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Baker Mayfield: Fire The Cannons

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Out of the Rafters at the Q said:
Matt Ryan is "MVP caliber" the same way Derek Anderson is "Pro Bowl caliber" or Jason Garrett is "The Best Coach in the League."

Accolades mean nothing.. The guy is not a top 10 QB in the league.

You trade in your chips now for Matt Ryan and you've capped your ceiling. You aren't likely to win a championship with him at the helm.
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Why does he have to be a top 10 QB? There isn't even a consensus on how we measure QB's to complain about who is or isn't top 10. I'm not just going off his accolades either. Look at his numbers. How is it that people can agree that he was a top QB the year he won MVP and years later it's not like his numbers have fallen off a cliff. They're still good.

And what chips are we trading in for Matt Ryan? Don't try and make it seem like people are saying we need to trade our whole draft for him because that's not what anybody is suggesting. I think a lot of people see Matt Ryan as a clear upgrade over Baker Mayfield. We don't have to try and paint Matt Ryan as a bum though when he's clearly better than our current QB.

So is the bar for moving on from Baker Mayfield getting a top 10 QB? That's silly. If Baker is not the guy that doesn't mean that we have to get a top 10 QB. We just need a better one. matt Ryan is just one of the better ones who happens to be available. Yes his cap numbers will require some shuffling but I don't think it would be a problem for Berry or DePodesta.

All I know is this. For what Stefanski wants to do, I believe he can fulfill with ease with Matt Ryan.
 
Los216 said:
Why does he have to be a top 10 QB? There isn't even a consensus on how we measure QB's to complain about who is or isn't top 10. I'm not just going off his accolades either. Look at his numbers. How is it that people can agree that he was a top QB the year he won MVP and years later it's not like his numbers have fallen off a cliff. They're still good.

And what chips are we trading in for Matt Ryan? Don't try and make it seem like people are saying we need to trade our whole draft for him because that's not what anybody is suggesting. I think a lot of people see Matt Ryan as a clear upgrade over Baker Mayfield. We don't have to try and paint Matt Ryan as a bum though when he's clearly better than our current QB.

So is the bar for moving on from Baker Mayfield getting a top 10 QB? That's silly. If Baker is not the guy that doesn't mean that we have to get a top 10 QB. We just need a better one. matt Ryan is just one of the better ones who happens to be available. Yes his cap numbers will require some shuffling but I don't think it would be a problem for Berry or DePodesta.

All I know is this. For what Stefanski wants to do, I believe he can fulfill with ease with Matt Ryan.
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He wasn't an elite QB the year he got the MVP award.

Counting stats aren't a great indicator of performance. When you throw for 200 yards every fourth quarter down three scores by taking dink and dunk stuff underneath, your numbers look good but you played like shit.

Matt Ryan isn't going to challenge a defense. He's going to take what's given, miss reads, and has no mobility. Give me the uncertainty of Baker, for less money and no trade assets, over that all day. Sure, there's the possibility of Baker turning the ball over a ton and flaming out, but it's better than chopping my organization off at the knees with a mediocre QB who's living off a misguided award from yesteryear.

If you're moving on from Baker, you better be shooting for the moon. With the talent on this roster, there's no reason to sell yourself short. The guys like Cousins, Goff and Ryan just aren't good enough--so why would we move on to them? Either you stick with Baker or you try and get better.
 
I mean Baker is 7th in QBR right now if you put any stock into that rating.

www.espn.com

2023 NFL Season Leaders Total QBR | ESPN

Visit ESPN to view NFL Total QBR for the current and previous seasons
www.espn.com www.espn.com

I trust Stefanski and the staff. If they believe in developing Baker into more than what he is, great I'm with it. If they think he's capped out and think another qb is worth it, lets roll.

Personally I think Baker is in a tough spot. He hasn't really had the coaching to develop him the last couple seasons and the offense is built to win, NOW.
 
SuperSurge said:
I mean Baker is 7th in QBR right now if you put any stock into that rating.

www.espn.com

2023 NFL Season Leaders Total QBR | ESPN

Visit ESPN to view NFL Total QBR for the current and previous seasons
www.espn.com www.espn.com

Basically I trust Stefanski and the staff. If they believe in developing Baker into more than what he is, great I'm with it. If they think he's capped out and think another qb is worth it, lets roll.

Personally I think Baker is in a tough spot. He hasn't really had the coaching to develop him the last couple seasons and the offense is built to win, NOW.
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Is Baker Mayfield better than Kirk Cousins?
 
Man Called X said:
Seeing stats like that make me so damn thankful we got a second chance to grab Stefanski.
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Out of the Rafters at the Q said:
He wasn't an elite QB the year he got the MVP award.

Counting stats aren't a great indicator of performance. When you throw for 200 yards every fourth quarter down three scores by taking dink and dunk stuff underneath, your numbers look good but you played like shit.

Matt Ryan isn't going to challenge a defense. He's going to take what's given, miss reads, and has no mobility. Give me the uncertainty of Baker, for less money and no trade assets, over that all day. Sure, there's the possibility of Baker turning the ball over a ton and flaming out, but it's better than chopping my organization off at the knees with a mediocre QB who's living off a misguided award from yesteryear.

If you're moving on from Baker, you better be shooting for the moon. With the talent on this roster, there's no reason to sell yourself short. The guys like Cousins, Goff and Ryan just aren't good enough--so why would we move on to them? Either you stick with Baker or you try and get better.
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You need to get off of this elite QB mindset. Elite QB's are never available. This idea that you can easily move on from Baker and just plug in a guy who's elite is quite laughable. The whole idea in moving on from baker is to find a QB who is better. It doesn't have to be a young stud who you can plug in for the next 15 years. If the best you can do is Matt Ryan or matt Stafford then that probably means it's not easy to find really good QB's.

If you actually go back and read your reasoning for sticking with Baker you are actually making a good argument for moving on from him. You can sit on your hands and be scared about the cap or trade assets but the good teams know how to find a way to make it work without chopping themselves up. You can complain about Matt Ryan being mediocre but what exactly are you expecting to find when you move on from your QB? You aren't going to just have a Hall of fame QB fall into you lap or a top 10 guy. That's the whole reason why guys aren't available in the first place.

For the record I'm not writing Baker off right now. I'm just saying that there are some better options who are available and who will be available at the end of this season and if Baker continues trending the way that he is then we shouldn't waste anymore time trying to figure out if he's the guy. Go get another dude in here.
 
SuperSurge said:
I mean Baker is 7th in QBR right now if you put any stock into that rating.

www.espn.com

2023 NFL Season Leaders Total QBR | ESPN

Visit ESPN to view NFL Total QBR for the current and previous seasons
www.espn.com www.espn.com

I trust Stefanski and the staff. If they believe in developing Baker into more than what he is, great I'm with it. If they think he's capped out and think another qb is worth it, lets roll.

Personally I think Baker is in a tough spot. He hasn't really had the coaching to develop him the last couple seasons and the offense is built to win, NOW.
Click to expand...

I think he's in a great spot, but for maybe different reasons. He's not being asked to do too much. He has an offense around him that can protect him while he unlearns the bad habits and tendencies from last year's debacle. He's got the best rushing offense in the NFL and a stable of talented receivers.

I do agree that he's in a tough position in having to learn yet another offensive system and unlearn a ton of bad habits. Luckily, it appears the Browns may have finally found their head coach.

All Baker's being asked to do is take care of the football and go for the big plays when they're open. He's not lighting the world on fire, but he's got 9 TDs against 4 INTs. He's on pace for around 28 TDs and 8 INTs - numbers we would have absolutely killed for in years past from the quarterback position.

And you're right, the offense is definitely built to win now. He said something to the effect of being grateful that he could learn to be better following a win, as opposed to learning from a tough loss. I think that speaks volumes about not just his psyche, but the mentality of the team. Winning cures a lot of ills.
 
Marcus said:
I think he's in a great spot, but for maybe different reasons. He's not being asked to do too much. He has an offense around him that can protect him while he unlearns the bad habits and tendencies from last year's debacle. He's got the best rushing offense in the NFL and a stable of talented receivers.

I do agree that he's in a tough position in having to learn yet another offensive system and unlearn a ton of bad habits. Luckily, it appears the Browns may have finally found their head coach.

All Baker's being asked to do is take care of the football and go for the big plays when they're open. He's not lighting the world on fire, but he's got 9 TDs against 4 INTs. He's on pace for around 28 TDs and 8 INTs - numbers we would have absolutely killed for in years past from the quarterback position.

And you're right, the offense is definitely built to win now. He said something to the effect of being grateful that he could learn to be better following a win, as opposed to learning from a tough loss. I think that speaks volumes about not just his psyche, but the mentality of the team. Winning cures a lot of ills.
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At what point is Baker just doing what he's asked to do not enough then? When do the training wheels come off? I get it that it's a new system but that excuse has about 2 more weeks left before it's run it's course. It feels like people are dangerously toeing the line. We're getting very close to people excusing everything he does as learning or growth when in reality he just might not be the guy.

I want him to be that dude but he needs to really show it. Not just do the bare minimum that's asked. He needs to show that he can g out there and be the reason why we are winning games. If he can't do that then how can we trust him to be the guy going forward?
 
Los216 said:
They're close? So where does Matt Ryan rank in compared to Baker and Cousins?
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Most rankings I see still put him in the top 10 QB. I personally hope he gets traded out of Atlanta soon.
 
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Los216 said:
At what point is Baker just doing what he's asked to do not enough then? When do the training wheels come off? I get it that it's a new system but that excuse has about 2 more weeks left before it's run it's course. It feels like people are dangerously toeing the line. We're getting very close to people excusing everything he does as learning or growth when in reality he just might not be the guy.

I want him to be that dude but he needs to really show it. Not just do the bare minimum that's asked. He needs to show that he can g out there and be the reason why we are winning games. If he can't do that then how can we trust him to be the guy going forward?
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So 7 games is all you give a quarterback in a new system? With no offseason? That's a tough scale.
 
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