2015 Game #1 -|- #1 Ohio State vs. Virginia Tech -|- September 7th, 2015 @ 8:00 PM

[MD13]

That '01 Miami team probably will forever stand in a league of its own in terms of just pure talent. 12 dudes from that squad made at least one pro-bowl in the NFL. 38 were drafted. When you look at the depth chart, it's hard to fathom one with more talent.

I think this Ohio State squad has a pretty good case for 2nd deepest/most talented team in the modern era, though.

EDIT: Beaten to it. Third stringer Frank Gore. 2nd string Vince Wilfork.

Yeah, Miami is definitely more talented all around, but they didn't have the incredible depth of QB talent that the Buckeyes do. Still, as b00bie said, this is an all-time great team talent-wise and I just wanna enjoy the ride.

 

[elcheato]

Was pleasantly surprised at the impact Braxton made. Thought he would just kind of be a decoy and get a couple carries here and there, but it appears he is poised to make a huge impact all year. Awesome to see. Can't wait to see some of the plays that will have him throwing. Going to be scary.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I think if some more old timers joined the discussion you would hear about Oklahoma, Michigan, and Notre Dame in the 1970s, also Lou Holtz Notre Dame teams and Jimmy Johnson Miami teams in the late 80s and early 90s.

I fell asleep early last night and didn't watch the second half, but talent wise this Ohio State team is the best collection of talent I've seen on one team in over a decade.

 

[Chris]

Yeah, Miami is definitely more talented all around, but they didn't have the incredible depth of QB talent that the Buckeyes do. Still, as b00bie said, this is an all-time great team talent-wise and I just wanna enjoy the ride.

Yeah, it's going to be a great year. But part of enjoying the ride is getting wild, getting anxious, getting nervous, and exuding sighs of relief. I think most of us watch as emotional sports fan, not statistical robotic scout mode. When VTech took the lead, most of us are probably not analyzing the play and going, "Man, what a great draw up by the Hokies there. Props!" At least I'm not. I'm throwing my Buckeye beads across the room and flipping off my TV. We're just fans at the end of the day.

 

[BimboColesHair]

I never commented on the QB choice, but I figured I would now. There is an unintended consequence by choosing Cardale to start for this season...I think JT stays until he is a senior now. I always thought there was a chance he would based on the type of kid we all know he is, but this cements it for me IMO.

I thought Cardale would leave after this season for the NFL regardless, but that is a lock now, barring injury...someone is going to buy in on the hype and take him in the 1st...but there was also the threat, to me at least, that if JT started this year and had a huge season like he would if he was indeed the starter, that the NFL noise and hype around him would be too much (I think this is a weak ass QB group for the upcoming draft which would have pushed him up the board, but that's a different story for another place). So the threat was there that both of them could have left after this season, but that is gone just by starting Cardale.

So now we are looking at this year of Dolo Dale, 2 years of JT, and then let the talented QB recruits (Burrow, Gibson, Wallace, Danny Clark) all duke it out and see which one rises to the top to take over after this historical current crop of QBs has moved on (I think Danny Clark is going to be special).

What a time to be a Buckeye fan.

 

[AZ_]

Yeah, it's going to be a great year. But part of enjoying the ride is getting wild, getting anxious, getting nervous, and exuding sighs of relief. I think most of us watch as emotional sports fan, not statistical robotic scout mode. When VTech took the lead, most of us are probably not analyzing the play and going, "Man, what a great draw up by the Hokies there. Props!" At least I'm not. I'm throwing my Buckeye beads across the room and flipping off my TV. We're just fans at the end of the day.

Real fans have to show their anger issues.

Rationality is for robots and scouts only.

 

[Jordan]

I never commented on the QB choice, but I figured I would now. There is an unintended consequence by choosing Cardale to start for this season...I think JT stays until he is a senior now. I always thought there was a chance he would based on the type of kid we all know he is, but this cements it for me IMO.

I thought Cardale would leave after this season for the NFL regardless, but that is a lock now, barring injury...someone is going to buy in on the hype and take him in the 1st...but there was also the threat, to me at least, that if JT started this year and had a huge season like he would if he was indeed the starter, that the NFL noise and hype around him would be too much (I think this is a weak ass QB group for the upcoming draft which would have pushed him up the board, but that's a different story for another place). So the threat was there that both of them could have left after this season, but that is gone just by starting Cardale.

So now we are looking at this year of Dolo Dale, 2 years of JT, and then let the talented QB recruits (Burrow, Gibson, Wallace, Danny Clark) all duke it out and see which one rises to the top to take over after this historical current crop of QBs has moved on (I think Danny Clark is going to be special).

What a time to be a Buckeye fan.

I absolutely agree with this. Out of curiosity, what do you mean by the bolded? When you say "buy into the hype" do you not think he has what it takes to be an NFL QB? I obviously think there are necessary areas of improvement for Cardale, but with that said, he has all the desirable intangibles of a starting NFL QB (doesn't choke under defensive pressure, has a cannon arm, tends to read past the first option, can run but is generally a pocket passer, tall, etc.). Nonetheless, it is early to know for sure.

 

[spydy13]

I thought Cardale would leave after this season for the NFL regardless, but that is a lock now, barring injury...someone is going to buy in on the hype and take him in the 1st

Just to clarify, Cardale has to leave anyways because his eligibility is up.

Edit: nevermind, i was wrong on that. i forgot he went to prep school for a year before being redshirted.

 

[AZ_]

I absolutely agree with this. Out of curiosity, what do you mean by the bolded? When you say "buy into the hype" do you not think he has what it takes to be an NFL QB? I obviously think there are necessary areas of improvement for Cardale, but with that said, he has all the desirable intangibles of a starting NFL QB (doesn't choke under defensive pressure, has a cannon arm, tends to read past the first option, can run but is generally a pocket passer, tall, etc.). Nonetheless, it is early to know for sure.

He has all the TANGIBLE things a QB needs, but I'm not sure he's as adept at reading defenses as people think he is.

His ability to deflect sacks and escape is probably the best I've seen since Roethlisberger, though. He's a developmental project at the next level, I don't see how that could be argued.

 

[Jordan]

He has all the TANGIBLE things a QB needs, but I'm not sure he's as adept at reading defenses as people think he is.

His ability to deflect sacks and escape is probably the best I've seen since Roethlisberger, though. He's a developmental project at the next level, I don't see how that could be argued.

Right, and as I said, it's still early. He doesn't always read when the best time to run the ball is, he sometimes only goes through two or three of five read, and he sometimes overthrows his receivers. But, as you said, he has all the tangibles. His arm strength and physical presence is amongst the best coming out of college (Rothlesburger, Vick, Newton, Russell, etc.). He's absolutely no Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning, or Eli Manning who were all 100% going to be NFL stars. But there have been QBs taken in the top-10, who had to develop, but were not taken because some team "bought into the hype." Hence why I asked @BimboColesHair what he meant by that statement. Perhaps I was reading it wrong and, if not, I'd like to know what he thinks.

 

[BimboColesHair]

I absolutely agree with this. Out of curiosity, what do you mean by the bolded? When you say "buy into the hype" do you not think he has what it takes to be an NFL QB? I obviously think there are necessary areas of improvement for Cardale, but with that said, he has all the desirable intangibles of a starting NFL QB (doesn't choke under defensive pressure, has a cannon arm, tends to read past the first option, can run but is generally a pocket passer, tall, etc.). Nonetheless, it is early to know for sure.

No, I love Cardale. Think he is the closest thing to a young Daunte Culpepper that I have seen the last decade+ (I'm a Vikings fan, and I like this comparison more than Big Ben because Dale can actually run to run, like Daunte could), plus Daunte had to sit for a bit in order to learn how to read NFL defenses properly, which I think Dale will do. But similar arm talent, similar size, similar skills, just Cardale doesn't have those tiny Burger King guy hands like Daunte had, which caused him to be a fumbling machine.

But I think he is behind guys like Hackenburg and Cook from an NFL scouts POV, just in part to his small sample size of play compared to those 2 and the rest of the QBs slated to go high...but someone will bite regardless due to his talent. "Buy into the hype" isn't a slight against Cardale the player, just the fact that he will have started less than 20 games by the time the draft rolls around...not sure I have ever seen a player play that few games and be a 1st round pick as a QB (maybe Sanchez?).

 

[BimboColesHair]

Just to clarify, Cardale has to leave anyways because his eligibility is up.

Edit: nevermind, i was wrong on that. i forgot he went to prep school for a year before being redshirted.

He's a Junior...

Edit: whoops, just saw your edit.

 

[AZ_]

Right, and as I said, it's still early. He doesn't always read when the best time to run the ball is, he sometimes only goes through two or three of five read, and he sometimes overthrows his receivers. But, as you said, he has all the tangibles. His arm strength and physical presence is amongst the best coming out of college (Rothlesburger, Vick, Newton, Russell, etc.). He's absolutely no Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning, or Eli Manning who were all 100% going to be NFL stars. But there have been QBs taken in the top-10, who had to develop, but were not taken because some team "bought into the hype." Hence why I asked @BimboColesHair what he meant by that statement. Perhaps I was reading it wrong and, if not, I'd like to know what he thinks.

To an extent, it is hype. Especially in the context of him potentially leaving after the championship games in 2014.

Drafting a QB off three starts, regardless of circumstances, is going to be based on some level of hype and riding the magnitude of those games to a higher draft position.

I certainly didn't see much progression in his game from last year to this year, it was probably his worst performance as a starter for this team.

Crazy to think about, but probably true.

 

[Jordan]

No, I love Cardale. Think he is the closest thing to a young Daunte Culpepper that I have seen the last decade+ (I'm a Vikings fan, and I like this comparison more than Big Ben because Dale can actually run to run, like Daunte could), plus Daunte had to sit for a bit in order to learn how to read NFL defenses properly, which I think Dale will do. But similar arm talent, similar size, similar skills, just Cardale doesn't have those tiny Burger King guy hands like Daunte had, which caused him to be a fumbling machine.

But I think he is behind guys like Hackenburg and Cook from an NFL scouts POV, just in part to his small sample size of play compared to those 2 and the rest of the QBs slated to go high...but someone will bite regardless due to his talent. "Buy into the hype" isn't a slight against Cardale the player, just the fact that he will have started less than 20 games by the time the draft rolls around...not sure I have ever seen a player play that few games and be a 1st round pick as a QB (maybe Sanchez?).

Thanks, yeah I agree with all of that. I took your statement the wrong way. I also think your Culpepper comparison is spot on. People forget, but before Culpepper had that terrible injury, he was a pro-bowl QB.

To an extent, it is hype. Especially in the context of him potentially leaving after the championship games in 2014.

Drafting a QB off three starts, regardless of circumstances, is going to be based on some level of hype and riding the magnitude of those games to a higher draft position.

I certainly didn't see much progression in his game from last year to this year, it was probably his worst performance as a starter for this team.

Crazy to think about, but probably true.

But he wasn't talking about last year. If he were drafted in the first round after three starts I would 100% agree that someone was buying into the hype.

And I agree that yesterday was his worst start out of four. But that doesn't mean he has regressed. People are forgetting that Va Tech has a gimmicky defense that is tricky for all college offensive players. I'll be interested in how he plays against Northwestern/Wisconsin (both of who have good defenses) and Michigan State. Plus the playoff/bowl team(s) we end up facing. But if he lights it up against every elite defenses team he's faced then I think it is a little bit more than hype. There is a reason scouts value games against Alabama than they do against Hawaii.

Also, yesterday was his worst game, but our offense found a way to move the ball, especially in the second half. Part of that is absolutely a credit to how strong our offense is; but, part of that also falls on Cardale. Don't forget how frequently our line let men through leaving Cardale to throw heavily under pressure. One of those passes turned into an interception but the rest were spot on throws.

My point is that saying he is overrated as a prospect just because he hasn't played a lot of games is silly. Remember Brady Quinn and Colt McCoy -- the former of whom was in consideration for a top-5 pick before the draft -- and how each started something like 50+ games (don't quote me on that but I know it is really high) in college. Does it mean Cardale is not necessarily the best QB in the class? Sure. But I don't think it means he is overhyped and it's too early for any of us to say for sure.

 

[BimboColesHair]

Thanks, yeah I agree with all of that. I took your statement the wrong way. I also think your Culpepper comparison is spot on. People forget, but before Culpepper had that terrible injury, he was a pro-bowl QB.


But he wasn't talking about last year. If he were drafted in the first round after three starts I would 100% agree that someone was buying into the hype.

And I agree that yesterday was his worst start out of four. But that doesn't mean he has regressed. People are forgetting that Va Tech has a gimmicky defense that is tricky for all college offensive players. I'll be interested in how he plays against Northwestern/Wisconsin (both of who have good defenses) and Michigan State. Plus the playoff/bowl team(s) we end up facing. But if he lights it up against every elite defenses team he's faced then I think it is a little bit more than hype. There is a reason scouts value games against Alabama than they do against Hawaii.

Also, yesterday was his worst game, but our offense found a way to move the ball, especially in the second half. Part of that is absolutely a credit to how strong our offense is; but, part of that also falls on Cardale. Don't forget how frequently our line let men through leaving Cardale to throw heavily under pressure. One of those passes turned into an interception but the rest were spot on throws.

My point is that saying he is overrated as a prospect just because he hasn't played a lot of games is silly. Remember Brady Quinn and Colt McCoy -- the former of whom was in consideration for a top-5 pick before the draft -- and how each started something like 50+ games (don't quote me on that but I know it is really high) in college. Does it mean Cardale is not necessarily the best QB in the class? Sure. But I don't think it means he is overhyped and it's too early for any of us to say for sure.

Some forget about how good Daunte was...I don't...only franchise QB I have ever known (please, Teddy, please).

And the whole basis of the lack of games argument is you have to look at it like an NFL scout or GM looks at it, not as a fan.

It stems back to the old rules of drafting QBs, aka the Parcells Principle or the 26-27-60 rule, when looking at perspective QB prospects. NFL teams like knowing what they are getting, especially in the 1st round and especially at QB, and a QB with less than 20 starts might scare some of them. So in my mind, the team that drafts him in the 1st (which I think he will go in), will "buy into the hype" of mostly his talent alone. Not a slight against Cardale, just a thought on how NFL people view prospects with smaller sample sizes relative to most other prospects. Based on how much he has played, he is a bit over-hyped in NFL spheres...but based on talent alone, the hype is warranted.