Cavaliers Offseason Thread

[Urban]

No one on the Nets roster really catches my eye. Hopefully a future 1st or a 3 team deal.

 

[Jordan]

If I have to watch another year of Jarrett "stop jacking up some many dumb shots" Jack again I may kill myself.

...

To be fair, he did play pretty well in big situations for the Nets this year.

 

[texascavsfan]

If I have to watch another year of Jarrett "stop jacking up some many dumb shots" Jack again I may kill myself.

...

^ this....

 

[Mr. Orange]

This smells like a Haywood trade with the Nets beginning to come to fruition. Jarrett Jack would be a very decent pick up as a back up for Kyrie. He is very good on contending teams. Dude carried the Warriors in the playoffs 3 years back.

Pick up Dunlevey with the mMLE to play SF and that'd be a very very solid offseason for us along with signing everyone back.

Kyrie/Jack/Delly
Shumpert/Smith/Harris
Lebron/Dunlevey/Jones/Miller
Love/Thompson/Christmas
Mozgov/Varejao/Perkins

We are not trading Haywood for Jarrett Jack. He was a cancer here who didn't want to help out the young guys. This is not going to happen.

 

[3 Ball...GOT IT]

This smells like a Haywood trade with the Nets beginning to come to fruition. Jarrett Jack would be a very decent pick up as a back up for Kyrie. He is very good on contending teams. Dude carried the Warriors in the playoffs 3 years back.

Pick up Dunlevey with the mMLE to play SF and that'd be a very very solid offseason for us along with signing everyone back.

Kyrie/Jack/Delly
Shumpert/Smith/Harris
Lebron/Dunlevey/Jones/Miller
Love/Thompson/Christmas
Mozgov/Varejao/Perkins

nope

 

[nikolajz1]

We are not trading Haywood for Jarrett Jack. He was a cancer here who didn't want to help out the young guys. This is not going to happen.

Jack is about the quality of player were gonna get for Haywood. Pretty much only teams who wont make the playoffs who are gonna be fucked by the tax are gonna trade for his contract.

 

[3 Ball...GOT IT]

Jack is about the quality of player were gonna get for Haywood. Pretty much only teams who wont make the playoffs who are gonna be fucked by the tax are gonna trade for his contract.

Do you want Earl Clark too?

 

[Otsego Mar]

Do you want Earl Clark too?

Maybe they drafted RHJ for us.........or maybe not.

 

[2 For The Brew]

We are not trading Haywood for Jarrett Jack. He was a cancer here who didn't want to help out the young guys. This is not going to happen.

I hear you but Dan did bring Mike Brown back.

Hopefully you are right - we should only want to hear "Jack is Back" if 24 is picked up by Fox again.

 

[Otsego Mar]

I hear you but Dan did bring Mike Brown back.

Hopefully you are right - we should only want to hear "Jack is Back" if 24 is picked up by Fox again.

Based on his performance in the playoffs, he's exactly the type of back-up PG we could use on this team. We have no young guys so you don't need him to be a mentor lol.

 

[ajz20]

Perhaps option with vet minimum.

 

[nikolajz1]

Based on his performance in the playoffs, he's exactly the type of back-up PG we could use on this team. We have no young guys so you don't need him to be a mentor lol.

Everything I've heard about Jack in GS sounds amazing. It's why we signed him the first time. He was a good mentor to Curry in his year there.

 

[borgon]

View: https://twitter.com/sportando/status/615909177056059392



They clearly can not sign him now, as we own his rights so could this be a foreshadowing of some sort of deal with the Nets? Possibly involving Haywood.

More likely it's dumbass King and Prokhorov not realizing the Cavs had his rights already

 

[Danny Arison]

Jack is not a contributor to a title win,
he could perhaps be a decent regular season guard but he can not create for others, he is in love with the mid range jumper (pretty good at it though)
terrible defender and does not draw fouls or go to the rim.

He will not make this team better at all and 6m plus the tax money rather be spent on some one that had a decent or good playoffs performances or young player or I would rather save Gilberts money and get nothing.

 

[NasstyNate]

That addresses the consistency of how the standard is applied, but it doesn't address the standard itself.

But that's not true. You're assuming that the standard they're using is perfectly fair/accurate for everyone else, and then saying that I'm just picking on how they treat TT in particular. But I'm not saying that. I'm saying that whatever standard they're using may not accurately reflect how good (or bad) lots of guys are as rebounders. A stat can be biased for or against certain styles of plays or situations, and depending upon a guy's role, that can impact him.

You have just restated what I anticipated when I said "that there is something unique to only his game that is not captured by the statistician." He's not the only perimeter big in the league. I showed at least six guys earlier who play the same way he does and consistently outrank him. So what is this flaw that only applies to him? What is he doing that nobody else in the league is doing that is preventing him from grabbing rebounds? Those are real questions that I would like answers to. And they get to the point that I do not think you are engaging with - the standard itself does not matter as long as everyone is judged by the same standard. And if someone comes out poorly by that standard, then it is up to you to show why he alone should not be judged by it. Is it purely chance that the best rebounders in the league are high on the list?

It's not just TT that would be affected. For example, the NBA credits a "rebound" to the player who gains control after a missed shot. If a player tips the ball -- which TT does a lot -- he gets no credit. That's something you need to see with an eyeball test.

EVERY player tips the ball a lot. Are you saying that TT tips the ball more than every other player in a statistically significant way? Enough to skew his stats that dramatically? If so, doesn't that mean he is a poor rebounder?

Additionally, the particular stat I think you're looking at is "percentage of rebounds per chance", right?

http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/rebounding/?CF=REB_CHANCE*G*10&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Regular Season&sort=REB_COL_PCT&dir=1

That stat is defined as:

"Number of rebounds a player recovers compared to the number of rebounding chances"

And "rebounding chances" is defined as: "the number of times a player was within the vicinity (3.5ft) of the rebound."

This stat does not account for deferrals to other players on your team. It is simply a measure of whether or not you are within 3.5 feet of the ball, period.. So, if you have a guy who is blocking out or deferring to another guy on the team, it will still pop up as a missed rebounding chance. I don't think most people think that should be held against a player, but it is here because it lowers his percentage of rebounds per "chance".

Did you deliberately not quote literally the exact next sentence defining a rebound chance? "Measures the number of rebounds a player recovers compared to the number of rebounding chances available as well as whether or not the rebound was contested by an opponent or deferred to a teammate." Your concern about deferring to a teammate is unfounded. And I think you knew that.

There is another stat on that page called "contested rebounding percentage", which is the percentage of contested rebounds collected (opponent within 3.5ft. of ball) as a percentage of total rebounds. In other words, how often is the player battling an opponent for a rebound?

No. It is a percentage of a player's rebounds that were contested. Conversely for uncontested rebounds, the higher the number, the more likely the player is a slow big who is the designated defensive rebounder that I discussed in the previous post.

Turns out that TT's percentage of contested rebounds for 2014-15 was 47.5. That is a higher percentage than any player in the top 20 of the "percentage of rebounds per chance" stat except Andre Jordan. In other words, TT is much more likely than most players to go after the rebounds that are hardest to get.

In fact, LMA has the second highest rating on "percentage of rebounds per chance". But LMA grabbed 3.5 contested rebounds in 35.1 mpg. in contrast, TT grabbed 3.8 contested rebounds in just 25.4 mpg.

So who is the "better" rebounder?

Your statistics do not say what you think they do. All you showed was that LMA gets more uncontested rebounds per game. So what?

So you do agree that these stats are valuable?