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The Jarvis Landry Thread: Bless 'Em

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Admittedly not a ton of people have said it, but enough people have broached the subject of Jarvis getting cut as a cap casualty that it makes me roll my eyes.

With Odell here, Jarvis is going nowhere. You're vastly underestimating their relationship if you don't understand this. You have 3 options:

1) Keep Jarvis at his current salary
2) Restructure Jarvis' contract
3) Cut Jarvis and trade OBJ

Those are your options. If we were to cut Jarvis with OBJ here things would get ugly immediately.
 
The reason that people thought Jarvis was going to get cut was because he wasn't providing enough value on his contract.

With him putting up career numbers, it no longer should be an option. But the Browns need money/cap space in a big way, especially if they are to sign Joe Schobert.
 
Amherstcavsfan said:
The reason that people thought Jarvis was going to get cut was because he wasn't providing enough value on his contract.

With him putting up career numbers, it no longer should be an option. But the Browns need money/cap space in a big way, especially if they are to sign Joe Schobert.
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Pretty obvious where the money comes from, Kirksey is making 8.2, his contract is up and wont be renewed. Also don't see Rpbinson and his 7 million surviving, but I am guessing we are using a 1st round pick on left tackle, and will need the 14 mill between robinson and hubbard to get a new right tackle (or left if we draft right) and find a better right guard too.

TJ Carrie and his 8 million might be to expenisve to keep, not that he hasn't played slot corner well, but that is allot for a slot corner.

For sure Kirksey is done, but I am guessing Hubbard, Robinson and maybe even Carrie are all cap casualties that is all around 34 in those 4 players, can easily replace them in the draft or half the money on the open market for the lack of production we got out of 3 of the 4, and Carrie isn't valuable enough to pay that type of money for slot corner
 
Lee said:
Pretty obvious where the money comes from, Kirksey is making 8.2, his contract is up and wont be renewed. Also don't see Rpbinson and his 7 million surviving, but I am guessing we are using a 1st round pick on left tackle, and will need the 14 mill between robinson and hubbard to get a new right tackle (or left if we draft right) and find a better right guard too.

TJ Carrie and his 8 million might be to expenisve to keep, not that he hasn't played slot corner well, but that is allot for a slot corner.

For sure Kirksey is done, but I am guessing Hubbard, Robinson and maybe even Carrie are all cap casualties that is all around 34 in those 4 players, can easily replace them in the draft or half the money on the open market for the lack of production we got out of 3 of the 4, and Carrie isn't valuable enough to pay that type of money for slot corner
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Ya its pretty cut and dry as to how we open up cash for Scho & anyone else.

  1. Hubbard is cut or traded 6/1 or later and saves us a net of $6.5M
  2. Adarius Taylor on 6/1 can open up $2.4
  3. TJ Carrie could be net of $7.25
  4. Kirko would be the last option amongst the names above. If anything I could see them trying to find a way to restructure. If he says no, F him. Mack has proven to be a great contributor & Taki Taki seems to be improving as he goes.
  5. Olivier Vernon could be cut post 6/1 as well to free up $15M

It is way too early in this process to worry about needing to cut guys. We have way too much cheap talent. How much cap space are we looking at aside from these cuts?
 
bigfoot5415 said:
Ya its pretty cut and dry as to how we open up cash for Scho & anyone else.

  1. Hubbard is cut or traded 6/1 or later and saves us a net of $6.5M
  2. Adarius Taylor on 6/1 can open up $2.4
  3. TJ Carrie could be net of $7.25
  4. Kirko would be the last option amongst the names above. If anything I could see them trying to find a way to restructure. If he says no, F him. Mack has proven to be a great contributor & Taki Taki seems to be improving as he goes.
  5. Olivier Vernon could be cut post 6/1 as well to free up $15M

It is way too early in this process to worry about needing to cut guys. We have way too much cheap talent. How much cap space are we looking at aside from these cuts?
Click to expand...

Vernon has been a stud against the run, sure he makes allot, but we have the cap room

Kirko is a free agent, I doubt he is back

Taylor is useful enough to keep the 2.4 as a rotational LB, but not a huge need.

We could be 50 million under the cap and we should still cut Hubbard. Actually cutting Hubbard isnt enough, we should put him in a cannon and fire him out of First Energy Stadium.
 
Lee said:
Vernon has been a stud against the run, sure he makes allot, but we have the cap room

Kirko is a free agent, I doubt he is back

Taylor is useful enough to keep the 2.4 as a rotational LB, but not a huge need.

We could be 50 million under the cap and we should still cut Hubbard. Actually cutting Hubbard isnt enough, we should put him in a cannon and fire him out of First Energy Stadium.
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In very brief terms, can you explain the NFL cap and how we hit that number? Im seeing mid 30s. I know cap rolling over has something to do with it.

Hopefully we can sneak in the playoffs and land a few depth pieces on the cheap next year after we have "proved ourselves"
 
bigfoot5415 said:
Ya its pretty cut and dry as to how we open up cash for Scho & anyone else.

  1. Hubbard is cut or traded 6/1 or later and saves us a net of $6.5M
  2. Adarius Taylor on 6/1 can open up $2.4
  3. TJ Carrie could be net of $7.25
  4. Kirko would be the last option amongst the names above. If anything I could see them trying to find a way to restructure. If he says no, F him. Mack has proven to be a great contributor & Taki Taki seems to be improving as he goes.
  5. Olivier Vernon could be cut post 6/1 as well to free up $15M

It is way too early in this process to worry about needing to cut guys. We have way too much cheap talent. How much cap space are we looking at aside from these cuts?
Click to expand...

Vernon has been a stud against the run, sure he makes allot, but we have the cap room

Kirko is a free agent, I doubt he is back

Taylor is useful enough to keep the 2.4 as a rotational LB, but not a huge need.

We could be 50 million under the cap and we should still cut Hubbard. Actually cutting Hubbard isnt enough, we should put him in a cannon and fire him out of First
bigfoot5415 said:
In very brief terms, can you explain the NFL cap and how we hit that number? Im seeing mid 30s. I know cap rolling over has something to do with it.

Hopefully we can sneak in the playoffs and land a few depth pieces on the cheap next year after we have "proved ourselves"
Click to expand...

We aren't at 50 million, I am just saying if we were at 100 million you cut Hubbard and find someone else....150 million in cap, you cut Hubbard, thats what i was saying.
 
bigfoot5415 said:
Ya its pretty cut and dry as to how we open up cash for Scho & anyone else.

  1. Hubbard is cut or traded 6/1 or later and saves us a net of $6.5M
  2. Adarius Taylor on 6/1 can open up $2.4
  3. TJ Carrie could be net of $7.25
  4. Kirko would be the last option amongst the names above. If anything I could see them trying to find a way to restructure. If he says no, F him. Mack has proven to be a great contributor & Taki Taki seems to be improving as he goes.
  5. Olivier Vernon could be cut post 6/1 as well to free up $15M

It is way too early in this process to worry about needing to cut guys. We have way too much cheap talent. How much cap space are we looking at aside from these cuts?
Click to expand...

While all of this is true, that still gives the Browns roughly 20 million in cap space. (I'm not counting Vernon because they should not cut him).

Schobert is about to get absolutely paid an they will have to pay for draft picks. That will leave them with roughly 5 or so million in cash. Add in the fact that you have to pay Garrett and Ogunjobi soon, not to mention what Hunt will cost if we want to keep him long term? The money isn't there for everyone.
 
col63onel said:
So he's what...the 18th best WR this year? 20th? 22nd? I think somewhere in that range is objectively a fair ranking....

....Keep in mind, he has the 10th highest average value contract among NFL WRs and is the 7th highest paid this year. If this was a "normal" year for him, he's still probably a little overpaid. But this is a CAREER year for him, and he still isn't quite producing what his contract says he should.
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I think comparing where he ranks among all WR's with where his salary ranks in terms of all WR's overlooks the critical factor -- that we had to acquire him as a free agent. Take a look at the top WR's you mentioned:

Hopkins -- Re-signed with team that drafted him
Adams --Re-signed with team that drafted him
Theilen - Re-signed with team that acquired him as UDFA
Diggs -- Re-signed with team that drafted him
Evans -- Re-signed with team that drafted him

You can add Michael Thomas in there -- same thing, Re-signed with team that drafted him.

My point is that those guys were never on the market, and so were not obtainable by us. Or really, by anyone else either. To measure Landry's salary/value fairly, you have to look at replacement value. So that means excluding the studs who never left their original team, and guys still on their rookie contract. I'm not going to crank all the math, but I'll bet that in the world of wide receivers who have been legitimately on the market, his performance rank is much more closely aligned with his salary.
 
The Human Q-Tip said:
I think comparing where he ranks among all WR's with where his salary ranks in terms of all WR's overlooks the critical factor -- that we had to acquire him as a free agent. Take a look at the top WR's you mentioned:

Hopkins -- Re-signed with team that drafted him
Adams --Re-signed with team that drafted him
Theilen - Re-signed with team that acquired him as UDFA
Diggs -- Re-signed with team that drafted him
Evans -- Re-signed with team that drafted him

You can add Michael Thomas in there -- same thing, Re-signed with team that drafted him.

My point is that those guys were never on the market, and so were not obtainable by us. Or really, by anyone else either. To measure Landry's salary/value fairly, you have to look at replacement value. So that means excluding the studs who never left their original team, and guys still on their rookie contract. I'm not going to crank all the math, but I'll bet that in the world of wide receivers who have been legitimately on the market, his performance rank is much more closely aligned with his salary.
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We technically traded for him, same as OBJ.

Just because elite wrs don’t become available via trade and free agency doesn’t mean we have to pay a non elite WR elite money.
 
col63onel said:
Just because elite wrs don’t become available via trade and free agency doesn’t mean we have to pay a non elite WR elite money.
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You have to pay them what the market demands, or do without. There isn't a third option. And in the case of Landry, unlike those other guys, there wasn't a hometown discount/extension factor in play for us. That necessarily increases the price.
 
The Human Q-Tip said:
You have to pay them what the market demands, or do without. There isn't a third option.
Click to expand...
Then we do without. Plenty of teams thrive without a high target wr. Bakers best stretch was last year when Landry averaged 7 targets a game.
 
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