The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread (includes spoilers)

[QuadrupleDouble]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Little finger couldn't and wouldn't sit the throne, but he could sure pull the strings of a puppet king

 

[Chris]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

He's quoted as saying, "Everything" or something to that extent when asked what it is he wants.

He has big plans.

 

[Rich]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I just don't know what show some have you been watching. He definitely WANTS to sit on the Throne. We've caught him multiple times either stealing glances at the Throne or just flat out staring at it. We know he's counted the blades. It's absolutely a signal of what he wants.

I think he gets it too.

 

[Chris]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I just don't know what show some have you been watching. He definitely WANTS to sit on the Throne. We've caught him multiple times either stealing glances at the Throne or just flat out staring at it. We know he's counted the blades. It's absolutely a signal of what he wants.

I think he gets it too.

Totally agree.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

I just don't know what show some have you been watching. He definitely WANTS to sit on the Throne. We've caught him multiple times either stealing glances at the Throne or just flat out staring at it. We know he's counted the blades. It's absolutely a signal of what he wants.

I think he gets it too.

He may want it, but I don't think he'll ever sit on it.

 

[The Voice]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Do we think Tywin is physically imposing? Maybe years ago but I doubt many fear him in a fight. His power is solidified much the same way I think Littlefinger's would be. Intelligence, manipulation, and fear. Of course he isn't low born either, I'm just saying I don't think physical prowess is necessarily a pre-requisite. Think people fear Tommen?

Regardless he's a hell of a general and orchestrated the Red wedding.

Tommen people don't fear, but it's his birthright. And he has the family name backing it up.

 

[caf]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Doesn't anyone remember Vary's quote "He [Littlefinger] would burn the seven kingdoms just to rule the ashes."

Dude wants to be king. Dude knows it's a game. Dude's plans are in action. It seems to me that his goal is to have Sansa marry Robert. Reclaim winterfell and the North. Dispatch Robert and marry Sansa. Then he will pretty much be able to call bannermen from Riverrun to the Vale and all the lands north of that. That's a lot of peeps.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Doesn't anyone remember Vary's quote "He [Littlefinger] would burn the seven kingdoms just to rule the ashes."

Dude wants to be king. Dude knows it's a game. Dude's plans are in action. It seems to me that his goal is to have Sansa marry Robert. Reclaim winterfell and the North. Dispatch Robert and marry Sansa. Then he will pretty much be able to call bannermen from Riverrun to the Vale and all the lands north of that. That's a lot of peeps.

Just because he's technically their lord doesn't mean that his bannermen will fight for him. During Robert's rebellion basically every high lord (except probably Ned Stark and the Martells) had bannermen who fought for the other side. Being high lord doesn't give you magical powers over the people who serve you. They still have to love or fear you enough to fight for you, and Littlefinger is short on both.

 

[caf]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Just because he's technically their lord doesn't mean that his bannermen will fight for him. During Robert's rebellion basically every high lord (except probably Ned Stark and the Martells) had bannermen who fought for the other side. Being high lord doesn't give you magical powers over the people who serve you. They still have to love or fear you enough to fight for you, and Littlefinger is short on both.

They love the Starks though. And having Sansa as a Queen regent seems like enough to me.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

The only way I could see LF plausibly sitting the Iron Throne is if he has some huge financial hammer that includes some sort of deal with the Iron Bank.

But here's what bugs me about LF going for the Crown -- why kill Joffrey? LF already said that chaos is good for him, and I can't imagine many things more likely to generate chaos than Joffrey sitting the throne. The little douche would likely have ended up sharing some version of Aerys fate, and that leaves an opening at the top.

But Tommen? He's a good kid who will be well-liked. He's marrying a Tyrell which will cement their alliance. The North, Riverlands, and Stormlands are no longer players, and while Dorne may not bend much of the knee, they don't at this point have any angle to get the throne themselves. To me, it seems like killing Joffrey actually helped stabilize continued Lannister/Tyrell rule.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

They love the Starks though. And having Sansa as a Queen regent seems like enough to me.

It may be enough for the North to bend the knee to Sansa, I don't think that is enough to convince the North to call its banners and march another army south under Littlefinger's "generalship". More likely is the "Kingdom in the North" scenario, where the North would just want to be left alone.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

The only way I could see LF plausibly sitting the Iron Throne is if he has some huge financial hammer that includes some sort of deal with the Iron Bank.

But here's what bugs me about LF going for the Crown -- why kill Joffrey? LF already said that chaos is good for him, and I can't imagine many things more likely to generate chaos than Joffrey sitting the throne. The little douche would likely have ended up sharing some version of Aerys fate, and that leaves an opening at the top.

But Tommen? He's a good kid who will be well-liked. He's marrying a Tyrell which will cement their alliance. The North, Riverlands, and Stormlands are no longer players, and while Dorne may not bend much of the knee, they don't at this point have any angle to get the throne themselves. To me, it seems like killing Joffrey actually helped stabilize continued Lannister/Tyrell rule.

The simple answer is that he needed to eliminate Sansa's husband from the game, and framing Tyrion for the murder of Joffrey was a pretty surefire way to do it. That's the reason, after all, that he

Spoiler

hired those dwarf jousters

. It also provided a huge enough diversion for him to be able to sneak Sansa out of the city safely.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

The simple answer is that he needed to eliminate Sansa's husband from the game, and framing Tyrion for the murder of Joffrey was a pretty surefire way to do it. That's the reason, after all, that he

Spoiler

hired those dwarf jousters

. It also provided a huge enough diversion for him to be able to sneak Sansa out of the city safely.

Okay, good point. But I still don't see what would be his path to the throne, because before trying to make himself King, he'd have to get rid of Tommen.

I suppose one combination of the differing views on this is that becoming Hand is his intermediate goal. Of course, that would require getting rid of Tywin and anyone else who might be plausibly fill that position ahead of him, and there isn't any hint that he's got a plan to do all that. But if he did, and managed to get himself named Hand, then he'd really just be one step away, and he might be able to pull that off somehow.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Okay, good point. But I still don't see what would be his path to the throne, because before trying to make himself King, he'd have to get rid of Tommen.

I suppose one combination of the differing views on this is that becoming Hand is his intermediate goal. Of course, that would require getting rid of Tywin and anyone else who might be plausibly fill that position ahead of him, and there isn't any hint that he's got a plan to do all that. But if he did, and managed to get himself named Hand, then he'd really just be one step away, and he might be able to pull that off somehow.

I think you're assuming his goals are more immediate than they truly are. Littlefinger is running a long con, and disposing of Joffrey was just another piece of it, like eliminating Jon Arryn and then Ned Stark. It seems like he was content for the time being to

Spoiler

train Sansa in the finer details of the game and secure the Vale

while he let the war play out.

After all, Littlefinger is fully aware that not everything is within his control. I doubt he intended for Cat to be murdered, for example. Sometimes he just sits back and lets events unfold, then plays on the outcome.

 

[CardiacCavs]

Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

Doesn't anyone remember Vary's quote "He [Littlefinger] would burn the seven kingdoms just to rule the ashes."

Dude wants to be king. Dude knows it's a game. Dude's plans are in action. It seems to me that his goal is to have Sansa marry Robert. Reclaim winterfell and the North. Dispatch Robert and marry Sansa. Then he will pretty much be able to call bannermen from Riverrun to the Vale and all the lands north of that. That's a lot of peeps.

I just don't think any of those bannermen would answer his call. Perhaps if he were to find the heir to the King in the North...LF supporting Rickon could possibly unite the interests of all three of those kingdoms. The North and the Riverlands were already in a united kingdom until treachery destroyed it, and the bannermen of the Vale wanted to support Robb but Lysa never allowed them. LF could be that puppet figure for a boy King who could promise revenge. The North Remembers after all.

/tinfoil