Isaac 3 & D Okoro - A Two Way Playing Basketball Savant

[Cavatt]

HE looks like a scared kid too much. Very similar to Garland in his 2nd year. Showing flashes that he can do more, and then not doing it when he had the opportunity.

I keep saying it, but it is a change in mentality that is going to push Okoro forward. It isn't just his shot, or his handle. He def needs to improve both, but not a crazy amount. He needs to change the way he approaches the game and just be 10% more selfish and try to dunk on guys, drive on smaller defenders etc.

If you watch his highlights this year you think he would rival Anthony Edwards, but instead he just does like 1 or 2 cool things per game. He needs to make those highlights an every play aspiration.

He's beyond a team player, he is a guy who capable of more, but won't go for it wholeheartedly. The other guy suffering from this on a consistent basis on our team is Wade. If they could both just take a page from Lamar who is maybe less talented than either of them, but just goes for it and sees success with his aggression, we'd be fine and we'd be happy with Okoro.

I suspect like Darius, Okoro feels like a little brother and doesn't want to take shots away from the guys he perceives as better than him on the team. Just getting older will help him and I also think if Sexton comes back it will help him a lot because Sexton encourages him to be aggressive and feeds him the ball in his spots.

 

[MirORich]

In addition to comparing him to Smart(shooting only, smart grew up as a PG/main ball handler), peep Dorian Finney-Smith’s first three seasons. Stat wise and specifically from 3, very similar(and worse in some cases) in his first three years as a 23-25 year old when compared to Okoro’s first two years as a 20/21 year old. DFS didn’t break 31% from 3P until his 4th season.

Obviously DFS was not a lotto pick. Okoro is a disappointment as a number 5 pick but that is in the rear view. I would not give up on him(or Stevens) as important developmental wings that could play functional roles in a 8 man rotation or even a little better than that.

Not what we wanted from a top5 pick and doesn’t deserve automatic starting status anymore, but still worth the developmental time and hope.

 

[Cavatt]

Smart was a college PG and they eased him in slowly to run the offense in Boston but he was always capable of providing ball handling and playmaking. Boston has had alot of ball handlers since Smart was there. They were using Evan Turner as their backup PG in Smarts first two season.

Smarts ability to share the point duties is a big reason why they were able to develop him and keep him on the floor. Okoro can barely dribble so his shooting numbers would need to far outpace Smarts to prove equal value.

But he is a much better shooter than Smart

At 21 both in their 2nd year

Smart had 3 assists and Isaac has just under 2 at 1.8 without handling the ball

Finishing? 65% for Isaac 51% for Smart
3p% 35% for Isaac and 25% for Smart
eFg .544 vs .405
TS% .589 vs .463
ft% .76% vs .77%


Jumps right out that Smart was not at an NBA level with his efficiency until well into his career. He was a terrible shooter and he could not be relied on there. Isaac is at NBA efficiency and even good efficiency in several areas. 35% is basically the min for a 3pt shooter, but even there he was much much better the 2nd half the season. He's to the point with both his ft% and his 3pt% that I am not worried at all about whether he can shoot.

It's volume. He needs to get his volume up even if it impacts his percentages for a year or 2.

I think the other thing that helps is they both have the same ft% which was a good indicator for Smart who did improve his ft% his second year from the mid 60's just like Okoro.

 

[Heat Check]

Okoro will never be a featured offensive player on this team. There's no need, and and he's not that guy. It makes no sense to try to force-feed him shots or demand that he gets more "selfish". Square peg, round hole.

He's a guy who's gonna continue to get his scoring opportunities from the flow of the game, ideally. I can't see the Cavs ever regularly running plays for him as part of the offensive diet. Hell, they're not running plays for anyone now.

What he has to be is a threat. He has to show teams that when the ball does find its way to him, he can make his open shots (not just from the corners) and punish closeouts. That still won't be enough to keep him in the starting lineup, but it will keep him in the rotation because he'll contribute to spacing.

You just have to look at Okoro like he was drafted at #18. That immediately adjusts your expectations for him.

 

[Cavatt]

Okoro will never be a featured offensive player on this team. There's no need, and and he's not that guy. It makes no sense to try to force-feed him shots or demand that he gets more "selfish". Square peg, round hole.

He's a guy who's gonna continue to get his scoring opportunities from the flow of the game, ideally. I can't see the Cavs ever regularly running plays for him as part of the offensive diet. Hell, they're not running plays for anyone now.

What he has to be is a threat. He has to show teams that when the ball does find its way to him, he can make his open shots (not just from the corners) and punish closeouts. That still won't be enough to keep him in the starting lineup, but it will keep him in the rotation because he'll contribute to spacing.

You just have to look at Okoro like he was drafted at #18. That immediately adjusts your expectations for him.

You said the same thing as me while disagreeing. I don't think he needs to take 20 shots a game, but he can't pass up good looks.

 

[inliner311]

But he is a much better shooter than Smart

At 21 both in their 2nd year

Smart had 3 assists and Isaac has just under 2 at 1.8 without handling the ball

Finishing? 65% for Isaac 51% for Smart
3p% 35% for Isaac and 25% for Smart
eFg .544 vs .405
TS% .589 vs .463
ft% .76% vs .77%


Jumps right out that Smart was not at an NBA level with his efficiency until well into his career. He was a terrible shooter and he could not be relied on there. Isaac is at NBA efficiency and even good efficiency in several areas. 35% is basically the min for a 3pt shooter, but even there he was much much better the 2nd half the season. He's to the point with both his ft% and his 3pt% that I am not worried at all about whether he can shoot.

It's volume. He needs to get his volume up even if it impacts his percentages for a year or 2.

I think the other thing that helps is they both have the same ft% which was a good indicator for Smart who did improve his ft% his second year from the mid 60's just like Okoro.

I agree that he needs to increase his volume which went down in year 2. He also got way too selective, his shot charts show this. I think if his shot chart doesn't change though, the volume will be hard to increase. It just way to narrow and doesn't fit the position he plays. If his year 2 shot chart was a stretch 5 that could rebound heavily, it would a nice starting point, just not sure how it works for a guard or a small wing.

 

[foucault87]

I agree that he needs to increase his volume which went down in year 2. He also got way too selective, his shot charts show this. I think if his shot chart doesn't change though, the volume will be hard to increase. It just way to narrow and doesn't fit the position he plays. If his year 2 shot chart was a stretch 5 that could rebound heavily, it would a nice starting point.
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That shot chart looks really similar to Bruce Bowen. He was corner 3s and layups only. Obviously otherworldly on d.

Okoro has more offensive game than that. Im sure we will see it soon

 

[willglam]

I'm giving Kobe a pass on this draft. He was still tasked with finding the anti-LeBron.

Remember when he chose to draft Okoro and someone with his skill set and projection we had Kevin Porter Jr still on roster at that time so obviously If no KPJ then perhaps he goes different direction

 

[Cavatt]

Remember when he chose to draft Okoro and someone with his skill set and projection we had Kevin Porter Jr still on roster at that time so obviously If no KPJ then perhaps he goes different direction

Yeah very hard to justify Haliburton with both KPJ and Sexton on board.

 

[Cavatt]

I agree that he needs to increase his volume which went down in year 2. He also got way too selective, his shot charts show this. I think if his shot chart doesn't change though, the volume will be hard to increase. It just way to narrow and doesn't fit the position he plays. If his year 2 shot chart was a stretch 5 that could rebound heavily, it would a nice starting point, just not sure how it works for a guard or a small wing.
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I don't really think his offensive game is going to be very sophisticated. He will be the 4th or 5th option on the floor. Punish people in transition, cut from the corners, he will finish better and better around he rim, and hit some open 3s, maybe more from the wing next year as he actually did that pretty well.

I don't think his offense has to be that sophisticate though if he can use his playmaking off closeouts or dump offs to bigs in the paint when he is walled off.

His FTR is 36%. 3s, finishes within 3 feet, free throws. Male the right pass when those aren't available, play elite defense. That's 1-2 extra tools for him to rely on that guys like Thybulle can't.

 

[Muffinalt]

HE looks like a scared kid too much. Very similar to Garland in his 2nd year. Showing flashes that he can do more, and then not doing it when he had the opportunity.

I keep saying it, but it is a change in mentality that is going to push Okoro forward. It isn't just his shot, or his handle. He def needs to improve both, but not a crazy amount. He needs to change the way he approaches the game and just be 10% more selfish and try to dunk on guys, drive on smaller defenders etc.

If you watch his highlights this year you think he would rival Anthony Edwards, but instead he just does like 1 or 2 cool things per game. He needs to make those highlights an every play aspiration.

He's beyond a team player, he is a guy who capable of more, but won't go for it wholeheartedly. The other guy suffering from this on a consistent basis on our team is Wade. If they could both just take a page from Lamar who is maybe less talented than either of them, but just goes for it and sees success with his aggression, we'd be fine and we'd be happy with Okoro.

I suspect like Darius, Okoro feels like a little brother and doesn't want to take shots away from the guys he perceives as better than him on the team. Just getting older will help him and I also think if Sexton comes back it will help him a lot because Sexton encourages him to be aggressive and feeds him the ball in his spots.

Agree with all this.

I think when he was coming off the bench it was better suited for him. Harder to justify looking for your own when you are next to he 4 best players on the team. But off the bench its different.

Having him and Sexton come off the bench would be ridiculous energy. They could be one of the best benches, especially when Rubio comes back, or we draft a guy ready to push Lauri.

Looking forward to it a lot actually. Get a table setting vet PG next to them who can space the floor untill Ricky is back, and they can do some serious damage with Love.

 

[CavsKermit]

Okoro will never be a featured offensive player on this team. There's no need, and and he's not that guy. It makes no sense to try to force-feed him shots or demand that he gets more "selfish". Square peg, round hole.

He's a guy who's gonna continue to get his scoring opportunities from the flow of the game, ideally. I can't see the Cavs ever regularly running plays for him as part of the offensive diet. Hell, they're not running plays for anyone now.

What he has to be is a threat. He has to show teams that when the ball does find its way to him, he can make his open shots (not just from the corners) and punish closeouts. That still won't be enough to keep him in the starting lineup, but it will keep him in the rotation because he'll contribute to spacing.

You just have to look at Okoro like he was drafted at #18. That immediately adjusts your expectations for him.

He did jump from 31.5% from 3-point range to 35% from range his second year in the NBA. A similar jump in his third year would bring him up 38.5 would make him not only a good three point shooter, but closer to elite status. What I'd hope for is that he'd triple his number of attempts and settle in around 36-37%. Also, while the corner three is easier because it's closer, it's also easier for defenses to cover that ground so it would behoove him to get comfortable from shooting from out around the top of line as well.

I keep going back to his age and how young he is. Brunson was 22 when he was drafted and he didn't look great his rookie year. He's about to get paid this summer. I don't know what Okoro's ceiling is and I'm definitely not in the refuse-to-trade-him camp. I just don't want the Cavs burning assets on guys who aren't the answer when there's any chance they've got players on rookie contracts, or even players who have yet to be selected, who could be the answer. It's really hard to come by two-way wings who can shoot in the NBA. It's why you want to retain your trade assets until one becomes available.

 

[Cavatt]

He did jump from 31.5% from 3-point range to 35% from range his second year in the NBA. A similar jump in his third year would bring him up 38.5 would make him not only a good three point shooter, but closer to elite status. What I'd hope for is that he'd triple his number of attempts and settle in around 36-37%. Also, while the corner three is easier because it's closer, it's also easier for defenses to cover that ground so it would behoove him to get comfortable from shooting from out around the top of line as well.

I keep going back to his age and how young he is. Brunson was 22 when he was drafted and he didn't look great his rookie year. He's about to get paid this summer. I don't know what Okoro's ceiling is and I'm definitely not in the refuse-to-trade-him camp. I just don't want the Cavs burning assets on guys who aren't the answer when there's any chance they've got players on rookie contracts, or even players who have yet to be selected, who could be the answer. It's really hard to come by two-way wings who can shoot in the NBA. It's why you want to retain your trade assets until one becomes available.

Yes, he is still young and is barely older than Mobley.

Fact is we knew Okoro's timeline was longer for offense than the other guys, just like we knew right away Mobley was just out of the box a positive NBA player as soon as we saw him.

End of 2nd year for a player you ask

Is the guy helping the team? Is he flashing any signs? Can he defend?

You can answer yes to all 3 of those. Even if there's a caveat that he helps most with lots of offense around him.

Is he a for sure starter? Is he a star?

No to both.

 

[J_J]

I suspect like Darius, Okoro feels like a little brother and doesn't want to take shots away from the guys he perceives as better than him on the team. Just getting older will help him and I also think if Sexton comes back it will help him a lot because Sexton encourages him to be aggressive and feeds him the ball in his spots.

This^^

We saw towards the end of his rookie season that Sexton and Okoro played really well together. I still believe Okoro has a lot of potential and he is a hard working guy that would allow him to become better. Some of it is mental for him but we definitely need to get him in places to score such as getting him back door cuts, having him with the ball on perimeter, or making curls up top with PnRs with Lauri, Mobley, or a shooter. We can’t afford to have Okoro just be a standing corner shooter.

 

[Heat Check]

having him with the ball on perimeter, or making curls up top with PnRs with Lauri, Mobley, or a shooter.

As long as the Cavs offense is all ball domination and high PnR's by Garland, none of that is going to happen.

It'll be interesting to see how Okoro functions in the 2nd unit, though. In the starting lineup, he's always gonna be the 5th option, an off-ball guy.