gourimoko
Fighting the good fight!
- Joined
- Aug 13, 2008
- Messages
- 39,845
- Reaction score
- 53,645
- Points
- 148
Gouri, you know better than to dismiss a result simply because it tells you something you disagree with.
Indeed.. But I'm dismissing the result because I can't find any reasonable means of aggregation that would use anything more than (1) advanced statistic that would place those several individuals ahead of Kyrie Irving, again solely on the basis of statistical analysis.
Simply put, it makes no sense.
If we go solely based on RPM (which I think has limited use for perimeter players, but that's another story) then Kyrie still wouldn't be 9th, he'd be 8th. If we weigh ORPM higher than DRPM (which makes more statistical sense) then Kyrie would approach 6th.
IF we include other statistics like WAR, PER, OWS, ORtg, Drtg, etc then Kyrie would approach 4th.
Again, it's the apparent absence of statistical basis that bothers me about their rankings.
It's not at all baseless to conclude that John Wall is a better leader,
How do you measure that statistically?
play-maker, and defender than Kyrie.
Sure, he is a better play-maker and a better defender on average. But the degree to which he is better at those aspects does not outweigh Kyrie's all-around impact on both ends of the floor.
In essence, the impact of John Wall's 9.8 assists are accounted for in his ORPM, PER, OWS, and Win Shares, as are Kyrie's.
It is in fact, unscientific, to point to (cherrypick) this single box statistic and say "see, John Wall is better."
Instead, using the aggregate metrics, we see that Kyrie helps his team generate more wins and is more impactful (net) on the floor than John Wall.
They're being judged as point-guards, and in that context Irving shouldn't even be in the rankings as he's not even his own team's primary playmaker.
Kyrie averaged 6.2 assist/game prior to LeBron coming to Cleveland. Simply because he plays next to LeBron, and he's a scoring phenom, doesn't entail that he can't play his position.
He is the best ball-handler in the NBA, and has historically been slightly better than average at generating assists (13th among starting guards).
People wouldn't say that Deron Williams, Kemba Walker, Mike Conley, Tony Parker, Trey Burke, Damian Lillard, or Brandon Knight shouldn't be ranked. Kyrie generated more assists than all of those players, and still carries a higher assist ratio than all of those players.
So Jon, my point is that we're running into a bit of unscientific irrational bias when we discount Kyrie's assists simply to spite him for being a prolific scorer.
He is very much like an Allen Iverson who can do both, and quite well.