Kevin Love - Miami Ground Machine

[blazenmp]

This team is just getting started. Once this big 3 settles in a bit more, gets a little more healthy and builds more chemistry, then things should really get fun. They're not even close to that yet. They're just beginning to scratch the surface.

It's starting to seem like the big 5, LeBron, Kyrie, Love, Mozzy, (with the 5th being a combination of a few players).

 

[LeShaq]

It's starting to seem like the big 5, LeBron, Kyrie, Love, Mozzy, (with the 5th being a combination of a few players).

Great point. Mozzy is so huge for us. And he's perfect for playing with LeBron because he cuts hard to the rim and is aware. He's almost like a younger, bigger Andy.

And obviously Mozzy has made Love a lot better, because Love isn't guarding or being guarded by the biggest guy on the other team any longer. And because of Mozzy, we switched our pick and roll defense to a version that Love is much more comfortable with.

I'm thrilled with this team right now. But we're only just getting started. Once we have more time to gel and add those last 2-3 pieces, we're going to punish the league.

This team, this big 3, is less mature than either the Boston big 3 or the Heat big 3. It's going to take more time to develop things. But the early returns are looking good, and we're just getting started.

 

[clevelandrox23]

how many times am i going to write this.... Love impacts the game in more ways than Bosh ever did. His passing and floor spacing has a huge impact on the game. Just his presence on the floor creates huge gaps in the D for irving and james.

Really? This thread just reached an embarrassingly new level. Who cares that Bosh is a better defender, who cares that Bosh is a more efficient scorer, who cares that Bosh has a more reliable midrange jumper. But Kevin Love is on our team so lets just overstate his positive attributes i.e. the outlet pass and his 3 point shooting ability (33% is good?) to the point that declarative statements like the one you just made are considered fact in the eyes of rcf posters. Yep Kevin Love is a much better player than Chris Bosh, you sold me.

 

[blazenmp]

Great point. Mozzy is so huge for us. And he's perfect for playing with LeBron because he cuts hard to the rim and is aware. He's almost like a younger, bigger Andy.

And obviously Mozzy has made Love a lot better, because Love isn't guarding or being guarded by the biggest guy on the other team any longer. And because of Mozzy, we switched our pick and roll defense to a version that Love is much more comfortable with.

I'm thrilled with this team right now. But we're only just getting started. Once we have more time to gel and add those last 2-3 pieces, we're going to punish the league.

This team, this big 3, is less mature than either the Boston big 3 or the Heat big 3. It's going to take more time to develop things. But the early returns are looking good, and we're just getting started.

I think LeBron is playing with a better Z (by this, I am not suggesting Z was not better in his prime (before the foot)) without even having a clue he'd have the option when signing up this year... I think he is quite happy about it. Just the way he dishes out some passes to him makes me reminisce a little on the past. Call it a little bonus I guess - Thanks Dion...

 

[6kiss]

how many times am i going to write this.... Love impacts the game in more ways than Bosh ever did. His passing and floor spacing has a huge impact on the game. Just his presence on the floor creates huge gaps in the D for irving and james.

Is this a joke, Love rarely impacts the game. His passing has been good all year but def not his floor spacing, his shooting as been awful. You guys really underestimate how big Bosh was for that Heat team. Way more useful than Love has been for us thus far.

 

[blazenmp]

Really? This thread just reached an embarrassingly new level. Who cares that Bosh is a better defender, who cares that Bosh is a more efficient scorer, who cares that Bosh has a more reliable midrange jumper. But Kevin Love is on our team so lets just overstate his positive attributes i.e. the outlet pass and his 3 point shooting ability (33% is good?) to the point that declarative statements like the one you just made are considered fact in the eyes of rcf posters. Yep Kevin Love is a much better player than Chris Bosh, you sold me.

Considering his role, I think he is OK (Love). Do I think we've seen Love's best? Not even close... You just can't compare the two with LeBron because the teams are completely different. There's a lot more that are capable of throwing down 20+ here then there were in Miami.

 

[RedBlackAttack]

Is this a joke, Love rarely impacts the game. His passing has been good all year but def not his floor spacing, his shooting as been awful. You guys really underestimate how big Bosh was for that Heat team. Way more useful than Love has been for us thus far.

Bosh made that hedging/trapping defense that was really the signature of those Miami Heat championship teams work. I thought he was the most underrated defensive player in the league from 2011-14. It wasn't that his one-on-one defense was so incredible and he wouldn't make the flashy blocks, but his ability to scramble out from around the rim to the midrange or perimeter to either trap or contest was the main reason they were able to play that style.

The Heat relied on out-talenting teams in a lot of games during that run, but they hung their hat on playing defense on a string. That's where Bosh was 100% indispensable.

 

[Tornicade]

Yea and Bosh was shooting close to 50% while Love is shooting an abysmal 43%. It was nice to see him play a good game. But 9-17 from the field is close to what we should see on a nightly basis. He has yet to have a signature game which is fine as long as he has more nights like tonight.

theres a few things people are overlooking when attempting to compare bosh an Love.

Bosh first season in miami he had a .496 fg % with a TS .569 and a FT rate of 44%

Love currently has a .424 fg % with a TS .553 with a FT rate of 40%

Bosh shot 50% from inside the arc. Love is shooting 48% from inside the 3

Bosh average shooting distance was 11.4 . Love is 14.2

Love is creating more spacing and is quite capable of shooting 37% from 3 so it is more likely he will improve as he adapts

 

[roozy]

Love looked godly at the elbow, hope they use it more.

 

[LeShaq]

I think LeBron is playing with a better Z (by this, I am not suggesting Z was not better in his prime (before the foot)) without even having a clue he'd have the option when signing up this year... I think he is quite happy about it. Just the way he dishes out some passes to him makes me reminisce a little on the past. Call it a little bonus I guess - Thanks Dion...

Yeah good call. A pre injury version of Z.

 

[blazenmp]

Yeah good call. A pre injury version of Z.

Time will tell on him being 'better' than the pre-injury version of Z, but the similarities, at least when LeBron feeds him are pretty cool.

 

[secund2nun]

Bosh made that hedging/trapping defense that was really the signature of those Miami Heat championship teams work. I thought he was the most underrated defensive player in the league from 2011-14. It wasn't that his one-on-one defense was so incredible and he wouldn't make the flashy blocks, but his ability to scramble out from around the rim to the midrange or perimeter to either trap or contest was the main reason they were able to play that style.

The Heat relied on out-talenting teams in a lot of games during that run, but they hung their hat on playing defense on a string. That's where Bosh was 100% indispensable.

Bosh was a big part of the trapping scheme, but Lebron was even a bigger part....though honestly the heat's defensive trapping scheme sucked. It worked well in the regular season but was destroyed in the playoffs by good teams with good ball movement or teams with a big man with size. Miami won those rings off of Lebron's back with Wade stepping up occasionally.

Bosh is a better defender than Love, but he isn't a great defensive player by any means. Rebounding is a big part of defense and Bosh is a poor defender. Also like Love, Bosh offers zero rim protection and gets bullied by big men with size. Old Man KG ripped Bosh apart in the 2012 playoffs and West/Hibbert usually destroyed him as well. Duncan also destroyed Bosh in the 2013 and 2014 NBA finals. Bosh's defense doesn't hold up well in the playoffs against good teams.

 

[secund2nun]

In fact, I'd say Miami won those rings in spite of the hedge trapping scheme not because of it.

 

[RedBlackAttack]

Bosh was a big part of the trapping scheme, but Lebron was even a bigger part....though honestly the heat's defensive trapping scheme sucked. It worked well in the regular season but was destroyed in the playoffs by good teams with good ball movement or teams with a big man with size. Miami won those rings off of Lebron's back with Wade stepping up occasionally.

Bosh is a better defender than Love, but he isn't a great defensive player by any means. Rebounding is a big part of defense and Bosh is a poor defender. Also like Love, Bosh offers zero rim protection and gets bullied by big men with size. Old Man KG ripped Bosh apart in the 2012 playoffs and West/Hibbert usually destroyed him as well. Duncan also destroyed Bosh in the 2013 and 2014 NBA finals. Bosh's defense doesn't hold up well in the playoffs against good teams.

I have to disagree with you on that.

They really put the clamps on almost every EC opponent from 2011-14 when the games mattered most with that hedge/trap defense. And, let's not forget that they actually had some really tight series in the Eastern Conference over that four-year run. Last year, EC opponents scored (just barely) over 100 points in 2-of-15 playoff games.

Most teams were frankly lucky to get over the 90-point hump against the Heat last year. There was a team that had their defense completely figured out, but it was also the team that had the whole league in total scramble mode at all times. The Spurs are a big exception, not the rule.

When they won their first title of the 'Big Three' era, they totally handcuffed OKC's potent offense in the biggest moments. That defense was very good. I'm not sure how this turned into a Bosh/Heat conversation, though. lol





On Love, I'm pleased with his progression. The first step to him fitting in on this team was not completely killing us to the point where we couldn't afford to even have him out there a lot of the time. That seems to have worked itself out for the most part.

Though his offense has been inconsistent lately, I think it is at least in-part due to him putting much greater focus on learning and operating within this defensive scheme. He has been on the floor for a lot of the team's best defensive moments over the last nine games.

He is too good of an offensive player and Blatt is too bright of a coaching mind for his considerable offensive tools to continue to go to waste all season long. I'm still very confident this will get figured out. More important was that he stop focusing so much on the offensive end and buckle down defensively. He is starting to do that.

Mozgov also obviously deserves a lot of the credit as does the change in the defensive strategy, but Love is visibly improved as well. We are still in the early stages of this team coming together. The potential remains every bit as scary as it was when Love made his signing with Cleveland official. Moreso, because the roster has been so vastly improved since then.

 

[Jscc]

Who cares that Bosh is a better defender, who cares that Bosh is a more efficient scorer, who cares that Bosh has a more reliable midrange jumper.

Kevin Love's final season with Minnesota had a 120 Ortg and a 104 Drtg. Chris Bosh's final season with Toronto had a 117 Ortg and 111 Drtg.