Browns 2015 Roster Moves

[Los216]

Drafting a starting left tackle and a backup center are two separate things.

Besides, no one should seriously put a center in the same category of importance as a left tackle. You can find decent centers later in the draft.

That of course, if you know what you're doing...

But our entire season changed when we lost our center last season? Cam Irving can play Center or Guard. There's no guarantee tha Mack will even be here next season. There's an even higher chance that someone on the O-line will go down with an injury this season.

Irving is more than insurance. He was the best player at his position in the whole draft.

How important was the Center position for us last season?

 

[godfather]

But our entire season changed when we lost our center last season? Cam Irving can play Center or Guard. There's no guarantee tha Mack will even be here next season. There's an even higher chance that someone on the O-line will go down with an injury this season.

Irving is more than insurance. He was the best player at his position in the whole draft.

How important was the Center position for us last season?

Like I said, you don't have to waste a first round pick on a center that's not going to even start for your team that year. And only a backwards team drafts a position they feel is a need down the line instead of addressing the glaring needs at other positions at this moment.

If Erving could play so well, he'd be starting. But he's not. I mean, this is just weird a justification for a draft pick, even if he turns out solid.

Guarantee we'll end up whiffing on some guys at other positions that we could have used.

I really don't think Mack getting hurt was the sole reason for our offensive collapse either. I think it was combination of a lot of things.

 

[Los216]

No, I started complaining after he started getting lazy and holding all the time (no penalties today, I was surprised).

8 seasons 8 time All-Pro. Shoe in for the Hall of Fame.

Never missed a snap in his career.

He never missed a SNAP in his career. All the shitty QB play that's complained about on here and you're calling a guy who's never missed a snap in his 8 year career blocking these ain't shit QB's lazy?

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Drafting a starting left tackle and a backup center are two separate things.

Besides, no one should seriously put a center in the same category of importance as a left tackle. You can find decent centers later in the draft.

That of course, if you know what you're doing...

Center is the second most important position on the line, and a stud center can make a huge difference. If they were that easy to get in the middle of the draft, nobody would offer a $10m/year contract for one.

I personally don't have any problem with drafting a stud center who can play other positions in the second half of the first round.

My concern is that Erving isn't really that good.

 

[godfather]

Center is the second most important position on the line, and a stud center can make a huge difference. If they were that easy to get in the middle of the draft, nobody would offer a $10m/year contract for one.

I personally don't have any problem with drafting a stud center who can play other positions in the second half of the first round.

My concern is that Erving isn't really that good.

But he's not a stud center. My complaint isn't really about drafting a center in the first round overall. It was the Browns reasoning, and the obviously conclusion that Erving wasn't a can't miss one either.

You can find guys like him in the third and fourth round. But the left tackle is still much, much, much more important than the center. It's why tackles go so high in drafts, and center's rarely ever do.

Even if it's second in importance, which I'd argue right tackle is, it's a distance second.

You can't survive in this league without a left tackle.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

It's why tackles go so high in drafts, and center's rarely ever do.

So you were against drafting Mack?

Left tackles can go top 5. Centers don't, but they do go in the second half. And if you can get a Mack, or a Dermontti Dawson, you take him even though he's "only" a center. And yes, I know Dawson went in the second round. But I'll bet a lot of teams in the first regretted passing on him

The problem with Erving wasn't the position, but the player.

 

[Los216]

Like I said, you don't have to waste a first round pick on a center that's not going to even start for your team that year. And only a backwards team drafts a position they feel is a need down the line instead of addressing the glaring needs at other positions at this moment.

If Erving could play so well, he'd be start. But he's not. I mean, this is just weird a justification for a draft pick, even he turns out solid.

Guarantee we'll end up whiffing some guys at other positions that we could have used.

I really don't think Mack getting hurt was the sole reason for our offensive collapse either. I think it was combination of a lot of things.

Are you watching games just to find things to complain about? Mack going down was the biggest loss of last season. Even bigger than Josh Gordon. We had 2 first round picks this draft. Both were used on players who graded the highest at their position.

You can't say that Center or Guard weren't glaring needs watching last season. You're thinking under the assumption that Mack is for sure coming back next season. Do you want to draft a Franchise QB next year and give him a rookie Center?

You mentioned that Centers can be had later in the draft. Well this team has drafted well picking lineman in the first two rounds. You won't mention that though because they're good picks.

You can complain about not picking receivers but I'm almost positive you can find more All-Pro receivers in the later rounds than lineman.

 

[Mr. Orange]

The coaches and GM must be all on the same page together like the Cavs right? Only explanation

I wish. The scary part is they were trying to win.

 

[godfather]

So you were against drafting Mack?

Left tackles can go top 5. Centers don't, but they do go in the second half. And if you can get a Mack, or a Dermontti Dawson, you take him even though he's "only" a center. And yes, I know Dawson went in the second round. But I'll bet a lot of teams in the first regretted passing on him

The problem with Erving wasn't the position, but the player.

Huh? No, I just said I'm not overall against drafting a center in the first round. I'd never draft one that's in the top-10. In the late first round is fine. It's laughable they drafted one in the first round, given they already have one (even if they think he's gone, that's something you can address later). And that he doesn't have significant talent to justify a pick so high.

I just find it funny that given all their needs on the team, that the center position was the Holy Grail of them all. This is the Browns. Only they'd be so backwards in their logic though.

The Browns reasoning for drafting him was in replacement of Mack when he likely leaves. And that's just a sad and really pathetic excuse for a first round draft pick.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Kansas City and Chicago found starting centers in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, plenty of quality interior offensive linemen were taken in the 4th. We are talking about a player taken 19th overall, one spot ahead of possible offensive ROY candidate Nelson Agholor, who was expected to redshirt a year and provide depth at three positions in case of injury. Those three positions remain the strength of the team.

For a team everyone knew was going to struggle to score, it remains a surprising decision.

 

[GonzoRatso88]

Kansas City and Chicago found starting centers in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, plenty of quality interior offensive linemen were taken in the 4th. We are talking about a player taken 19th overall, one spot ahead of possible offensive ROY candidate Nelson Agholor, who was expected to redshirt a year and provide depth at three positions in case of injury. Those three positions remain the strength of the team.

For a team everyone knew was going to struggle to score, it remains a surprising decision.

Ding ding ding! I am all for building depth on both sides of the ball but you can find above average starters on both sides of the ball in the 2nd-4th rounds. Agholor, ODB, Evans, Watkins, Benjamin were all staring at us in the face but we decided to go with Bowe, Hartling and 2 5'10 slot WRs.

 

[NtG]

2 5'10 slot WRs.

Not quite. Gabriel is (listed at) 5'8 and Hawkins is (listed at) 5'7.

 

[godfather]

Kansas City and Chicago found starting centers in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, plenty of quality interior offensive linemen were taken in the 4th. We are talking about a player taken 19th overall, one spot ahead of possible offensive ROY candidate Nelson Agholor, who was expected to redshirt a year and provide depth at three positions in case of injury. Those three positions remain the strength of the team.

For a team everyone knew was going to struggle to score, it remains a surprising decision.

We are apparently allergic to playmakers.

Looking at the Browns yesterday, clearly the QB position is bad, but they definitely lack enough dynamic playmakers on that side of the ball to do anything.

Gabriel, Benjamin, etc, etc, aren't exactly bad, but they're all too redundant at the position.

Going against bigger and physical corners like the Jets had, not a surprise they struggled so much. Benjamin had one great separation for that TD early in the game, but after that it wasn't too hard to lock these guys down.

It's going to be a long year on offense, again.

 

[brownindian]

Not quite. Gabriel is (listed at) 5'8 and Hawkins is (listed at) 5'7.

Honey I Shrunk The wide receivers - Coming soon to a stadium near you ..

 

[Kbiz]

We are apparently allergic to playmakers.

Looking at the Browns yesterday, clearly the QB position is bad, but they definitely lack enough dynamic playmakers on that side of the ball to do anything.

Gabriel, Benjamin, etc, etc, aren't exactly bad, but they're all too redundant at the position.

Going against bigger and physical corners like the Jets had, not a surprise they struggled so much. Benjamin had one great separation for that TD early in the game, but after that it wasn't too hard to lock these guys down.

It's going to be a long year on offense, again.

When putting our offensive lineup, specific to skill positions, next to any other team in the NFL, we are the worst, hands-down. I'd say the Redskins are probably the 2nd worst team, in regards to skill positions, and yet they still smoke us in comparison. (i'd happily take RGDumb, Alfred Morris, Pierre "Oui-Oui" Garcon over ANY of our current starters at those respective positions)

The only thing that excites me is that we don't know what we have in Duke Johnson. Im hindsight, i guess "excites" really means, "well we aren't sure if Johnson will suck...yet."