Game Thread | Game #11 | Cavs @ Kings | Nov. 9, 2022

[Wham with the Right Hand]

I'm starting to get the feeling we are asking Mobley and JA to do too much defensively. When Mobley starts telling his guards the defense he expects from them, it might be time to find ways to make their jobs easier.

I agree. It seems like too often the wings get beat and the bigs have to clean up the mess and the way the game is called it's very tough to stop a guy driving to the rim without fouling. I do think Allen and Mobley should go straight up more using the rule of verticality and not reach in and make contact with the shooter.

 

[macbdog]

"We've gotten into this habit, and it's my responsibility, to allow people to play freely at the start of games and then turn it on in the second half. It's arrogant basketball...We need to play Cavaliers' basketball, not hero ball, not my turn, not selfish defensively, not executing the game plan, not paying attention to individual players' tendencies, we'll have nights like this." - JBB

You know who doesn't play arrogant basketball? Doesn't play hero ball, not selfish defensively, executes the game plan? Lauri Markkenen.

 

[kookoo]

"We've gotten into this habit, and it's my responsibility, to allow people to play freely at the start of games and then turn it on in the second half. It's arrogant basketball...We need to play Cavaliers' basketball, not hero ball, not my turn, not selfish defensively, not executing the game plan, not paying attention to individual players' tendencies, we'll have nights like this." - JBB

JBB is unfortunately not good enough to do what he said his responsibility is. But at least he's aware of part of the problem.

 

[RchfldCavRaised]

To @RchfldCavRaised, the current starting lineup has a net rating of -15.4 and +/- of -4.6..

Sub in Wade for Garland, net rating is +23.6 and +/- is +3.1..

There’s not enough lineup data to layout Garland, Mitchell, Wade, Mobley and Allen but there’s a decent sample size to say the LeVert, Garland and Mitchell pairing is struggling to adapt and could be part to blame for slow starts.. That threesome has a net rating of -9.8 and defensive rating of 115.8..

Not sure a move is right just yet given the early season injuries but peripheries are pointing to one at some point..

I appreciate this, Smooth operator!

Will cite it/you during the recording of todays RRJ

I’ve never had the patience to analytically support what my eyes see but I can guarantee once there’s enough data, a Wade for Levert swap will net similar and probably better results to a Wade for Garland swap.

 

[Chris]

So we suck again?

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

Just to add some numbers to Bickerstaff's point that the Cavs have been allowing opponents to play too "freely" and not executing the game plan in the first half, here are the points the Cavs are allowing and where they rank in the NBA by quarter:

1st quarter: 29.2 points (18th)
2nd quarter: 28.3 points (14th)
3rd quarter: 24.5 points (1st)
4th quarter: 23.5 points (1st)

So they're allowing 10 points more in the first half than the second. Yeah, I think JBB has a point. In the halftime interview the assistant coach was asked why the Cavs allowed 69 points and he mentioned "lack of effort".

The coaches are calling out the players for lack of effort and discipline in their first half defense. It will be interesting to see what happens in the first half Friday against Golden State.

 

[Ohioplayer00]

You know who doesn't play arrogant basketball? Doesn't play hero ball, not selfish defensively, executes the game plan? Lauri Markkenen.

He’s gone, bro!!! Let it go! If we hadn’t given up Lauri (which I didn’t want to do) we wouldn’t have Mitchell! Do you think we would be 8-3 with our roster from last year?
The Jazz did not want scrubs like Okoro in the trade!

 

[Ohioplayer00]

If this is true….then I was right last night. I said he was laboring out there!

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

To @RchfldCavRaised, the current starting lineup has a net rating of -15.4 and +/- of -4.6..

Sub in Wade for Garland, net rating is +23.6 and +/- is +3.1..

There’s not enough lineup data to layout Garland, Mitchell, Wade, Mobley and Allen but there’s a decent sample size to say the LeVert, Garland and Mitchell pairing is struggling to adapt and could be part to blame for slow starts.. That threesome has a net rating of -9.8 and defensive rating of 115.8..

Not sure a move is right just yet given the early season injuries but peripheries are pointing to one at some point..

Cleaningtheglass.com has a -16.7 for the Cavs' most frequently used lineup of DG/Mitchell/LeVert/Mobley/Allen. Sub in Wade for LeVert and it's +24.5, an improvement of a whopping 41.2 points. That's based on 166 possessions for the first group and 105 for the second. They are the Cavs' two most frequently used lineups.

Another interesting comparison is the Mitch/LeVert/Osman/Mobley/Allen unit which is a +25.8 in 66 possessions (3rd most used). The same lineup with Okoro in for Cedi is a -42.6, which is a decrease of 68.4 points due to just one player. That is the 4th most used lineup with 44 possessions.

These are small samples, but the differences are dramatic.

The Mitch/LeVert/Wade/Love/Allen unit is a +73.1 in 36 possessions. I'd like to see more of that group.

So far Garland is a -16.7 individually. He missed some time with the eye injury and was sick last night. Last year he was by far the highest on the team at +13.9. So as he gets back in the groove his on/off number should improve dramatically.

Garland and Mitchell on the court together have a net rating of -7.1 in 120 minutes over five games. The best two-man combination with over 80 minutes is Love and Allen at +35.9.

 

[Rich]

A few thoughts:

1) They should consider DG as a sixth man
2) All this talk about the Cavs not needing LeBron, they still do. Please come home.
3) Mobley’s ceiling is probably the second or third best player on a good team
4) I could see the Cavs as a 7 seed again

Any other wild overreactions I should list? You know they are coming!

I mean, Cavs as a7th seed if like 45-46 wins ends up being 7th seems plausible.

 

[RchfldCavRaised]

Cleaningtheglass.com has a -16.7 for the Cavs' most frequently used lineup of DG/Mitchell/LeVert/Mobley/Allen. Sub in Wade for LeVert and it's +24.5, an improvement of a whopping 41.2 points. That's based on 166 possessions for the first group and 105 for the second. They are the Cavs' two most frequently used lineups.

 

[Ohioplayer00]

Also I do not believe the Cavs worked hard enough on offense to get K Love more open three looks.

 

[Jscc]

Just to add some numbers to Bickerstaff's point that the Cavs have been playing too "freely" and not executing the game plan in the first half, here are the points the Cavs are allowing and where they rank in the NBA by quarter:

1st quarter: 29.2 points (18th)
2nd quarter: 28.3 points (14th)
3rd quarter: 24.5 points (1st)
4th quarter: 23.5 points (1st)

So they're allowing 10 points more in the first half than the second. Yeah, I think JBB has a point. In the halftime interview the assistant coach was asked why the Cavs allowed 69 points and he mentioned "lack of effort".

The coaches are calling out the players for lack of effort and discipline in their first half defense. It will be interesting to see what happens in the first half Friday against Golden State.

I wonder if this matters though? The last two losses largely depended on being unable to get stops in the 4th quarter when we had the lead. And they were trying.

 

[cavsfever]

Are the other 16 players in the NBA averaging 36+ mpg all also going to break down too or just Mitchell?
There's a big bucket of guys playing between 35-36 as well.

Mitchell is literally leading the league in minutes played! If he keeps this up he’ll average more mpg than any player in the NBA over the last decade. He’s never averaged anything close to these minutes for a full season. So yeah, if anyone breaks down it will be him. It’s not a normal burden

 

[Dr No]

If that’s the way he feels, why did he reward the problems with even more playing time? Play Neto, Wade and others who don’t have an arrogant basketball bone in their body. Make a statement during the game, not the press conference