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2015 Cleveland Browns Training Camp Thread

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I thought I'd drop a post of compliments toward McCown since I recently spent an evening venting on why I never wanted him in a Browns uniform and called him skinny Jim Gaffigan.

1. Great pocket awareness and avoids the rush. Hoyer looked like the least mobile starting quarterback in the NFL last season, I never thought his knee was 100%. McCown has done a great job buying more time with his legs while still looking for an open receiver this preseason.

2. Reads the defense at the line. Manziel has made strides at recognizing blitzes and mismatches, but McCown is doing it like a veteran who has been there before.

3. Fits DeFilippo's playcalling. It seems to me DeFilippo wants a dink and dunk offense featuring quick hits to backs, tight ends, and even some bubble screen type throws to receivers. McCown can do that because they are short quick throws that rely on reading a defense.

Now I may personally get annoyed with preseason press releases. I tend to roll my eyes when I bring up valid concerns and I read the next post just regurgitating those same bland overly-positive press quotes. This is NFL preseason: nobody says a negative thing about anybody yet. But, McCown faced the toughest front seven in the NFL last Thursday while Manziel played the second and third stringers.
 
Randolphkeys said:
2. Reads the defense at the line. Manziel has made strides at recognizing blitzes and mismatches, but McCown is doing it like a veteran who has been there before.

Now I may personally get annoyed with preseason press releases. I tend to roll my eyes when I bring up valid concerns and I read the next post just regurgitating those same bland overly-positive press quotes. This is NFL preseason: nobody says a negative thing about anybody yet. But, McCown faced the toughest front seven in the NFL last Thursday while Manziel played the second and third stringers.
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Well I'd hope McCown has learned to read a defense by the age of 36.

How did a presumably worse Manziel do vs that front 7 last season when it actually mattered (especially compared to your boy Hoyer)? Nobody is saying he would tear it up, but I think most think he deserves a shot based on what he has shown thus far.
 
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Pick6 said:
Well I'd hope McCown has learned to read a defense by the age of 36.

How did a presumably worse Manziel do vs that front 7 last season when it actually mattered (especially compared to your boy Hoyer)? Nobody is saying he would tear it up, but I think most think he deserves a shot based on what he has shown thus far.
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A lot of people clamored for Manziel to "get a shot" all last year, even when the offense was performing well.

He's going to get his shot eventually. I'm of the belief all three Browns quarterbacks will get turns by the end of the season. These moving pockets open the QB up for some hits throughout the course of the season.

I rewatched the Buffalo game carefully two nights ago. Manziel looks inconsistent and still makes some bone headed mistakes. He isn't as overwhelmed as he was a year ago, but he looks like a backup at the moment.

My biggest concern with Manziel is inconsistent throwing mechanics on the run. His broken play throw to Wynn will make some highlight reels, but there were plenty of fourth quarter throws he made on the run that were in really bad locations for receivers. He made a few good throws and made a few good early recognitions, and he didn't do that last year... but he isn't putting together drives with multiple completions to receivers. That requires consistency.
 
Pick6 said:
Well I'd hope McCown has learned to read a defense by the age of 36.

How did a presumably worse Manziel do vs that front 7 last season when it actually mattered (especially compared to your boy Hoyer)? Nobody is saying he would tear it up, but I think most think he deserves a shot based on what he has shown thus far.
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He played against prevent. If you can't carve prevent you shouldn't be on a roster.

How did Johnny do against Cinci not playing prevent?
 
Pick6 said:
Well I'd hope McCown has learned to read a defense by the age of 36.

How did a presumably worse Manziel do vs that front 7 last season when it actually mattered (especially compared to your boy Hoyer)? Nobody is saying he would tear it up, but I think most think he deserves a shot based on what he has shown thus far.
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I don't.
 
To the people who don't think Manziel has shown enough to give him a shot:

what has McCown shown throughout his career to give him a shot? The miracle stretch as a Bear for what, 5 games? I think it is beyond debate that was an anomaly when compared to every other game in his journeyman career.

To the people who think starting Manziel would send a message to the team that we are in 'development mode' or 'punting the season':

McCown freaking carried the Bucs to Winston last year. We signed a guy who led a team to the #1 overall pick. I get our line is better, but holy hell the guy had Vincent Jackson and Mike Evans. I think the signing of McCown as the only (sorry Thad) relevant QB move this season was more of a signal of punting the season than starting the #22 overall pick from last year.

I want McCown to lead us to the playoffs just as much as the next fan, but these circular arguments trying to convince ourselves he is good will be bologna come week 6. He blows.

And why does Manziel need to study for 8 years and get his doctorate in playbookology before he gets a shot at the field. The worst case scenario is what happens last year happens again (Aka McCown does decent for 13 games and Johnny has a small sample size all while going 7-9) and we go into the offseason with Johnny still being up in the air and not getting 'his shot'. Off the top of my head I can't think of any other first round QBs still on the bench from being drafted from last year or earlier. Why is Manziel the special case? Just play him. Is handing him the starting position bad? Could be, but is it any worse than going into next offseason still wondering and passing on all QBs again because we 'don't know what we have in Manziel'? I doubt it.

This is all coming from someone who thinks we have nothing in Manziel. I just don't want it to turn into the Colt Mccoy nonsense where we kept wasting seasons to see what we had in a guy when we could have been finding someone who could cut it in the league. Everyone should know what we have in McCown. Nothing. Just like we had in Delhomme. Just like Campbell. Just like the other stop gaps. Trotting out a guy who at 35 last season helped get the #1 pick in the sake of winning is ridiculous. If a QB needs 2+ years just to be ready for his first NFL action you shouldn't have taken him in the first round. (excluding special circumstances like Rodgers/ Favre obviously).
 
Manziel has not shown anything close enough to suggest he deserves to start.

He makes one really good NFL quality play, and that's it? Mind made up? He should start? Damn I know we're desperate, but didn't think it was that bad.

Most of his throws have been to the flat, easy high percentage ones. The Browns having been playing it safe with him play calling wise, and I don't really understand that either.

Maybe it's because he really isn't any good, and they're doing Johnny a favor by not exposing that.

But maybe it's not doing any of us favors, because I think some people believe he can still really play now, even though what we've seen thus far has not given us any indication one way or another that he can.
 
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In this day and age, QB's should be able to come into the NFL and play.

They don't have to be great right off the bat, but they should look capable.

This two years on the bench thing isn't real anymore.
 
I really like Zach Mettenberger. Watching him tonight and using him as a benchmark for development of a "project" 2nd year QB, shows just how far behind Manziel truly is. I know it's mainly media driven but he's nowhere close to deserving playing time in a meaningful game-- I honestly don't see how anyone could say that with a straight face if you did a side-by-side comparison of Manziel and other 2nd year QB's.
 
I think the Browns are gonna acquire a QB in the coming weeks, probably Kaepernick. (I don't think Kaepernick is very good)

I think the Browns will try Pryor on defense soon.

I think the Browns plan to have Manziel play zero snaps at quarterback this year.

We'll see what happens!
 
crabbyshark said:
I think the Browns are gonna acquire a QB in the coming weeks, probably Kaepernick. (I don't think Kaepernick is very good)

I think the Browns will try Pryor on defense soon.
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Jackie-Chan-WTF.jpg
 
EdMonix11 said:
I really like Zach Mettenberger. Watching him tonight and using him as a benchmark for development of a "project" 2nd year QB, shows just how far behind Manziel truly is. I know it's mainly media driven but he's nowhere close to deserving playing time in a meaningful game-- I honestly don't see how anyone could say that with a straight face if you did a side-by-side comparison of Manziel and other 2nd year QB's.
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I think the front office is considering this Manziel's rookie year, as he essentially blew the entirety of last season. So now he has a shorter leash than most 1st round QBs, and he likely will not start until game 10 if at all.

I want what's best for the Browns. The locker room is behind mcCown right now, so I am too. we have a good o line and if we can't score or control the clock and field position, that'll fall on the QB.

11-5. :runaway:
 
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