I still don't think the prequels had a good story. I'm honestly not really sure why gouri keeps saying they do, but I'll continue to disagree. I thought the story was one of the many problems with the prequels. I'd really like it explained in depth how the story of the prequels was a good one, because I don't see it at all.
Okay. but to be quite honest, I think there's quite a few people in here who have said, numerous times, that they like the prequels for the story and lore, the setting, and the narrative being told.
I think you continue to conflate, understandably so, those aspects of the story with the production and execution of the film.
I've tried to explain this, but you've stated outright you haven't even seen the prequels in
years and refuse to watch.
Beyond that I'm not sure if you're really a Star Wars fan in the same sense that some of us are; and that might make it a lot harder for you to tolerate the obvious faults in the prequels which are glaring and quite distracting.
Look, Jack, I totally get it, you don't like the prequels - but at a minimum they do tell the story of Star Wars.
Btw, have you seen The Force Awakens, yet? Because... if you're this critical of the prequels, I'm not sure how you could possibly like it, but you can meet me in the other thread for a direct comparison.
Yeah, maybe the simple core of one man's downfall was an all right idea on paper, but everything surrounding it was utterly shittacular and the actual execution of that downfall was laughably terrible, rushed, and poorly thought out. I also think that, for a proper downfall story, the character that falls needs to be likable in the first place, and that doesn't describe Anakin at all. He goes from an annoying kid with terrible acting to a whiny bitch of a teenager with terrible acting to an asshole adult with terrible acting. I never had any sympathy for him because he's a piece of shit for the duration of the last two movies (and a kid we didn't remotely care about in the first one), and you need to have sympathy for a character for a downfall to work properly.
But, you've not really even addressed the story here; you're referencing his acting how he was portrayed on the screen, how he was directed, and the "execution" of the narrative within the film. That hasn't anything to do with the story, but the filmmaking.
We keep going in circles on this; I don't think anyone would argue that, cinematically, the prequels were good films.
Obi-Wan's role was all wrong too. He should have been the young, impulsive Jedi who befriends Anakin and decides to train him against the will of the council because he believes in him.
No, that makes no sense and doesn't fit into his character.
Instead, he is against training Anakin from the start and for some baffling reason Qwi-Gon (the wise master) is the impulsive one, with Obi-Wan only training Anakin because it was Qwi-Gon's wish (which effectively absolves Obi-Wan of all responsibility for how terribly it all goes).
Because Qui Gon Jinn is akin to a Jedi misfit. He's wise enough and old enough to be a master, yet isn't because he doesn't see eye to eye with the other Masters. He's not as much of a lightside Jedi as the others, and focuses on the "Living Force" more so than the (cosmic) Force that the Jedi are more familiar with.
And it isn't that Obi Wan or Qui Gon need to be absolved. Anakin becoming a Jedi was the will of the Force according to the Prophecy of the One. He does in fact bring balance to the Force; but, the problem is that the Jedi Order assumed "balance" meant in their favor.
Further, you never get the sense that Anakin and Obi-Wan are friends despite that being a key point in what Obi-Wan tells Luke in New Hope. They seem to actively disdain each other when they're on camera together, and all we ever get is a few throwaway lines of dialogue recounting past adventures.
I completely disagree, cinematically and thematically it's clearly evident they are very close friends and Anakin looks to Obi-Wan as a mentor, and a father-figure; whereas Obi-Wan loves Anakin like a little brother.
The problem is that Anakin's abilities warped him; he was peerless, and he was further misled by Palpatine since first arriving on Coruscant in early childhood.
Is there friction? Yes, of course, they have issues. Anakin feels The Force, but can't yet control it. Obi-Wan is trying to teach him, but he's got too many outside influences pulling him outside of the teachings of the Jedi; from Padme, to his mother, and then finally to the Chancellor.
As far as hating each other, Anakin clearly hates Obi-Wan controlling him in Episode 2, but in Episode 3 he's simply suspicious of the Jedi in general.
I think you might be forgetting these films a bit.
And that's just one of many issues with the stories in the prequels. There are basically a billion of them.
Everything you've mentioned here seems to stem from a misunderstanding of the story being told; or, your supposition that it'd be better had they done it your way instead of Lucas' way.
Are there flaws in the story of the prequels? Yes, surely. But I don't think you've identified them here, to be honest.
Qui-Gon shouldn't have encouraged Anakin's training? Why not? He makes it perfectly clear, numerous times why he does. Don't you remember The Phantom Menace?
"This boy is the Chosen One, you must see it."
Qui-Gon needing absolution for Anakin's sins? No. Qui Gon did as the Force willed. Anakin's sins are his own, and we know he was ultimately redeemed within the story in the original trilogy in Return of the Jedi.
Obi-Wan and Anakin don't come off as friends? Because while Obi-Wan looks at Anakin like a little brother and an apprentice; Anakin looks at Obi-Wan as the controlling father, the mentor who is wise but outmoded - and like is the Sith way, he wants nothing more than to surpass his master and prove himself.
Honestly Jack, I think your issue is more that you don't like Star Wars. We could sit here and tear apart the story in the original trilogy or the prequels, its all written by the same guy, you do realize that right?
The only difference between Empire and the other five films is that Lucas had the least influence on Ep.5. With ANH he was in total control and with ROTJ he was a full partner in the production, there was no hand's off approach as there was with Empire.
Now, is Lucas a good filmmaker? No. But we've already established that, right?
