2022 Cleveland Guardians Regular Season Thread

[Derek]

Even the odds that 2 out of 3 of Williams/Espino/Rocchio hit at the MLB level are slim.

We talked about this somewhere a few weeks back, but ~20% of top 100 prospects stick as good MLB players.

But I also think people get too caught up with "their guy" and if you aren't "their guy" then with the abundance of stats available to literally everyone to prove literally anything it's easy to knock a guy down a peg or 2 and justify it. Always a weird thing to do with players who could make your favorite team better.

One of the hardest things to do in sports is predict a player's success in the MLB. Just like the game itself, a 30% success rate makes you good at your job. But the more bullets you have the better your odds to hit on a player.

Why teams like Cleveland and Tampa continue to be successful with few down years even with small payrolls. When you're getting your 30% off of 100 players as opposed to 30% off of 50 players because you have a deep organization and more bullets in the chamber compared to other franchises you can re-stock on the fly and be successful. Which is a reason Cleveland "hoards" prospects and thinks highly of a lot of them (per the rumor mill on how stubborn they can be when it comes to dealing their prospects), it's a big key to their operational success long term.

I think the “their guy” thing is a big part of it, too.

I’ve seen plenty of people trying to trade upper level SS prospects since before Rocchio even got to AA.

I love Rocchio, but there’s no reason to clear a path for him or any prospect. As you said in your last paragraph, it’s all about having as many bullets in the chamber as possible.

 

[Obscured By Clouds]

Sorry to disturb the Arias apologetics meeting, but what about BB/K and SwStr%?

Arias isn't perfect, but he does have extreme upside, he and Rocchio probably have the highest upside of our MI prospects. Even if both fail, we have plenty of MI talent to rotate in and out to figure out who will be paired up with Andres in the future.

I really do not understand all of the 'this one is better than that other one' or 'that one will never make it' or 'that one will make it' stuff. Only time will answer that question. All that is is comparing 'potential' which means nothing until they prove it at the MLB level. This is a good spot for this team to be in, with Rosario a year from FA and Andres having an excellent glove at either SS or 2B to go along with his bat.

I don't care who 'wins.' I am going to enjoy watching who does.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

Buxton and Mahle to the IL for the Twins. Grandal and Kopech for the White Sox and of course Tim Anderson is still out.

The Guardians have a chance to pull away in the next couple of weeks.

 

[CDAV45]

Arias isn't perfect, but he does have extreme upside, he and Rocchio probably have the highest upside of our MI prospects. Even if both fail, we have plenty of MI talent to rotate in and out to figure out who will be paired up with Andres in the future.

I really do not understand all of the 'this one is better than that other one' or 'that one will never make it' or 'that one will make it' stuff. Only time will answer that question. All that is is comparing 'potential' which means nothing until they prove it at the MLB level. This is a good spot for this team to be in, with Rosario a year from FA and Andres having an excellent glove at either SS or 2B to go along with his bat.

I don't care who 'wins.' I am going to enjoy watching who does.

I stated a while back that I didn't understand the interest in predetermining the outcome of prospects. Let it play out as long as possible and choose who looks like the best one at that time. Even then there is no certainty. Anyone trying to downplay Arias' potential doesn't know what in the hell they're talking about IMO. Even if they are correct in their assessment in the end, you still have to ride it out.

Edited to say that regardless of what I say, you say, Tondo says or anyone else outside of the organization, they clearly like what they see in Arias. They like his offensive profile enough to create defensive flexibility with him even though he is an outstanding defensive SS.

 

[Gson]

I stated a while back that I didn't understand the interest in predetermining the outcome of prospects. Let it play out as long as possible and choose who looks like the best one at that time. Even then there is no certainty. Anyone trying to downplay Arias' potential doesn't know what in the hell they're talking about IMO. Even if they are correct in their assessment in the end, you still have to ride it out.

Edited to say that regardless of what I say, you say, Tondo says or anyone else outside of the organization, they clearly like what they see in Arias. They like his offensive profile enough to create defensive flexibility with him even though he is an outstanding defensive SS.

Defensively... it can be said that Arias has one of the best arm/glove in the Guardians system... including the ML level..

without prejudice..

 

[CDAV45]

Defensively... it can be said that Arias has one of the best arm/glove in the Guardians system... including the ML level..

without prejudice..

Absolutely and the fact that they are trying to get his bat in a lineup regardless of position should at the very least create a bit of excitement to see.

 

[kidduck]

I'm pulling for the Guardians to win the division.

Wild card race is going to be tight.

 

[Alabuckeye]

Yeah, I think outlasting Minnesota and Chicago is slightly better than trying to outlast one of TB, Toronto or Seattle. I think Baltimore falters, although kudos to them for a nice season…

 

[33Y0]

 

[avs2000]

the bullpen is why no one would want to play us in the post season.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

You know how much we all love Clase right now?

Want to swallow a bitter pill this morning?

Clase wouldn't be this good if it weren't for Bryan Shaw being on this roster. Whatever difference you think there would be between Shaw and another arm pales in comparison to the improved effectiveness and availability of Clase this year and moving forward.

 

[33Y0]

Here are the highest WAR totals for a second baseman, 23 or younger, since 1947:

1. Carlos Baerga, 1992 Indians: 6.3

2. Willie Randolph, 1978 Yankees: 5.8

3. Joe Morgan, 1965 Astros: 5.7

4. Paul Molitor, 1979 Brewers: 5.6

5. Rod Carew, 1969 Twins: 5.5

6. Chuck Knoblauch, 1992 Twins: 5.3

6. Andres Gimenez, 2022 Guardians: 5.3

 

[Urban]

You know how much we all love Clase right now?

Want to swallow a bitter pill this morning?

Clase wouldn't be this good if it weren't for Bryan Shaw being on this roster. Whatever difference you think there would be between Shaw and another arm pales in comparison to the improved effectiveness and availability of Clase this year and moving forward.

Edit- my gif isn't working. But not sure the logic here.

 

[The Oi]

For better or worse, these guys absolutely remind me of those b2b WS KC teams from the mid 2010s.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Edit- my gif isn't working. But not sure the logic here.

Clase and the organization have repeatedly talked this year about how Shaw has had a tremendous influence on him--specifically with forcing Clase to be available to pitch back-to-back days, and basically always be available.

To me, that improvement in Clase's availability outweighs whatever difference there would be between Shaw and another low-tier bullpen arm.