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Isaac 3 & D Okoro - A Two Way Playing Basketball Savant

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Who is Isaac Okoro's Favorite Eastern Roman (Byzantine) Emperor?

  • Arcadius (if one does not count Constantine as first)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Justinian the Great

    Votes: 9 15.8%
  • Zeno

    Votes: 2 3.5%
  • Heraclius

    Votes: 3 5.3%
  • Basil II, the Bulgar Slayer

    Votes: 6 10.5%
  • Nikephoros II Phokas, the Pale Death of the Saracens

    Votes: 7 12.3%
  • Alexios I Komnenos

    Votes: 4 7.0%
  • John II, the Beautiful Komnenos

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Constantine XI

    Votes: 4 7.0%
  • Jim I Chones, the Magnificent

    Votes: 26 45.6%

  • Total voters
    57
Okoro isn't a bust: he's a project whose going to take several years to get better
The problem as a project he may not get all that much better either.
It's a lot easier when a player shows more early as that typically means they have a higher shot of panning out
 
I don't quite understand this dogmatic approach to developing him.

Just every night putting him out for the 30+ minutes against starters, normally out of position.

Why not at least try and bring him off the bench? Let him get some confidence against backups. Play the 2.

I'm ok with the first approach but we've seen enough now to say they need to try something a little different.
 
I don't quite understand this dogmatic approach to developing him.

Just every night putting him out for the 30+ minutes against starters, normally out of position.

Why not at least try and bring him off the bench? Let him get some confidence against backups. Play the 2.

I'm ok with the first approach but we've seen enough now to say they need to try something a little different.
I could not agree more. It does not look like we are helping him. I think he might need a break. He’s never even gone through the grind of a normal college season, much less the NBA. A little “injury” where he got a week or two to watch and reset might do him some good.
 
I don't quite understand this dogmatic approach to developing him.

Just every night putting him out for the 30+ minutes against starters, normally out of position.

Why not at least try and bring him off the bench? Let him get some confidence against backups. Play the 2.

I'm ok with the first approach but we've seen enough now to say they need to try something a little different.

clueless coaching, Lamelo Ball was brought off the bench to start the season, was benched some games for his bad play and turnovers. Now he’s starting and playing great basketball. He was also a much more NBA ready prospect and still had to earn his minutes. That’s good coaching JBB is a moron
 
clueless coaching, Lamelo Ball was brought off the bench to start the season, was benched some games for his bad play and turnovers. Now he’s starting and playing great basketball. He was also a much more NBA ready prospect and still had to earn his minutes. That’s good coaching JBB is a moron
They did this before JBB.. it's a team-wide philosophy. Lue was canned because he wanted Sexton to earn time.
 
Sam Vecenie of The Athletic is putting up his annual ranking of the NBA's 50 best young players, meaning first round picks on their rookie contracts and second rounders on their first contracts. He got some help from over a dozen NBA executives and scouts. Isaac Okoro is ranked #38. Jarrett Allen is at #43. I put his write-up in his thread.

38. Isaac Okoro | 6-6 wing, 19 years old | Cleveland Cavaliers | Contract: 4 years, $29.1 million, last two years team options | PR: Drafted in 2020

I had Okoro at No. 5 on my board entering the draft, largely because I really believed in his defense and ability to play a role early in his NBA career. His sheer presence on the court makes teams better because he’s willing to do whatever it takes to win, including get physical and tough on defense while doing the dirty work. I thought pre-draft that he profiled as a potential borderline All-Defense wing at some point because of the intersection of his strength and quickness, his willingness to battle and his instincts in help. So far, all of that has come to fruition for the Cavaliers and then some.

Okoro has immediately entered the starting lineup and been a huge part of the early-season success they had on that end prior to Larry Nance Jr. going out. Over the last two years, Cleveland genuinely had one of the worst defenses in NBA history. They finished dead last in 2019 and second-to-last in 2020 in defensive efficiency. About a quarter of the way through the 2020-21 season, the Cavaliers had a top-10 defense. In large part, that was because coach J.B. Bickerstaff has them fighting and scratching to get through every screen while staying connected in rotation on the back end. But Okoro and Larry Nance Jr. are the linchpins who hold it together. I’d bet we see real improvement after Nance returns. The rookie is playing a ridiculous 36 minutes per night and taking on every single tough perimeter defensive assignment imaginable. He singlehandedly turned a game against the Grizzlies in the second half with ridiculous on-ball defensive pressure, including a number of deflections and blocks that led to run-outs for the Cavs’ offense. Pay special attention to the way he locks and trails to get through off-ball screening actions. It’s superb for even a seasoned veteran. Then, he’ll fight to get over the top of on-ball screens, and he’s terrific at bumping offensive players without fouling so they know his presence is there.

How far Okoro gets in the NBA is going to come down to his offense. He’s already valuable because of the defense, but to be a true difference-maker, he’s either going to need to shoot it or become an on-ball creator himself. He’s definitely not a shooter yet, but I do think there is some on-ball upside. He sees the court well and can handle it for a teenage wing. His jumper looks a bit better off the bounce than it does off the catch. If he can even become an average offensive NBA player, he’ll skyrocket up this list because of the value he could hold in the playoffs as an energy defender against the kind of tough, big wings who tend to succeed in the playoffs. But he needs to show some signs on that end first.
 
Sam Vecenie of The Athletic is putting up his annual ranking of the NBA's 50 best young players, meaning first round picks on their rookie contracts and second rounders on their first contracts. He got some help from over a dozen NBA executives and scouts. Isaac Okoro is ranked #38. Jarrett Allen is at #43. I put his write-up in his thread.

38. Isaac Okoro | 6-6 wing, 19 years old | Cleveland Cavaliers | Contract: 4 years, $29.1 million, last two years team options | PR: Drafted in 2020

I had Okoro at No. 5 on my board entering the draft, largely because I really believed in his defense and ability to play a role early in his NBA career. His sheer presence on the court makes teams better because he’s willing to do whatever it takes to win, including get physical and tough on defense while doing the dirty work. I thought pre-draft that he profiled as a potential borderline All-Defense wing at some point because of the intersection of his strength and quickness, his willingness to battle and his instincts in help. So far, all of that has come to fruition for the Cavaliers and then some.

Okoro has immediately entered the starting lineup and been a huge part of the early-season success they had on that end prior to Larry Nance Jr. going out. Over the last two years, Cleveland genuinely had one of the worst defenses in NBA history. They finished dead last in 2019 and second-to-last in 2020 in defensive efficiency. About a quarter of the way through the 2020-21 season, the Cavaliers had a top-10 defense. In large part, that was because coach J.B. Bickerstaff has them fighting and scratching to get through every screen while staying connected in rotation on the back end. But Okoro and Larry Nance Jr. are the linchpins who hold it together. I’d bet we see real improvement after Nance returns. The rookie is playing a ridiculous 36 minutes per night and taking on every single tough perimeter defensive assignment imaginable. He singlehandedly turned a game against the Grizzlies in the second half with ridiculous on-ball defensive pressure, including a number of deflections and blocks that led to run-outs for the Cavs’ offense. Pay special attention to the way he locks and trails to get through off-ball screening actions. It’s superb for even a seasoned veteran. Then, he’ll fight to get over the top of on-ball screens, and he’s terrific at bumping offensive players without fouling so they know his presence is there.

How far Okoro gets in the NBA is going to come down to his offense. He’s already valuable because of the defense, but to be a true difference-maker, he’s either going to need to shoot it or become an on-ball creator himself. He’s definitely not a shooter yet, but I do think there is some on-ball upside. He sees the court well and can handle it for a teenage wing. His jumper looks a bit better off the bounce than it does off the catch. If he can even become an average offensive NBA player, he’ll skyrocket up this list because of the value he could hold in the playoffs as an energy defender against the kind of tough, big wings who tend to succeed in the playoffs. But he needs to show some signs on that end first.
My eye's do not deceive. Still on the Okoro train, will see the rest of you middle of next season.
 
Sam Vecenie of The Athletic is putting up his annual ranking of the NBA's 50 best young players, meaning first round picks on their rookie contracts and second rounders on their first contracts. He got some help from over a dozen NBA executives and scouts. Isaac Okoro is ranked #38. Jarrett Allen is at #43. I put his write-up in his thread.

38. Isaac Okoro | 6-6 wing, 19 years old | Cleveland Cavaliers | Contract: 4 years, $29.1 million, last two years team options | PR: Drafted in 2020

I had Okoro at No. 5 on my board entering the draft, largely because I really believed in his defense and ability to play a role early in his NBA career. His sheer presence on the court makes teams better because he’s willing to do whatever it takes to win, including get physical and tough on defense while doing the dirty work. I thought pre-draft that he profiled as a potential borderline All-Defense wing at some point because of the intersection of his strength and quickness, his willingness to battle and his instincts in help. So far, all of that has come to fruition for the Cavaliers and then some.

Okoro has immediately entered the starting lineup and been a huge part of the early-season success they had on that end prior to Larry Nance Jr. going out. Over the last two years, Cleveland genuinely had one of the worst defenses in NBA history. They finished dead last in 2019 and second-to-last in 2020 in defensive efficiency. About a quarter of the way through the 2020-21 season, the Cavaliers had a top-10 defense. In large part, that was because coach J.B. Bickerstaff has them fighting and scratching to get through every screen while staying connected in rotation on the back end. But Okoro and Larry Nance Jr. are the linchpins who hold it together. I’d bet we see real improvement after Nance returns. The rookie is playing a ridiculous 36 minutes per night and taking on every single tough perimeter defensive assignment imaginable. He singlehandedly turned a game against the Grizzlies in the second half with ridiculous on-ball defensive pressure, including a number of deflections and blocks that led to run-outs for the Cavs’ offense. Pay special attention to the way he locks and trails to get through off-ball screening actions. It’s superb for even a seasoned veteran. Then, he’ll fight to get over the top of on-ball screens, and he’s terrific at bumping offensive players without fouling so they know his presence is there.

How far Okoro gets in the NBA is going to come down to his offense. He’s already valuable because of the defense, but to be a true difference-maker, he’s either going to need to shoot it or become an on-ball creator himself. He’s definitely not a shooter yet, but I do think there is some on-ball upside. He sees the court well and can handle it for a teenage wing. His jumper looks a bit better off the bounce than it does off the catch. If he can even become an average offensive NBA player, he’ll skyrocket up this list because of the value he could hold in the playoffs as an energy defender against the kind of tough, big wings who tend to succeed in the playoffs. But he needs to show some signs on that end first.
Has this guy actually watched him play in the last month? Any list that has Allen 5 spots below Okoro must be discounted as satire. Sounds like a “I had him evaluated highly and now I’m digging for something that makes me look like I know what I’m talking about” article.
 
Has this guy actually watched him play in the last month? Any list that has Allen 5 spots below Okoro must be discounted as satire. Sounds like a “I had him evaluated highly and now I’m digging for something that makes me look like I know what I’m talking about” article.
I agree with Sam's first paragraph but disagree somewhat with the second. The Cavs' dramatic improvement defensively from last season to the first 20 games of this season was due mainly to Drummond and Nance getting the lion's share of the minutes in place of Thompson and Love. Okoro was probably a modest upgrade over Cedi but I wouldn't give him too much credit for the improved defense.

I agree Allen should be ranked ahead of Okoro, especially if you put more weight on the last couple of weeks than earlier in the season when Allen was coming off the Brooklyn bench.

Nice to see Okoro put up 11 three-pointers last night, making four at 36.4%. I think we'd be happy with 36.4% for now and hope for an uptick over the next couple of years. My feeling is the more he shoots them the better the results will be.
 
Has this guy actually watched him play in the last month? Any list that has Allen 5 spots below Okoro must be discounted as satire. Sounds like a “I had him evaluated highly and now I’m digging for something that makes me look like I know what I’m talking about” article.

I literally laughed out loud when I read the article and saw he had Okoro 5 spots above Allen... hahahahahahahah
 
He looks like a raw rookie,which he is. I see him rushing shots, or passing up shots. I think there's too much pressure on him,plus the vets he guards know they can work him.
Now that doesn't mean he won't get better but Bicker might need to bring him off the bench for a while to help him.
 
I literally laughed out loud when I read the article and saw he had Okoro 5 spots above Allen... hahahahahahahah
It might have something to do with the fact that Allen is in his fourth season while Okoro is a rookie who leads all rookies in minutes played. But Sam is definitely banking on Okoro's offensive game improving quite a bit.

In the coming days he'll reveal his picks for 1-35. I'm thinking Sexton should be in that group, but not in the top 25.
 
He has been more aggressive since the Drummond benching. That is all I want to see

Keep working. This trial by fire will pay off at some point.

JB said he has been tasked with the toughest opponent every night and a young guy like Okoro will focus on that to the possible detriment of his offense. Seems like that has been what is going on. JB said they were going to give him more help and allow him to do a little more offensively
 
He has been more aggressive since the Drummond benching. That is all I want to see

Keep working. This trial by fire will pay off at some point.

JB said he has been tasked with the toughest opponent every night and a young guy like Okoro will focus on that to the possible detriment of his offense. Seems like that has been what is going on. JB said they were going to give him more help and allow him to do a little more offensively
I'd be more okay with trial by fire if we were playing him big minutes at his right position.
 
I'd be more okay with trial by fire if we were playing him big minutes at his right position.

To be fair, he's the best SF on the roster. I like Windler, but he is too light in the britches and isn't in good enough condition to play starters minutes yet.

Tristan got destroyed every game as a rook. It was rough like this. PF's were the top scorers in the league at the time and it was just a bad matchup every night and feels eerily similar to this. He looked small, he looked overpowered. He learned and he got stronger and he did little things that made you go "ok, but he still sucks" I think that is where Okoro is. I like most of what he is doing.

I think we can tell that the game has yet to slow down for Okoro by the offensive end. He looks like he is doing the right thing but gets out of control.

I do think he would have more success at SG as a Marcus Smart type. I originally thought it would be a good idea to have him come in and spell whichever guard was getting abused worse as a 6th man.
 

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