Baker Mayfield: Fire The Cannons

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Most rankings I see still put him in the top 10 QB. I personally hope he gets traded out of Atlanta soon.

Off the top of my head...

Russ
Mahomes
Rodgers
Brady
Brees
Watson
Ben
Josh Allen
Cam
Lamar

If someone thinks Matt Ryan is a top 10 QB, that person is a poor talent evaluator.

 

[Los216]

Dude, you need to get off the "just grab someone else's shit because anything is better than a player in Cleveland" mindset.

Whether it's the Cavs or the Browns, nearly every take of yours for the past decade has been awful. Do we need to keep bringing up every single washed up player with a name, and how you'd give up the franchise for them?

Nobody is saying an elite QB is easy to get. I'm saying that there are only two ways to go--cheap or elite. If you can't get elite, go cheap and build an elite roster around him.

That's not just me saying what to do--I'm almost positive that it's the mindset that Stefanski, Berry, and DePodesta all subscribe to as well because the data backs it up. If you sink a large portion of your cap into Goff, Cousins, Matt Ryan, etc then you've cut yourself off at the knees.

But hey, keep jumping on the trade that we need to chase any QB who has a name. If we can't get MVP Matt Ryan, maybe we can get Super Bowl MVP Joe Flacco or MVP candidate Carson Wentz!

I disagree completely that the only options are cheap or elite. How may teams do we see every year make deep playoff runs with guys who are not cheap or elite? There is a middle ground you know.

And at no point did I suggest to just go out and grab any old QB. I specifically explained why I would be in favor of getting certain guys.

Also it's funny that you mentioned Carson Wentz who no less than 2 years ago people were calling elite. The year the Eagles made the Super Bowl he was an MVP candidate. He got a big contract. Does he suck now? I guess life comes at you fast in the NFL and teams need to have more than none avenue to find a QB. That's what I'm suggesting we do with Baker. Consider all of our options. There's no rule book that says if we move on from Baker we have to go a certain route or else. There's plenty of different routes we can take. I'm suggesting one and that doesn't mean that I think that I'm right. You're getting way too worked up over my "takes" anyway.

 

[Los216]

Off the top of my head...

Russ
Mahomes
Rodgers
Brady
Brees
Watson
Ben
Josh Allen
Cam
Lamar

If someone thinks Matt Ryan is a top 10 QB, that person is a poor talent evaluator.

I don't see how thinking Matt Ryan is a better option than Drew Brees right now is crazy. Matt Ryan is probably going to play 5 more years. Drew Brees looks finished physically. Tom Brady is also on borrowed time. I think Matt Ryan is a better option than both of them right now.

 

[Los216]

Anyways,

If Baker finishes up this season looking the way he looks now, it's gonna get real ugly around here. I just don't see how people are going to be onboard with rolling with Baker going into next year when there will be better options available for us.

And don't measure Baker to past Browns QB's of the last 20 years. That's a low bar. Keeping Baker because he's better than Josh McCown is not a good enough reason. He was the #1 overall pick in the draft. Let's try to hold him to a higher standard than past Browns QB's who washed out.

 

[CBBI]

I'm not sold on Baker Mayfield developing into an elite QB, but I'm certainly not getting rid of him in favor of acquiring a 36 year old Matt Ryan who has seen his production slip every year since his MVP season.

 

[Huber.]

Off the top of my head...

Russ
Mahomes
Rodgers
Brady
Brees
Watson
Ben
Josh Allen
Cam
Lamar

If someone thinks Matt Ryan is a top 10 QB, that person is a poor talent evaluator.

It's all subjective and fluid

Half of these guys were said to be "done" throughout the season/last season. In the end it doesn't matter.

 

[Amherstcavsfan]

There isn't a single QB that you can trade for that will give you better production than Baker can give you right now. End of Discussion, IMO.

 

[Lee]

Well two weeks ago Cousins was 11/26 for 113 yards, no TD's and 3 INT's against Indianapolis. So I'd say based on the first 5 weeks of this season, yes Baker has played better.

That is a key stat, Minny has a good offensive line, a great rb and some good receiving weapons. Its the same defense minus Leonard, I think that is a very fair comparison.

 

[Lee]

They're close? So where does Matt Ryan rank in compared to Baker and Cousins?

Matt Ryan hasnt been himself this year, Baker has outplayed him so far, Cousins has been bad. But Traditionally Matty Ice is an ex MVP that took his team to the Super Bowl. He was at one time a top 5 QB. He has had years of top production, so to say Baker is better is to early as we need more than 5 games, but so far this season Baker has been better, but I do wonder what is wrong with Matt.

 

[Lee]

Uh, actually yes. That's exactly what I would do. I'd sign or trade for a good veteran QB and have a developmental guy behind him. Maybe a 2nd or 3rd round guy. And the veteran QB doesn't have to be 10 years older than Baker. He just needs to be better. If he's 10 years older like Matt Ryan well then that means our developmental guy might be playing faster than expected.

OK, here is the million dollar question. What QB would you trade for? Who is available that is better than Baker. throw out a name.... I will wait.

 

[MGMT]

The issue I take with “developmental guy behind veteran x” is that these “developmental guys” have an absurdly low success rate. I mean..:insanely fucking low. So when it becomes glaringly obvious that whichever developmental guy you selected in the third/fourth round isn’t even close to being average? What then? Do you just draft another the following year and hope it works? That’s how Stefanski gets victimized and the staff gets cleared out in two years

 

[Lee]

Anyways,

If Baker finishes up this season looking the way he looks now, it's gonna get real ugly around here. I just don't see how people are going to be onboard with rolling with Baker going into next year when there will be better options available for us.

And don't measure Baker to past Browns QB's of the last 20 years. That's a low bar. Keeping Baker because he's better than Josh McCown is not a good enough reason. He was the #1 overall pick in the draft. Let's try to hold him to a higher standard than past Browns QB's who washed out.

35 million for Matt Ryan is not a better option. There is something wrong with him this year and he will be 36 fucking years old next season. Baker has flat out outplayed him this year, I think we are under estimating where Baker has been, probably around top 15 this year. We had hoped he was top 5, he hasn't shown that yet, but you must not watch allot of other teams, there is allot of bad QB play out there, Baker has been very average, some times looks great, some times makes bad plays, but Matt Ryan is not the answer unless the Question is what highly paid QB is in his mid to late 30's and looks like he is on the Major Decline.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I disagree completely that the only options are cheap or elite. How may teams do we see every year make deep playoff runs with guys who are not cheap or elite? There is a middle ground you know.

And at no point did I suggest to just go out and grab any old QB. I specifically explained why I would be in favor of getting certain guys.

Also it's funny that you mentioned Carson Wentz who no less than 2 years ago people were calling elite. The year the Eagles made the Super Bowl he was an MVP candidate. He got a big contract. Does he suck now? I guess life comes at you fast in the NFL and teams need to have more than none avenue to find a QB. That's what I'm suggesting we do with Baker. Consider all of our options. There's no rule book that says if we move on from Baker we have to go a certain route or else. There's plenty of different routes we can take. I'm suggesting one and that doesn't mean that I think that I'm right. You're getting way too worked up over my "takes" anyway.

The article is old now, but goes over why paying for mediocre QB play is a bad move: https://www.pff.com/news/pro-examining-the-statistical-significance-of-paying-franchise-quarterbacks

Last year, the only team that made the playoffs paying a non-elite QB over 20 million a year was Minnesota, and they lost in the Divisional roud.

I think you're validating my point. Just because the national conversation around a guy is popular doesn't mean it's accurate. Carson Wentz, today, is worse than Baker on the field. He was an MVP candidate, but certainly wasn't a top QB in the league. Counting stats aren't worth shit.

There are plenty of different routes we CAN take, but only a couple routes that give us the best possible chance at winning.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter. You're not going to get your Stafford, Ryan, Dak, or whatever other big name you fall in love with as you do over and over again. We're not selling the franchise for Wiggins, or Westbrook, or Dwight Howard just because they used to be good, and we're not overpaying for a middle of the road QB just because you have an itch to see us acquire a big name. Berry, DePodesta and Stefanski are all smarter than that, and it feels good to be able to say that about the Browns organization for the first time in a long time.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

It's all subjective and fluid

Half of these guys were said to be "done" throughout the season/last season. In the end it doesn't matter.

The people calling them "done" are bad evaluators.

It's likely they're major media pundits who need to write articles to generate clicks, rather than people actually providing football insight.

It's like the people who were calling Rodgers cooked. The dude had one of his best seasons last year, and is currently neck and neck with Russ for MVP of this year.

 

[OptimusPrime]

I'm not even happy with how Mayfield has played this year, but Matt Ryan isn't better than him. Case Keenum is probably as good or better than any veteran that they could bring in here. We just have to hope Mayfield figures it out, because upgrading even from a mediocre QB isn't that easy.