NBA Finals 2015: Cavs vs Warriors

[Marcus]

That's all good and nice but that's the regular season Marcus, they struggled vs Brooklyn/Wizards too my man, plus just look at their squad don't tell me about their offensive firepower. I'm not trying to discredit anybody they have done a terrific job but the fact remains that Bulls/Hawks are no where near the level of the Warriors. That's all man. I wanna discuss cause I care not trying to bash anyone.

They were still putting up over 98 points a night before this series started. The Cavs have held them below the 90 point threshold twice in a row on the road. They have held a team known for assisting 25+ times a game below 20 twice, as well (19 in Game 1, 15 in Game 2). They've held a team that normally shoots lights out from three to 10/49 in the first two games.

I won't deny that they struggled, and I thought the Cavs had a real chance against them even after Love went down because of that fact. The Hawks peaked too early. They've become this year's edition of the Pacers. At this point I am going to be a little surprised if this series goes back to Atlanta, and if it does, I think the Cavs wrap it up in five.

Comparing (or not, I guess, since there really isn't a comparison) the Bulls and Hawks to the Warriors is a no-brainer, on another note. There isn't a single team in the league that is on their level of offensive production, outside of a full-strength Cavs. But, Golden State has also shown that they can have nights where their offense produces at a league average rate, too. When the three ball isn't dropping for them, they become much more beatable -- just like the Cavs or the Hawks, honestly.

Long story short, I'm not going to undersell the defensive effort and abilities of a team that was being mocked for that side of their game just a few months ago, nor am I going to bet against them anymore. I'm not going to underrate a team that defensively has been tops in the NBA when it matters most, regardless of who they are playing. NBA competition is NBA competition. You can only play who you can play, and through two and a half rounds they have done so admirably. Would things be different if they were in the Western Conference? Maybe. Does bringing up hypothetical situations change what they have already accomplished and what they will hopefully continue to achieve? Absolutely not.

They've allowed teams to cross the 100 point mark only twice this entire postseason -- their first game against Boston (which they won, 113-100) and their fifth game against Chicago (which they won 106-101). They have overcome all odds and have dealt with some truly devastating injuries to get to the point they are at, and yet, they are playing arguably their best ball of the entire season heading into June.

 

[Jscc]

The Bulls between coaching and injury never got Mirotic going except game 3 but otherwise TT has faced guys like Milsap, Gasol, and Noah none of whom I'd called 3 point gunners.

Actually, Paul Millsap is just an older more skilled Draymond Green. Both have similar 3P% with Millsap's at .356 and Green's at .337 and similar defensive ratings with Millsap's at 99 and Green's at 97.

 

[David.]

It should be a good finals (assuming we both close our our series), especially if Kyrie can be reasonably healthy by then. If you go by the computer rankings, their path to the finals has been pretty close. Even though the west overall is tougher, the teams GS has faces is roughly equivalent to what the Cavs have faced. Here are the final computer rankings of their opponents

Pelicans 12/Celtics 13
Bulls 9/Grizzlies 8
Rockets 6/Hawks 5

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/powerrankings

The other high ranked teams in the west (spurs at 2, clippers at 3, blazers at 7) were all eliminated by other teams, so GS never faced them. And the 60 win Hawks are the highest rated team either team has faced in the playoffs. Also, only golden state (42-10) had a better winning percentage against the west than the Hawks (22-8).

Thus far both teams have swept round 1, gone down 2-1 in round to only to rebound and win 4-2, and both are up 2-0 in the conference finals. We've had to fight through more adversity (Love injury, JR suspension, Kyrie injury vs their only losing Speights).

Playoff rankings the two teams are 1 and 2 in offensive efficiency (107.5 vs 107.4). I was pretty shocked to see this given the perception we're now a defensive team instead of an offensive team like we were before our injuries, I only pulled up the page to see how or defenses ranked and we've been quite a bit better (98.1 for us, 100.0 for them).

its like christmas morning because were the definition of 3-d.

you forgot to mention that gsw get all cals, we get none

 

[All4One1ForAll]

Assuming we advance past Atlanta (which is looking ever so likely, especially with Korver now out, though we can't be sure because this is Cleveland sports after all), who is going to guard Curry?

At first I was thinking we should put LeBron on Curry, seeing that the entire Golden State offense is run by and dependent on Curry. Essentially, if we shut him down, we stop their ball movement, and contain their offense. And we all know when motivated, LeBron can shut a guy down as well as anyone.

However, if we have LeBron on Curry, then I'm assuming we would put Shump on Klay and then who does that leave on Barnes? If Kyrie is 100%, we're obviously going to start him, and he would be terribly outmatched against Barnes, with the obvious size disadvantage. And I don't think we would be any better off with Kyrie on Klay, as Kyrie usually doesn't do too well chasing around shooters, especially when they're constantly coming around screens like Klay does.

 

[All4One1ForAll]

I'll probably get crushed for this, but Steph is the weakest MVP we've had in this league since Rose. He won due to the lack of a dominant Durant or LBJ, not because of otherwordly production. If his team finished with a worse record, the award would have went to Harden, or perhaps Westbrook. There was no clear cut option here.

Part of that reason is, while Steph is unstoppable when he's on, there are games he can absolutely be stopped. He is a rich man's Kyrie: phenomenal scorer, capable passer, but limited all-around game impact. If the shots are falling, he gets frustrated and withdraws. He's done it a dozen times this year. He is good enough to singlehandedly win a game or two, it will definitely be a hard-fought series, but I doubt there's many NBA people who would honestly put Steph on the same pedestal you'd put LeBron, especially now that LeBron has proven to everyone he was just coasting through the regular season, and when the chips are down, he's still the most dominant player in the world.

I disagree dude. Curry may very well be the weakest MVP since Rose considering only LeBron and Durant have won it since then, but I wouldn't say he's a weak MVP at all. 24/8/4 may not look like eye popping numbers for an MVP, but you've got to keep in mind he only played 32.7 minutes per game because he sat out so many fourth quarters with his team constantly blowing out opponents.

Compare that to Durant's last MVP season where he averaged 38.5 minutes per game or LeBron's last MVP season where he averaged 38 minutes per game. Those extra six minutes would have made a huge difference stats wise if Curry had played them. We can't fault him for leading a team that played so well that he didn't need to play in a number of fourth quarters.

Another thing that was so impressive about Curry's season is the efficiency at which he shot the ball. He shot over 8 three pointers per game and managed to convert them at over 44%, which is simply unbelievable. He nearly shot on 50/40/90 splits and put up a TS percentage of about 64%.

Moving on to the advanced stats, Curry's numbers are impressive even next to past MVPs like LeBron and Durant. His ORTG was 122 and his DRTG was 101. His VORP (Value Over Replacement Player) was the highest in the league at 7.9, his BPM was 9.9 (right behind Westbrook for 2nd), his WS/48 were a league leading .288, his PER was 28.0, and his RPM (Real Plus-Minus) was 9.20, far ahead of the 2nd place player (LeBron), who had an RPM of 8.34.

Finally, he led his team to 67 wins, tied for the 6th best record in NBA history. Curry was a very worthy MVP in my opinion.

 

[NorthCoastBias]

The Warriors have all the breaks going their way. Just seem like a team that is destined to win it this year. With their depth and our lack thereof, I have a hard time seeing us beating them in a seven game series. Looks like we'll get a chance to find out though.

 

[Simmy]

I'm going to be so pissed if/when we play the Warriors, and Curry decides he's going to keep chucking up and making these quick release 3s from anywhere. It's actually infuriating to watch.

 

[Chris]

I disagree dude. Curry may very well be the weakest MVP since Rose considering only LeBron and Durant have won it since then, but I wouldn't say he's a weak MVP at all. 24/8/4 may not look like eye popping numbers for an MVP, but you've got to keep in mind he only played 32.7 minutes per game because he sat out so many fourth quarters with his team constantly blowing out opponents.

Compare that to Durant's last MVP season where he averaged 38.5 minutes per game or LeBron's last MVP season where he averaged 38 minutes per game. Those extra six minutes would have made a huge difference stats wise if Curry had played them. We can't fault him for leading a team that played so well that he didn't need to play in a number of fourth quarters.

Another thing that was so impressive about Curry's season is the efficiency at which he shot the ball. He shot over 8 three pointers per game and managed to convert them at over 44%, which is simply unbelievable. He nearly shot on 50/40/90 splits and put up a TS percentage of about 64%.

Moving on to the advanced stats, Curry's numbers are impressive even next to past MVPs like LeBron and Durant. His ORTG was 122 and his DRTG was 101. His VORP (Value Over Replacement Player) was the highest in the league at 7.9, his BPM was 9.9 (right behind Westbrook for 2nd), his WS/48 were a league leading .288, his PER was 28.0, and his RPM (Real Plus-Minus) was 9.20, far ahead of the 2nd place player (LeBron), who had an RPM of 8.34.

Finally, he led his team to 67 wins, tied for the 6th best record in NBA history. Curry was a very worthy MVP in my opinion.

Honestly, I agree with all of this but you didn't need to go past 24/8/4. Anyone who thinks those numbers are anything less than otherworldly is just being a hater.

 

[godfather]

I keep thinking how we can guard Curry, and I don't like it. If Kyrie plays, he's going to have to guard him, and ouch, that's torture.

I think you have to put size on him. Ideally you'd want Shump on him to start the game, then end the game with LeBron on him.

But the thing is, if Kyrie plays, you can't put him elsewhere. He can't chase Thompson around. He's not big enough to guard Barnes (he's 6-8).

That's going to be very tough. We need Kyrie to be himself offensively or we have no chance. Because Curry is going to score a lot against, we have to accept that.

 

[godfather]

Curry one of the weakest MVPs, nah, don't agree at all with that. He's miles better than Derrick Rose, sorry, he is, even when Rose was really good. Well, obviously he's going to look weaker compared to LB and Durant in their greater forms, but that's no slight meaning he's not a legit MVP though.

Rose definitely was not. Rose was always overhyped, Curry does make those around him better too.

 

[CHIMOCHIS]

If we face the Warriors we would be facing one of the best teams to ever play the game of basketball

Without having two of our top 5 players

And our second best player playing injured

And yall expect to win the series
I just hope we don't get blown out

 

[BimboColesHair]

If we face the Warriors we would be facing one of the best teams to ever play the game of basketball

Without having two of our top 5 players

And our second best player playing injured

And yall expect to win the series
I just hope we don't get blown out

Yet you tell us all "never doubt The Kings greatness" whenever you possibly can...fuck off.

 

[Chris]

I don't think there is any chance we beat Golden State. So I guess I kind of agree with him. That said, they play the games for a reason. Anything's posssiiiiibbbble!!!

 

[CLEistheCITY]

If we play GS, what is their answer to TT?

 

[BimboColesHair]

I don't think there is any chance we beat Golden State. So I guess I kind of agree with him. That said, they play the games for a reason. Anything's posssiiiiibbbble!!!

I'm not saying we have a chance either, just that LeBron fan boy gets on everyone in the LeBron thread for "doubting" his greatness, and yet here he is, doubting LeBron's greatness.