a little high, considering what they've been drawing the last few years. I think an 80 million dollar payroll is plenty enough for this club to compete in this division against the likes of the Twins, Royals, and Chicago's second team.

The same thing with Wedge. We'll be hiring a career minor league manager, who would be similar to Wedge in 2003.

That might be true. But sometimes you have to chop off a head. Just to show the fans there's some accountability within the organization. Just to show the fans you're taking some kind of action. I personally think Wedge is a troglodyte, a 2009 manager with a 1909 brain. I would have fired his ass after the '06 season. The fans don't like him, his teams always choke, he ran Brandon Phillips out of town- just get rid of him already. I don't care if it's his fault or not.

I am not saying Shapiro and Wedge are great, but given the situation, we aren't going to find anyone better, unless Dolan radically loosens up on the purse strings.

It isn't going to happen, and it shouldn't. People aren't showing up to the ballpark. You can't in good conscience ask Larry Dolan to front a 100, 150-million dollar payroll for what is consistently one of the worst draws in baseball. It doesn't cost much to draft and develop talent. The people running the baseball side need to be more efficient. It isn't on the payroll, it's on them. No more excuses.

 

[DougHeil]

Firing Wedge and/or Shapiro will do little, if anything.

The reality is, the Indians have been an average/above average team for most of the Wedge/Shapiro era, despite having average/below average resources.

Shapiro is working with an invisible salary cap. What he can do is limited by Dolan's pockets, so we are going to have areas of our team fixed with duct tape as opposed to a legit solution. Firing Wedge and Shapiro WILL NOT CHANGE THIS!!!!!

If we had a different manager, we still wouldn't have been able to keep CC, we still wouldn't have kept Thome or Ramirez, and we still would be relying on retreads like Pavano or Jason Johnson or Paul Byrd or Kevin Millwood to fill out our roster.

There are things that both could do better (for example, SHapiro's draft record is spotty), but thinking that "new" blood will re-energize the franchise is pretty naive.

I totally and completely disagree. NO team in any sport out there would allow a coach or manager seven straight years of either not winning more than losing or winning only up to when it counted the most; 2007. Of course when a team in any sport is really bad, you don't blame things on one person. That's just not the point. duh? Shapiro is best friends with his manager. No one in the know would say that is a good thing. Shapiro just doesn't get it and chooses to spin things thinking the fans will buy his crap. He is a slap in the face to fans of a city who are more intelligent than the average city's fans. You have to fire the Manager and ALL his hand picked coaches. Not doing so now only means this guy and his buds have their hands ALL over the future of the Indians. He has a say in who is brought up, who plays where and when and for how long, and how that batting order is constructed each day. Why should we suffer through this crap the rest of this year? Isn't it a fact that the Indians will do MUCH better now when ALL pressure is off? Of course they will, but what will that tell us? Not a damn thing except to secure the Wedgie another damn year, and another damn year of a slow start and out of the playoffs in July, and we do it all over again.

When you all were watching Shapiro yesterday, did you get a strong feeling of wanting to slap that guy silly? I did. Why is the Cleveland media so lenient on these guys? Why don't they insist on asking tough questions and demanding straight up answers? Why do they allow Shapiro AND Wedge all of this double talk and spin? I truly want to know.

 

[BlueSeats626]

I'll list all the reasons why Wedge won't be fired:

1. $


That's it.

 

[col63onel]

Anybody who thinks firing Wedge/Shapiro will improve things, find me a replacement combo that would be any different.

IE. An experienced manager with a winning track record that Dolan would mind paying, or an experienced GM who wants work for a team that, at best, will be in the middle of the pack in terms of payroll.

If we fire Wedge, we'll be right back in 5 years saying the same thing about the new guy. Won't be any worse, but won't be any better.

 

[GreasySpread36]

If we fire Wedge, we'll be right back in 5 years saying the same thing about the new guy.

Only one way to find out.