Darius Kinnard Garland

[shoes22]

Also Kyrie gets hurt all the damn time and is incapable of playing a full season (I don’t believe he will ever again) without missing 25+ games. That needs to be taken into account too.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

That's for you to decide, since you and several others want to argue that a 3rd-year PG who hasn't seen the playoffs has a higher ceiling than a guy who co-destroyed the Warriors with LeBron.



I didn't say anything about being a better all-around player. King of the Hot Takes felt it necessary to call old boy a higher ceiling raiser than a guy I saw perform at the highest level on the highest stage. Anybody seriously propounding that argument is guilty of disingenuous, rabid homerism. The guy who gives you the best chance to win a title is the higher ceiling raiser and I saw Kyrie, as insufferable as he currently is, do that for this particular franchise.

There really isn't anything else that needs to be said on this matter.

Speak to me directly (not necessary).

Quote this when Garland becomes a better player than Kyrie Irving. I saw where Kyrie had led the Cavs when Lebron wasn't on the team.

 

[MirORich]

That's for you to decide, since you and several others want to argue that a 3rd-year PG who hasn't seen the playoffs has a higher ceiling than a guy who co-destroyed the Warriors with LeBron.



I didn't say anything about being a better all-around player. King of the Hot Takes felt it necessary to call old boy a higher ceiling raiser than a guy I saw perform at the highest level on the highest stage. Anybody seriously propounding that argument is guilty of disingenuous, rabid homerism. The guy who gives you the best chance to win a title is the higher ceiling raiser and I saw Kyrie, as insufferable as he currently is, do that for this particular franchise.

There really isn't anything else that needs to be said on this matter.

I'll admit, I just entered this part of the thread like a dude at the bar that runs into the brawl he has nothing to do with, armed with time travel dad jokes and little else.

Regarding Kyrie, I saw him do some of the most poetic scoring I've ever seen in the NBA.

I know we won a title with him and with major major superstar contributions from him. I have no idea how any other star to superstar level player would have performed in a hypothetical, impossible to re-enact scenario.

Love what we're seeing out of Kyrie.

Miss your Ty Lue avatar but I guess it really wouldn't make much sense these days.

*Climbing out from underneath the scuffle, avoiding poolsticks and haymakers and headed out to the parking for smoke*

 

[Futuredome]

If Garland had been drafted in 2007, does LeBron ever leave???? Time paradox

 

[JMoneyYourHoney]

Speak to me directly bitch.

Quote this when Garland becomes a better player than Kyrie Irving. I saw where Kyrie had led the Cavs when Lebron wasn't on the team.

I've already quoted you directly, (also not necessary). I have zero interest in quoting you in a hypothetical world where Darius Garland becomes a better basketball player than Kyrie Irving. I'm stomping out the flaming bag of dog shit that is current DG being a higher ceiling raiser than "3 pointer in the grill of Steph to seal the deal" KI.

 

[PIP]

Speak to me directly bitch.

 

[PIP]

All I’m gonna say for now is Darius wears Kyrie’s shoes…

Until Darius has his own shoe it is settled….

 

[kookoo]

This is the first season Garland has really been given the keys. It was Collin's the last couple. We're seeing what Garland can do as the leader, and it's amazing. Year 3 Darius is better than year 3 Kyrie from an efficiency and passing standpoint. Took Kyrie until year 6 to average 25 PPG so trajectory wise, Garland has a shot at getting close to Kyrie's peak scoring but also blowing him away as a passer. Everything else seems quite level.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

I've already quoted you directly, bitch. I have zero interest in quoting you in a hypothetical world where Darius Garland becomes a better basketball player than Kyrie Irving. I'm stomping out the flaming bag of dog shit that is current DG being a higher ceiling raiser than "3 pointer in the grill of Steph to seal the deal" KI.

Do whatever the heck you want, but you do realize that "DG being a higher ceiling raiser" wasn't even close to being the main thought of my reflection? it was a side mark to open what I think of Garland and his future. Coincidently he matched up with Kyrie today.

Don't really understand why you were being so fired up telling me to get the fuck out like who gives a fuck about Kyrie fucking Irving right now.

Garland is a leader. Kyrie isn't and wasn't.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

You watched Kyrie outplay the reigning MVP in the Finals by putting up 27 points on elite efficiency and hit one of the clutchest shots in league history to help us win our first title against a 73-win team and you're going to sit here and say that a 3rd-year point guard who hasn't even played a lick of playoff basketball is a higher ceiling raiser.

I get we're all stoked about the guy and his future here, but come on...

I really don't think you base a decision as to which guy is the better PG based on the making of one shot.

I'd rather have 2022 Darius Garland as a PG on this team than 2016 Kyrie, who has yet to demonstrate anywhere he's played that he elevates the play of his teammates significantly as a primary ball handler.

He's a better isolation player than is Darius, which is why he paired well with LBJ. But his propensity to ISO also is why he hasn't elevated the play of his teammates much everywhere else.

 

[PIP]

Kyrie is Kobe in a Point Guards body…

Darius is Steve Nash

To run this particular Cavs team as currently constructed you need the Steve Nash style of player over the better scorer (Kobe)…. Your bigs are relying on him to put them in a position to succeed, your perimeter players are relying on him for kick outs….

Yes I do think 2016 Kyrie Irving was a much better scorer and impactful for that team’s need in 2016– but that 2016 Kyrie does not fit what this team needs…

Darius would have been less effective than Kyrie (he may have been a 2009 Mo Williams) — but for this 2022 Cavs team he is a superior fit…

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Kyrie is Kobe in a Point Guards body…
Darius is Steve Nash.

Nice comparison, although Kyrie lacks Kobe's defense. But in terms of Kyrie being a SG, it's interesting to see how the Nets really started clicking when Hardin became the de facto PG, and Kyrie started playing SG.

And Garland is doing what Nash didn't start doing until his late 20's.

 

[PIP]

Nice comparison, although Kyrie lacks Kobe's defense.

And Garland is doing what Nash didn't start doing until his late 20's.

Without question. I was just referring to their offense and what they provided for their team.

Yes Kobe was superior but I don’t think you plug him into that Suns team and they’re anywhere nearly as effective with Kobe over Nash….

Same holds true here… Kyrie is probably a bit more talented now but Darius provides more….

And honestly from that deluxe offensive ability I’d venture to say he’s closing the gap… When Darius puts it in the air I feel it’s money— just like with Kyrie…

 

[foucault87]

Darius and Kyrie are a weird comparison. I don't think their games are similar at all beyond they are both on the shorter end. The Kobe comp was a good one as Kyrie can kind of destroy you and score from anywhere. I remember him isolating in the post against CP3 and Conely and showing a nice hook shot. He has a complete scoring package. His vision was always...mediocre and he was not a particularly good passer - it was option U or W. He was a rich man's Boobie Gibson and a poor man's Brodric Thomas.

Garland is a pure PG. He has to be among the top 15 guys in the league in terms of vision. He has a ton of great passes and always looks for the pass, especially to our bigs. He can shoot and do it well, off the dribble and off screens. He has a really herky jerky attack and can get into the paint and has that beautiful floater game. But I am not expecting him to drop 30 every night nor do I really want him to.

It is pretty clear that Kyrie was a ceiling raiser but not a floor raiser. He does not make teammates better and he can only win you games by scoring an obscene amount of points. He could do it, but unless you are prime Gervin or some similar hyper efficient beast, you need a backup plan. We know Garland can impact the game with his passing, even when he cannot score. Darius is obviosuly a floor raiser. It remains to be seen whether he can raise ceilings too, but based on his play the last few games I think yes.

 

[2 For The Brew]

So many uses of “bitch” in here, sound like the Real Housewives of North Royalton.

Five game winning streak, we just beat the Nets and we have people agitated about everything from Garland’s minutes to arguing about a player’s “ceiling” who is 22 years old and rapidly improving this year.

I still remember watching our team’s last 20 games or so last season. Now THAT was worth bitching about.