The OF Conundrum

Do Not Sell My Personal Information

CDAV45

Dingers!
Joined
Mar 11, 2020
Messages
1,614
Reaction score
992
Points
113
Well Johnson hasn't played in CF in an A game and the last few games Johnson hasnt even played in an A game, so I am not exactly sure what's going on there. Sadly we don't have any of the B game info (why can't both set of games be on TV lol) I would prefer Johnson to be out there over Naylor when it comes to defense.

I know Bimbo said Johnson is focusing on CF in B games, we just haven't seen him play out there yet. So I will wait to see where he ends up, but right now I feel like Naylor is the guy who is the RF going forward. Johnson has to show he can field at similar level as Mercado and Zimmer, plus Zimmer actually is looking better than we thought he would.
Being at the halfway mark in ST, I suspect things will start clearing up a bit in about a week or so. There's just so much we don't know right now and I'm certainly listening to what Bimbo is seeing and hearing.
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2019
Messages
2,472
Reaction score
4,511
Points
113
Zimmer struck out in all three at-bats today. I'm not buying in yet. I say put Johnson out there and let him play until he proves he can't. In the meantime start Amed every day in CF at Columbus once their season starts, then reevaluate at mid-season. If Johnson totally flops we have Mercado as Plan B.
 

sportscoach

Snarly's Gaming Rival!!
Joined
Dec 8, 2016
Messages
6,989
Reaction score
2,850
Points
113
Zimmer struck out in all three at-bats today. I'm not buying in yet. I say put Johnson out there and let him play until he proves he can't. In the meantime start Amed every day in CF at Columbus once their season starts, then reevaluate at mid-season. If Johnson totally flops we have Mercado as Plan B.

Amed isnt going to the minors
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2019
Messages
2,472
Reaction score
4,511
Points
113
Rosario was part of the package for Lindor and Cookie. He is also getting paid $2.4 mil. He isn't playing in Columbus. He also isn't gonna sit on the bench five days a week.
So which position to you see him starting at this year? Keep in mind the center field is a key defensive position and he's never played there in his life.
 

CATS44

NBA Starter
Joined
Feb 25, 2020
Messages
2,908
Reaction score
2,564
Points
113
As soon as we signed Hernandez, I envisioned ARosa in center.

Its just not that difficult of a move. Blake played right field full time at age 31, and he had played six games in left field during his MiLB career up to then....three years earlier.

Rosario is a terrific athlete who runs as fast as just about anybody on our roster and has a plus arm. Had he been on our roster last season, he would have been our fastest player...faster than Mercado and Deshields.

We've had this debate earlier, but there is a ton of examples of infielders who made the switch from inf to outfield, and had great careers out there...and a lot of them are in the HOF.

Shortstop is a natural stepping stone to just about any position on the field.

IMO its much easier to envision ARosa as a plus defender in center than Johnson.

The other option is for ARosa to be a super util, but given that Jose and Hernandez aren't gonna rest much and Reyes is the full time DH, the only way that works is if ARosa plays a lot in the outfield, and we are back to square one.

Given the track records of all the CF candidates, if the FO is serious about maximizing ARosas value, he should be the fav.
 

sportscoach

Snarly's Gaming Rival!!
Joined
Dec 8, 2016
Messages
6,989
Reaction score
2,850
Points
113
Also it's not like Amed hasn't played in the OF some since the Mets had him practicing in LF last season. He is a good enough athlete, so now we just gotta see how his instincts are at the end of the day.
 

PPark

Rookie
Joined
Mar 9, 2020
Messages
36
Reaction score
21
Points
8
I think they should chase the potential in Amed’s bat and carry someone they know can handle CF defensively, Zimmer or Mercado. And go with a 12 man position player roster: meaning enough PA for all.

Until they get some clarity on Luplow that might be the way to go.

Unfortunately I still see Bradley and Johnson starting in AAA and quite possibly Zimmer albeit I like him better at all three OF positions than Mercado.
 

CDAV45

Dingers!
Joined
Mar 11, 2020
Messages
1,614
Reaction score
992
Points
113
Amed Rosario isn't going to play CF in real games anytime soon unless it's in a blowout. I still think he gets dealt before ST is over with. There just isn't a natural place for him on this roster. The only way he sticks is if they do decide to get the extra year of control on Gimenez and give Rosario SS for the start of the season. At that time he'll either prove he's not as bad as everyone thinks and reestablish his value there or everyone will know that he needs to play another position.

I doubt Bradley and Johnson are starting the season in Columbus. Many here think I'm crazy, but it wouldn't surprise me to see Naylor as the one sent to Columbus. No need to get in a hurry just yet, but time is starting to run short and some difficult decisions made.
 

CATS44

NBA Starter
Joined
Feb 25, 2020
Messages
2,908
Reaction score
2,564
Points
113
I disagree on Rosario.

Again, shortstop to centerfield is a natural progression. Not only do I believe he could do it, but I think he could be a plus defender in a short period of time.

He doesn't have to be immediately. All he has to do is hit better than Zimmer and Mercado by a bigger margin than his short term defensive deficiency...and thats nearly a given.
 

CDAV45

Dingers!
Joined
Mar 11, 2020
Messages
1,614
Reaction score
992
Points
113
I disagree on Rosario.

Again, shortstop to centerfield is a natural progression. Not only do I believe he could do it, but I think he could be a plus defender in a short period of time.

He doesn't have to be immediately. All he has to do is hit better than Zimmer and Mercado by a bigger margin than his short term defensive deficiency...and thats nearly a given.
We don't know that it would be a "short term defensive deficiency", and it's no given that he's going to out hit anybody. He's a wildcard at best. He's got some athletic ability and was a highly ranked prospect, but he has shown little ability thus far to get on base at a good clip or hit with any authority. I'm not sure who I'd rather roster between him and Chang TBH, and if I have to choose between Johnson and A. Rosario for CF then I'm taking Johnson everyday of the week and twice on Sunday. Johnson is a much more dynamic player.
 

WhoAzcue

In the Rotation
Joined
Mar 26, 2020
Messages
431
Reaction score
534
Points
93
Well Johnson hasn't played in CF in an A game and the last few games Johnson hasnt even played in an A game, so I am not exactly sure what's going on there.
The last game Johnson played he hurt his foot...he stayed in, but at the time the announcers thought he was pretty shaken up. I think he's nursing a minor injury. Timing sucks for sure, but these things happen. I remain a DJ needs to play RF against RHP guy. Not a fan of either DJ in center or Naylor in RF. Didn't anyone see the liner Naylor misplayed in RF the other day? Precisely the kind of route I worry about. Lacks outfield instincts and I gotta believe we're going to see plenty of opponents go first to third on him. Disappointing that Luplow's ankle isn't responding. Between his ankle and DJ's foot, we're getting screwed in RF. Listen, I like Naylor. A lot. But not so much that I want to fit a square peg in a round hole. I have no problem having him come off the bench if there's no logical defensive place for him. He can bide his time waiting to see if Bobby Bradley can replicate his spring when the lights go on and spell Franmil when there's a righty likely to dice the big guy up...like Gerritt Cole
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2019
Messages
2,472
Reaction score
4,511
Points
113
Well, after last year the Indians need offense and I'm not sure Mercado or Zimmer can provide much. Maybe the best move would be to put Rosario in center and figure he can contribute with his bat while he learns the nuances of route running, going back on a ball, and hitting the cutoff man. The guy hit .287/.755 in over 600 AB's in 2019. Those numbers would look pretty good in center field compared to what we've had out there the last few years. Eventually his defense will come around and we'd have a pretty good player.

I think there's an argument to be made for taking a great athlete who can hit and putting him in center, letting his defense catch up to his bat.

Given the Indians financial issues I'm not sure if Eddie Rosario will get more than one year. I could see an outfield of Johnson, A. Rosario, and Naylor next year if Bradley proves he can hit and field well enough to play first base. But we'll need to find a spot for Daniel Jones by then.
 

CATS44

NBA Starter
Joined
Feb 25, 2020
Messages
2,908
Reaction score
2,564
Points
113
We don't know that it would be a "short term defensive deficiency", and it's no given that he's going to out hit anybody. He's a wildcard at best. He's got some athletic ability and was a highly ranked prospect, but he has shown little ability thus far to get on base at a good clip or hit with any authority. I'm not sure who I'd rather roster between him and Chang TBH, and if I have to choose between Johnson and A. Rosario for CF then I'm taking Johnson everyday of the week and twice on Sunday. Johnson is a much more dynamic player.

Based on what do you state that Johnson is a more dynamic player?

Or that he would make a better CF?

Or that you might prefer Chang as the util?

Because Rosario is younger? He is.

Because Rosario has spent four years in MLB while they could build up stats in the minors? He has.

Rosario wasn't just a highly ranked recruit with 'some' athletic ability. He was ranked higher than any prospect weve had since Sandy Alomar...higher than Grady, higher than Lindor.

If Chang and Johnson had been forced to play in MLB from age 21 on, what do you think they would look like now? Or if Rosario would be emerging today as a candidate, which one do you think everyone would be drooling over now?

Right now the org is betting on Bradley and to do so they are trying to fit two round pegs...Naylor and maybe Johnson...into two square holes...to make it work. Moving a fast and athletic SS with a plus arm to center field is not a round peg into a square hole type of thing.

And look at it this way....if they truly thought that Johnson was the answer in CF, why would they move Rosario there...and why isn't Johnson getting a long look there now?

And if Johnson was such a super prospect at nearly 26 yrs old, why hasn't he been playing at the MLB level for a team that has had one of the worst outfield in all baseball for several seasons.

We have watched Naquin, Kip, and Deshields butcher center field over the last several years. Rosario is likely to be a huge improvement over them in a very short time.

There has to be someone, but I can't think of one MLB SS who failed defensively when he moved to CF. But I can think of plenty who did quite well.
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2019
Messages
2,472
Reaction score
4,511
Points
113
Center field has been an offensive black hole for the Indians since Grady Sizemore. I went back ten years and only twice did I find a center fielder who exceeded .700 in OPS; Austin Jackson in 2017 (.869 in only 280 AB's) and Oscar Mercado in 2019 (.761 in 438 AB's).

The rest of the time it was either Rajai Davis, Brad Zimmer, Leonys Martin, Delino DeShields, Drew Stubbs, or Michael Bourn. So I'm in favor of putting somebody out there who can hit and has speed. He can learn how to play the position as he goes. We will have to tolerate some balls dropping in due to late breaks and badly run routes for a while, but like I said, this team needs offense.

That being said, what about Oscar Mercado? In his first experience in the bigs in 2019 he had an OPS of .761 in 438 AB's. Also in 2019, Amed Rosario had an OPS of .755 in 616 AB's. It was his third year in the bigs but his OPS was actually a little lower than Mercado's. So what makes us think Rosario will be a better hitter or defender in center than Mercado this season or even in the future?

They both have great speed. Mercado is a year older but his offensive production in his first year matched that of Rosario in his third. They both hit 15 home runs in 2019, but Mercado did it in 178 fewer at-bats. Mercado was 15-for-19 in stolen bases while Rosario was 19-for-29.

I don't see how one can justify the case for Rosario over Mercado in center this year, especially since Rosario has never played the position. Mercado is obviously the better defender right now and he hit for more power and was better at stealing bases in the last full season.

Mercado's WAR in 2019 was 2.2 compared to 1.8 for Rosario. If you equalize the number of at-bats Mercado's WAR goes up to 3.1.
 
Last edited:

New Ownership

Total amount
$2,645.00
Donation ends:
Top