The Andre Drummond Thread

[Rich]

I still don't see how Dion's skill set and upside was considered better than Drummond's by our FO.

The same way all of the other FOs thought the guy they choose would be better than Drummond.....

Look, people. I'm not sure what you're wanting at this point. You want Grant to come out and say "I missed on Drummond" or what? Andre Drummond is a better player than Dion Waiters.

Next.

 

[gourimoko]

The same way all of the other FOs thought the guy they choose would be better than Drummond.....

Look, people. I'm not sure what you're wanting at this point. You want Grant to come out and say "I missed on Drummond" or what? Andre Drummond is a better player than Dion Waiters.

Next.

I think people are just asking for the same level of accountability that we (especially you :chuckles ask of our players. Why does Grant get a pass when Kyrie doesn't? Passing on Drummond will likely be remembered as one of the worst draft decisions in Cavaliers history. And just because we had other GMs going along doesn't make it any better of a decision. We drafted someone we didn't interview, and didn't measure on our own. Both Dion and Drummond were raw, and both need years of development, but Drummond obviously had the highest upside with the greatest value, with the most scarce qualities you can find - yet we decided to take Dion Waiters.

It's really inexcusable.

I have no problem in saying that Grant, after these last few years, should lose his job - and these past drafts should weigh heavily in that decision.

 

[Rich]

I think people are just asking for the same level of accountability that we (especially you :chuckles ask of our players. Why does Grant get a pass when Kyrie doesn't? Passing on Drummond will likely be remembered as one of the worst draft decisions in Cavaliers history. And just because we had other GMs going along doesn't make it any better of a decision. We drafted someone we didn't interview, and didn't measure on our own. Both Dion and Drummond were raw, and both need years of development, but Drummond obviously had the highest upside with the greatest value, with the most scarce qualities you can find - yet we decided to take Dion Waiters.

It's really inexcusable.

I have no problem in saying that Grant, after these last few years, should lose his job - and these past drafts should weigh heavily in that decision.

Because Kyrie Irving's play is on-going thing. It can be changed and is actively having an impact on games. The Drummond thing is over. Done. You can't go back and change it. If he gets fired he gets fired. But continuing to ask "HOW DID WE PASS ON THIS GUY??" is really, really tiresome. We passed. Over a year ago. Year and a half ago at this point. There is no fixing it or doing it over.

 

[RealKingofCleve]

Where's my boy Torn at? Biggest Drummond skeptic on the board. Would be interested in his current take?

 

[Spencer Hawes]

Seems like everything you're bitching about has nothing to do with my post that you quoted, so not sure why it's a reply to what I posted.

I glossed over your post because we all know what Dumars did with the Gordan/Villanueva and Smith/Jennings signing. So he took a chance and it didn't work out. Boo fucking who. But he did build a championship team which something 25+ GM's never did. Your point was that we're no closer to a championship than Detroit. Since you posted that in a Drummond thread after he had a game that nobody else had in 26 years, you're basically taking a shot at the kid. How can a "role player" be the scapegoat for the Pistons poor record? They had a new coach, a new system and this is his first year of "starting" and people like you like to bitch about how his "weaknesses" contributes heavily to Detroit's record. Whatever floats your boat.

I got a thought though, how about we make a friendly wager and put our money where our mouths are. I will donate $10 to RCF if we make the playoffs before Detroit and you donate $10 to RCF if Detroit makes it there first? I'm basically called out all the people bitching about Drummond and nobody wants to put their money where their mouths are. Are you gonna be a coward like them too?

 

[Tornicade]

My current take is that last season when Byron opted for the hack a drummond route it turned out badly. Jennings is looking like a real good acquisition for the Pistons he is really distributing the ball for the first time in his career. Philly did a horrible job putting a body on Drummond before he got to the restricted area and were careless with the ball.

 

[Spencer Hawes]

As soon as Drummond touched the court last year, I did the same thing with him that I have done with Jonas, Klay THompson, Kawhi, Manimal, Harrison Barnes and now Ben McLemore and Victor Oladipo...

Tell yourself that those guys were picked just before we had a chance to draft them, and put them out of your mind.

Otherwise you will go insane. To miss on a talent like Drummond hurts.

Honestly, Blue Kahuna, its time to move on bruh. You bring more to this board than these repetitive Drummond posts. The entire league has already acknowledged that any GM after NOLA who passed on Drummond really missed the ball, no denial from any Chris Grant apologist will absolve him of totally missing a franchise changing talent like this. He very well may still have to answer for that. I know I am about 0% confident in his prep to pro evaluation skills now so Im hoping we dont need to rely on that from him again.

I hear you my man and I'll try to channel positive energy in this thread from here on out lol...but man, it hurts when he was right there for the taking...CG just needed some balls.

 

[Spencer Hawes]

My current take is that last season when Byron opted for the hack a drummond route it turned out badly. Jennings is looking like a real good acquisition for the Pistons he is really distributing the ball for the first time in his career. Philly did a horrible job putting a body on Drummond before he got to the restricted area and were careless with the ball.

I know, it was all Philly's fault that Drummond dominated them inside.

 

[gourimoko]

Because Kyrie Irving's play is on-going thing. It can be changed and is actively having an impact on games. The Drummond thing is over. Done. You can't go back and change it. If he gets fired he gets fired. But continuing to ask "HOW DID WE PASS ON THIS GUY??" is really, really tiresome. We passed. Over a year ago. Year and a half ago at this point. There is no fixing it or doing it over.

Rich, Christ Grant has as much influence over the future of the Cavaliers franchise as Kyrie Irving, if not more. You don't understand why it's important to make sure your GM can spot talent when you're going into the 2014 draft? You don't understand why it's important that your GM knows how to make trades that are not entirely centered around the owner's willingness to take on salary?

I fear what might happen prior to the trade deadline, and I fear what might happen in the offseason if we end up with say, the 5th pick in a deep draft. Does Grant learn from his mistakes with Waiters and Bennett or not? Honestly, I'd rather he just not be making the pick. Hence the conversation.

 

[mAo_mAo]

My current take is that last season when Byron opted for the hack a drummond route it turned out badly. Jennings is looking like a real good acquisition for the Pistons he is really distributing the ball for the first time in his career. Philly did a horrible job putting a body on Drummond before he got to the restricted area and were careless with the ball.

Philly can not put a body on him because they just don't have the type of personnel to matchup. Spencer Hawes was manhandled. They put a stronger but smaller player in Lavoy Allen but was still overmatched. They went full strength mode with Daniel Orton and still he can not be contained. There are only a handful of players that can physically match up with this dude and we currently don't have one.

Imagine AD plus 30 pounds of muscle. He will be a bigger version of Dwight. That is freaking scary.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I glossed over your post because we all know what Dumars did with the Gordan/Villanueva and Smith/Jennings signing. So he took a chance and it didn't work out. Boo fucking who. But he did build a championship team which something 25+ GM's never did. Your point was that we're no closer to a championship than Detroit. Since you posted that in a Drummond thread after he had a game that nobody else had in 26 years, you're basically taking a shot at the kid. How can a "role player" be the scapegoat for the Pistons poor record? They had a new coach, a new system and this is his first year of "starting" and people like you like to bitch about how his "weaknesses" contributes heavily to Detroit's record. Whatever floats your boat.

Grant took a chance on Waiters and it didn't work out. Grant took a chance on Bennett and it didn't work out. Do you even read before you type? You want to constantly bitch about Grant's drafting, but you are giving Dumars a free pass on two of the worst free agent signings in league history? Two free agency signing that essentially crippled his team for multiple seasons, and will have an impact on the team's future until at least this off season? Get that weak stuff outta here!

If you read my posts, you'd see they had nothing to do with Drummond and everything to do with your worshiping of Dumars because he drafted Drummond. I'm fine with the fact that Grant should have drafted Drummond. He probably should have based on the evidence we have at hand right now. I didn't even mention Drummond in either of my posts that you've quoted. All I did was counter your ridiculously terrible points. You're the one who can't let the Drummond draft go. Not me. I'm over it. I've moved on, as have most Cavs fans. We can't go back and re-draft, and none of us has the personal power to fire our GM because we disagreed with his decision in the 2012 draft. At this point, it's just really fucking sad that some of you can't let go.

And my point is absolutely that we're no further to a championship to Detroit, despite rebuilding for two to three less years. Shouldn't that come into play when evaluating two GMs? Yes, Dumars won a championship over half a decade ago, but the NBA is a "what have you done for me lately" league, and lately he should have been fired several times over. Since breaking up that championship team, Dumars has proven approximately dick. His teams have sucked and his free agency signings have been about as bad as is possible.

I got a thought though, how about we make a friendly wager and put our money where our mouths are. I will donate $10 to RCF if we make the playoffs before Detroit and you donate $10 to RCF if Detroit makes it there first? I'm basically called out all the people bitching about Drummond and nobody wants to put their money where their mouths are. Are you gonna be a coward like them too?

Sure, I'll take your bet, but with the caveat that, if Detroit and Cleveland both make the playoffs this year, we each pay ten dollars regardless of seeding. Seems fair given the argument.

---

Bottom line, I really don't get why you seem to think I hate Drummond. I don't, or at least not for any other reason than he's a Piston and, being a Cavs fan, it's my job to hate his ass. If we had drafted him, I'd be supporting his ass the same way I support Dion, Kyrie, Thompson, Zeller, Bennett, Karasev, and anyone else we draft. What I really don't understand is this incessant need for some of you to suck this guy's dick every time he posts a great stat line, or the need to diminish the guy we drafted instead of him. We didn't draft Drummond, and while that might suck, it's time to move on.

 

[getBUCKED]

This is hands down the worst thread on RCF.

 

[gourimoko]

Grant took a chance on Waiters and it didn't work out. Grant took a chance on Bennett and it didn't work out. Do you even read before you type? You want to constantly bitch about Grant's drafting, but you are giving Dumars a free pass on two of the worst free agent signings in league history? Two free agency signing that essentially crippled his team for multiple seasons, and will have an impact on the team's future until at least this off season? Get that weak stuff outta here!

If you read my posts, you'd see they had nothing to do with Drummond and everything to do with your worshiping of Dumars because he drafted Drummond. I'm fine with the fact that Grant should have drafted Drummond. He probably should have based on the evidence we have at hand right now. I didn't even mention Drummond in either of my posts that you've quoted. All I did was counter your ridiculously terrible points. You're the one who can't let the Drummond draft go. Not me. I'm over it. I've moved on, as have most Cavs fans. We can't go back and re-draft, and none of us has the personal power to fire our GM because we disagreed with his decision in the 2012 draft. At this point, it's just really fucking sad that some of you can't let go.

And my point is absolutely that we're no further to a championship to Detroit, despite rebuilding for two to three less years. Shouldn't that come into play when evaluating two GMs? Yes, Dumars won a championship over half a decade ago, but the NBA is a "what have you done for me lately" league, and lately he should have been fired several times over. Since breaking up that championship team, Dumars has proven approximately dick. His teams have sucked and his free agency signings have been about as bad as is possible.

Bottom line, I really don't get why you seem to think I hate Drummond. I don't, or at least not for any other reason than he's a Piston and, being a Cavs fan, it's my job to hate his ass. If we had drafted him, I'd be supporting his ass the same way I support Dion, Kyrie, Thompson, Zeller, Bennett, Karasev, and anyone else we draft. What I really don't understand is this incessant need for some of you to suck this guy's dick every time he posts a great stat line, or the need to diminish the guy we drafted instead of him. We didn't draft Drummond, and while that might suck, it's time to move on.

Who are you talking about with these comments?

 

[Jack Brickman]

Who are you talking about with these comments?

Mostly the guy I quoted, but also a few other people as well. It's not hard to read this topic and see who they are.

 

[gourimoko]

Mostly the guy I quoted, but also a few other people as well. It's not hard to read this topic and see who they are.

I dunno.. Kinda hard to tell who's being told they're "suckin dick" and who's not. Just because Grant blew the draft doesn't mean Drummond supporters are "bitches" out here "sucking dick."

Saying that type of shit would get your ass dragged out into the street and beat where I'm from. So let's be easy with all the ambiguously directed insults and off-the-wall comments directed towards "some people."

Let's just debate Grant and Drummond..