Koby Altman nailed, then failed to take breathalyzer…

[JJ_PR]

Yeah not sure I get this. Chicago got a 1st and 2nd for a player that wasn't a part of their future. Portland got the best player in the deal in Nance.

Cavs traded the best player, didn't get a first in the process, and immediately had to pay the player they acquired. Sorry I'm having trouble processing this.

Larry Nance better than Markkanen? That's debatable. Lauri is younger & has some upside. I love this for Cleveland. They must think Mobley isn't ready for heavy minutes.

The way you worded that last paragraph is weird. Of course they had to pay Markkanen, it's a S&T.

 

[inliner311]

I figured Koby would do something to compete this year but trading Nance who is in his prime for the upside play of Lauri seems like the move a safe GM who is not on the hot seat would make as opposed to one making the playoff. Am I wrong in thinking this?

Roster construction is an issue sure, but what if Koby explored every possible trade for a competent SF and came up with nothing (short of adding a 2022 1st round pick)? He trades for Lauri who he got as the best possible return for Nance to alleviate the scoring and shooting issues and rolls the dice on the next 2 drafts to find the coveted wing.

With the contracts we had and the lack of great assets, Koby needed to get a player on the MLE. Koby limited himself by trading for Rubio before the draft. I think alot of people would be less mad about this trade if we got Markkaden for Prince's contract and a couple 2nd round pick. I don't know if there is a route to get a wing via trade now. There are still some decent backup PGs still on free agent market. Dennis Smith Jr, Teague, Ntilikina, and Wanamaker. We also now know someone would have given up an expiring and a 1st round pick for Nance.

If we came away from free agency with Dennis Smith Jr and Wanamaker. Then we traded Prince's contract for Markkaden. We would still have Nance to trade or we could have just taken Derrick Jones Jr plus the first and waited for the wing we wanted to get that player. Kyle Anderson and Cam Reddish most likely could be have for that first round pick.

 

[BigZ94]

Koby sucks there’s no debate here anymore I think, we just traded a valuable player and a potential key piece we could have used at the deadline for value, in a sign and trade for a player Chicago didn’t even want? What the fuck?

And this dude is over paying every player we sign… was anybody going to offer Love 30 mil over 4 years? Who was going to pay Allen more then 20 mil? Who was going to give Lauri more then 16? It’s like Koby doesn’t know there’s a thing called salary cap. If we buy out Love what a fucking failure of a signing, not that it wasn’t already

I know Nance has injury issues… but so does Lauri? Fire this guy before he does more damage

Koby did a couple decent trades and drafted ok (only within the top 10 however no picks outside the lottery worth a damn) but the Kyrie trade could be one of the worst hauls for a young superstar ever, should have been fired for that alone. Fuck me there has to be nba execs better then this bum

 

[Blazie]

Sorry for bumping this, but if you're having a rough morning and need a chuckle, the initial reactions to the Nance trade are worth a re-read.

 

[Ohioplayer00]

Drummond for sure.

To a lesser extent, guys like George Hill and Rodney Hood who apparently never were brought on board either after the Finals run.

I'm also talking about Belein. For all intents and purposes, it certainly seemed like he got run out of town as well.

Shit, even Ty Lue fits in my mind.

Belien was not a good fit for an NBA HC job anymore than Blatt was. It’s not saying he’s not a good coach…..just not a good NBA coach and being able to communicate with the selfish narrasstic personalities of today’s NBA player. Blatt wasn't ready for the NBA period!

 

[Cavatt]

Belien was not a good fit for an NBA HC job anymore than Blatt was. It’s not saying he’s not a good coach…..just not a good NBA coach and being able to communicate with the selfish narrasstic personalities of today’s NBA player. Blatt wasn't ready for the NBA period!

They both needed to be an assistant first

 

[Cassity14]

Belien was not a good fit for an NBA HC job anymore than Blatt was. It’s not saying he’s not a good coach…..just not a good NBA coach and being able to communicate with the selfish narrasstic personalities of today’s NBA player. Blatt wasn't ready for the NBA period!

I don't disagree on Belein, but that falls back on Koby too because Koby was the general manager for the entirety of Belein's stint here.

 

[J_J]

I believe I am one of the few who likes Koby. I liked all his players that he drafted before we drafted them: Sexton, Garland, Winder, KPJ, Okoro, and Mobley. It didn’t work out with KPJ but I just loved his talent. Unfortunately it just didn’t work out for us but it may end up in the luck of the draw with Mobley coming to our team. For a franchise like Cleveland, it takes patience and time to rebuild. We haven’t been lucky with the lottery until Mobley and I think this team has a lot of talent now. This year will have some ups and downs but will be going to the right direction.

I don’t want to give up on Windler. Shooters definitely take some development in the NBA especially on the mental stage and traveling is much different than college. Joe Harris and Danny Green took a long time for them to finally take the next step and I want to be patient with Windler. Windler was able to make it fly and shoot with confidence at Belmont. It was unfortunate with his injuries but we saw some glimpses in that one great month before his injury. Windler is also a plus rebounder something that we will need and I hope he gets healthy.

Drummond trade was more to see how can our guards in Sexton and Garland work if we have a center. I felt more of a trial and error to see how our guards can coexist together and that is where we got Allen. Now having Mobley and Allen as our twin towers, it shows again on how core can play together.

I feel having Rubio as veteran can help Garland and Sexton and having another PG is going to help Lauri, Okoro, Mobley, and the team as well. Having Lauri in the offense will immensely help spacing and lack of shooting ability last year. This definitely gives more spacing for Sexton and Garland.

I see our youth will improve this year. I love the connection with Garland and Allen with the lobs together. Remember they only even played half a season together. Building the core takes time especially with a COVID year and the team needed more talent. And of course having a top talent like Mobley is going to do wonders for this team.

Im not saying Koby is perfect and he’s made some mistakes. But I feel the core he has brought have an exciting future and I’m looking forward to seeing how this core develops together.

 

[Cavatt]

He's increased the talent level on the team, so he did the first part of his job.

 

[cavsfever]

He's increased the talent level on the team, so he did the first part of his job.

given the draft position and what he started with he would have had to work very hard not to increase talent levels on the team. Especially if you are just thinking in terms of young talent - a lot of talent has been shipped out in his time too. He still hasn’t increased “winning” levels though, which is also important.

really, the only argument should be whether Kobys performance so far is “acceptably ok” or “bad”. I don’t see the argument that it’s actually good, not based on what we know today. The title of this thread remains as ridiculous as ever

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

given the draft position and what he started with he would have had to work very hard not to increase talent levels on the team. Especially if you are just thinking in terms of young talent - a lot of talent has been shipped out in his time too. He still hasn’t increased “winning” levels though, which is also important.

really, the only argument should be whether Kobys performance so far is “acceptably ok” or “bad”. I don’t see the argument that it’s actually good, not based on what we know today. The title of this thread remains as ridiculous as ever

He has gotten good value for each of his four lottery picks. Lots of GM's would have blown at least one of them. He also managed the cap and other assets well enough to pick up a long-term answer at the 5 unexpectedly.

So I'd go with "good" myself.

 

[cavsfever]

He has gotten good value for each of his four lottery picks. Lots of GM's would have blown at least one of them. He also managed the cap and other assets well enough to pick up a long-term answer at the 5 unexpectedly.

So I'd go with "good" myself.

has he gotten good value? Not for KPJ certainly since he dumped him for nothing, and hate to say it but Windler’s not looking good. Jury’s still out on Sexton too really - if he doesn’t end up fitting into our long term plans and we have to trade him for a poor return that ends up bad value too even if Sexton is a good player (and I do like him)

Fine on picking up Allen, but he’s not a great bargain all-star or anything, and given all the assets we have shed would have been surprising if we weren’t in a position to sign somebody

Cavs fans have low standards when it comes to GMs. Like an abused woman who’s like “he doesn’t drink or beat me”!

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

has he gotten good value? Not for KPJ certainly since he dumped him for nothing, and hate to say it but Windler’s not looking good. Jury’s still out on Sexton too really - if he doesn’t end up fitting into our long term plans and we have to trade him for a poor return that ends up bad value too even if Sexton is a good player (and I do like him)

Fine on picking up Allen, but he’s not a great bargain all-star or anything, and given all the assets we have shed would have been surprising if we weren’t in a position to sign somebody

Cavs fans have low standards when it comes to GMs. Like an abused woman who’s like “he doesn’t drink or beat me”!

KPJ was the a longshot, and cost only second-rounders. A GM missing on those doesn't set back a franchise.

I think your standards are too high. Very rarely, a GM will make something out of nothing - those are the very best. For the rest, success boils down to getting consistent value out of the assets you have. If you consistently get value for your lottery picks - which I think Koby has - a rebuild will succeed. To me, that's "good".

 

[daddywags]

given the draft position and what he started with he would have had to work very hard not to increase talent levels on the team. Especially if you are just thinking in terms of young talent - a lot of talent has been shipped out in his time too. He still hasn’t increased “winning” levels though, which is also important.

really, the only argument should be whether Kobys performance so far is “acceptably ok” or “bad”. I don’t see the argument that it’s actually good, not based on what we know today. The title of this thread remains as ridiculous as ever

He has increased the winning level. Went from .232 to .292 to .306. In full 82 game seasons that would go from 19 wins to 24 then 25. Nothing spectacular, but still consistent improvement.

 

[TheISHT]

KPJ was the a longshot, and cost only second-rounders. A GM missing on those doesn't set back a franchise.

I think your standards are too high. Very rarely, a GM will make something out of nothing - those are the very best. For the rest, success boils down to getting consistent value out of the assets you have. If you consistently get value for your lottery picks - which I think Koby has - a rebuild will succeed. To me, that's "good".

Or they aren’t the best, just lucky on circumstance and timing.