2023 Season | Series #16 | White Sox @ Guardians | May 22-24, 2023

[CDAV45]

I mean of course it is.

I just think a little perspective about what is actually going to happen isn't a bad thing.

I apologize if it came off like I was telling anyone how to fan. Wasn't my intention.

It just gets a little tiresome to hear the same complaints about the same stuff every single day when we know they aren't going to change certain things regardless of how much the fans may be clamoring for it.

If I know they're not benching Rosario, I'd rather focus my fan energy on figuring out how they can win WITH Rosario, ya know? If the answer is "they can't, get rid of him" then so be it, but that's where I try and keep my head.

You know what, as long as the incompetent Rosario is starting everyday and hitting in the 2 hole then I'm going to bitch. Why? Because it's blatantly stupid for him to be starting and playing SS. If it doesn't change then there is only one reason it isn't and that's money which only makes matters worse because it tells me that is the motivating factor instead of winning.

Focus on how they can win with Rosario you say? That's like getting into your car to drive to work in the morning knowing damn good and well that the POS won't ever start again.

I don't hate the guy. In fact, I admire his hustle and attitude, but we're long past the time a decision should have been made and if you don't believe me then just look at the season so far because he's part of the reason why it's been an epic failure to this point.

 

[Urban]

We evaluate independent things independently. To do otherwise is stupid. To claim that statement is contentious at all, let alone "mental gymnastics" is something I'll chalk up to you not having had your morning coffee yet.

Gimenez being traded here in 2021 and the front office extending him on 2023 are independent events.

I don't know how to make this any simpler.

In the provided example, nobody would say Koby Altman made a bad trade. Nobody would say that he shouldn't make the exact same move in the future. Nobody wants their GM to avoid trading trash for the most valuable asset in the league. The fact that Wemby would never play a game is independent of the trade evaluation.

"Hey remember when we traded Lindor in 2020 and then bitched about Amed Rosario blocking prospects for 2 straight years? And remember when Andres had one good year and then 6 shit years in a row all the while hamstringing our spending ability? What a great trade!"

"Actually it was a good trade because the value at the time."


It's illogical to not consider the extension. Each player's production in a given year are independent events too. As is Amed blocking playing time from potentially higher ceiling players. Are we ignoring all of that too?

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

"Hey remember when we traded Lindor in 2020 and then bitched about Amed Rosario blocking prospects for 2 straight years? And remember when Andres had one good year and then 6 shit years in a row all the while hamstringing our spending ability? What a great trade!"

"Actually it was a good trade because the value at the time."


It's illogical to not consider the extension. Each player's production in a given year are independent events too. As is Amed blocking playing time from potentially higher ceiling players. Are we ignoring all of that too?

You couldn't possibly be more wrong here when you use a word like illogical.

It is precisely logical to evaluate a decision based upon the information available at the time, and the impact the decision makes downstream.

It is precisely illogical to evaluate a decision based on a future decision that was made independently of it.

I'm not sure why you keep trying at this. Not even Los would make the argument you're trying to make. You might want to slow down and think about it for a minute.

Unless signing Gimenez to a contract extension was a condition of the trade (it wasn't), then it isn't a part of the trade's evaluation.

 

[Real Deal]

Los catching strays in the baseball section is hilarious, love this site, currently hate decisions from the team

 

[Urban]

You couldn't possibly be more wrong here when you use a word like illogical.

It is precisely logical to evaluate a decision based upon the information available at the time, and the impact the decision makes downstream.

It is precisely illogical to evaluate a decision based on a future decision that was made independently of it.

I'm not sure why you keep trying at this. Not even Los would make the argument you're trying to make. You might want to slow down and think about it for a minute.

Unless signing Gimenez to a contract extension was a condition of the trade (it wasn't), then it isn't a part of the trade's evaluation.

So if Andres completely flames out and the Guardians are left eating $100m for a middle infield version of Myles Straw, you're going to be the guy saying "well actually, it wasn't the trade that was bad. It was the extension that was bad!"

Got it

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

So if Andres completely flames out and the Guardians are left eating $100m for a middle infield version of Myles Straw, you're going to be the guy saying "well actually, it wasn't the trade that was bad. It was the extension that was bad!"

Got it

No, if Gimenez sucks, then it was a bad trade. We didn't get anything out of the trade other than a stopgap, middling SS in Amed, and a one-year wonder in Gimenez.

However, signing that one-year wonder to a long-term deal is even worse.

I'm not sure what I'm more flabbergasted by--your inability to grasp the concept of independent decisions or your hubris to continue down this ill-fated path.

 

[Criznit]

So if Andres completely flames out and the Guardians are left eating $100m for a middle infield version of Myles Straw, you're going to be the guy saying "well actually, it wasn't the trade that was bad. It was the extension that was bad!"

Got it

I'll probably be that guy.

The Brewers ended up fleecing the Marlins in the Yelich deal, but his extension is something Milwaukee would LOVE to go back and undo.

 

[Urban]

No, if Gimenez sucks, then it was a bad trade. We didn't get anything out of the trade other than a stopgap, middling SS in Amed, and a one-year wonder in Gimenez.

However, signing that one-year wonder to a long-term deal is even worse.

I'm not sure what I'm more flabbergasted by--your inability to grasp the concept of independent decisions or your hubris to continue down this ill-fated path.

Glad we agree

No I understand it perfectly fine, I just don't agree with evaluating each "move" completely separately.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Glad we agree

No I understand it perfectly fine, I just don't agree with evaluating each "move" completely separately.

I hope you're never giving performance reviews.

 

[Urban]

I hope you're never giving performance reviews.

I love how you always feel the need to throw in personal jabs here and there with everyone that disagrees with you. Really delightful stuff.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I love how you always feel the need to throw in personal jabs here and there with everyone that disagrees with you. Really delightful stuff.

You're kidding, right?

I think that comparison must have made a lot more sense in your head and only your head.

I assume you're just regurgitating things that you think sound good--because this isn't a matter of agreement/disagreement,

 

[Urban]

You're kidding, right?


I assume you're just regurgitating things that you think sound good--because this isn't a matter of agreement/disagreement,

We disagree and you in as many words say "you'd make a shitty manager" or "you can't grasp this simple concept" "you should slow down"

vs.

Me pointing out your hypothetical of trading an NBA generational prospect who then dies in a car crash for a 10th man to the Lindor trade was ridiculous

 

[Gson]

one pitch.. one out..

to start the game..

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

We disagree and you in as many words say "you'd make a shitty manager" or "you can't grasp this simple concept" "you should slow down"

vs.

Me pointing out your hypothetical of trading an NBA generational prospect who then dies in a car crash for a 10th man to the Lindor trade was ridiculous

I stand by every one of those initial points--and it has nothing to do with a disagreement. If you're incapable of evaluating independent things independently, then you would be poor in a role that expects you to be able to do those things.

Do you think there's anything to the fact that you paint my posts as being a reaction to a disagreement, while you paint your own as you simply "pointing out"? Hmm....

Never mind the fact that you aren't pointing anything out. You're failing to understand an analogy in which we show how a very good trade can end up with poor results.

 

[eChameleon]

Nice little 1-2-3 to start for Cal!