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Your 2019 Cleveland Indians

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Sorry, not a Kluber, mph guru. I thought he threw harder than that. You know, being our Ace for the last few years, I assumed he went harder than 93. My bad.
FYI, not everyone that views the boards knows every stat and metric. I see why this board has few posters over here on the Indians board. Some here like to be condescending assholes.

There’s some of that, but pitch speed isn’t really an “advanced” stat. If you’re interested enough to find the baseball section on the Cavs board, one usually knows some of this basic stuff just from watching a game or two.
 
I mean, if you watch Indians games, you should know Kluber isn't the type of guy that pumps fastballs past guys.

I can see not knowing what are the tendencies of a random reliever, or new guys like Civale, Plesac, etc. but Kluber has been around for 5+ years now

If you pull up his highlights, I'd bet 80% of his strikeouts are sliders that dart out of the zone at the last second or cutters that hit the edge of the strike zone perfectly.

Kluber velocity chart:


I know, I know. 4-seamer to 2-seamer, etc....Draw any conclusions you want.
 
Kluber velocity chart:


I know, I know. 4-seamer to 2-seamer, etc....Draw any conclusions you want.

This looks like the max and min velocity from specifically his sinker from every game from 2014-present

Below is average sinker velocity by year.

kluber.png
 
Kluber velocity chart:


I know, I know. 4-seamer to 2-seamer, etc....Draw any conclusions you want.

We did discuss his velocity in the off season to be honest when he was in the rumor mill about being traded and we did analyze his numbers and issues going forward. Now that being said @JDailey23 wasnt really around in the off season chatting about the roster/rumor mill of it. If the poster who replied paid attention to who was saying that, then they should have known he isn’t a frequent poster in here so he was never apart of the off season discussion about Kluber and probably wouldn’t remember all his numbers and all he needed to do was reply, hey, Kluber has only been 92-93 the last couple seasons so his velocity right now isn’t an issue (and maybe sent a link to the info as well).

Personally I am still worried about Kluber since pitching will put pressure on his arm so hopefully it’s 100% healed and strong, but we shall see!

I always look to see who made the post since I know who is in here all the time, who is a reader and lurker and who is only in here once in awhile since that does matter when responding to someone.
 
From the PD:

Why Corey Kluber isn’t done being Corey Kluber: ‘I would have expected myself to turn it around’ -- Doug Lesmerises

Updated Aug 14, 11:56 PM; Posted Aug 14, 7:50 AM

Corey Kluber held a baseball camp for kids during his time on this injured list. Tuesday night, he was working his way back with a rehab start in Akron. (Joshua Gunter, cleveland.com)


cleveland.com

Corey Kluber held a baseball camp for kids during his time on this injured list. Tuesday night, he was working his way back with a rehab start in Akron. (Joshua Gunter, cleveland.com)








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By Doug Lesmerises, cleveland.com

AKRON, Ohio -- Corey Kluber touched 93 Tuesday night. He also sat at 33.
The radar gun reading for the ace of the Cleveland Indians was the number of interest in his second rehab start on his way back to a pennant race, but the turn of the calendar might be in the back of your mind, too. Maybe because of the 5.80 ERA.
The last time Kluber came through Akron on a rehab start, also before a sellout crowd like Tuesday night, he was on his way to a Cy Young Award. In 2017, a lower back strain knocked Kluber out for a month. In six starts before his injury that season, he had an ERA of 5.06. After he returned, he had a 1.62 ERA in 23 starts.



Boy, does that guy know how to do a rehab.
This year, Kluber landed on the injured list at the same time, the start of May, but his absence will stretch close to four months instead of one. What’s similar is that he wasn’t great at the start of this season -- a 5.80 ERA in seven starts. What’s different is that the back was clearly bothering him in 2017, and the time away on the injured list fixed what ailed him. This time, a fluke knocked him out, a broken bone in his pitching arm off a batted ball.
What’s also different is that he’s two years older and not a ton of pitchers maintain a consistently high level of healthy production beyond age 33.
What’s the same is that he’s Corey Kluber.
I thought he looked good Tuesday night, with some sharp breaking balls and fastballs on the corner with movement among his six strikeouts. In his final inning in the fourth, he tried to finish one guy off with a high fastball at 91 on a two-strike pitch and it landed on the other side of the outfield wall. But while retiring the first 10 batters, he said it didn’t feel as weird as his first rehab start in Columbus -- he got into the flow sooner -- and he generally looked like a pitcher ready to help in a race sooner rather than later. Maybe one more tick upward with the fastball -- he hit 92 regularly and touched 93 a few times. But generally Kluberesque.



Which he believes he is. Because he’s Corey Kluber.
You or I might be tempted to describe it as “still Corey Kluber” but tying anything to the past isn’t how Kluber wins. His belief and plan at 33 is no different than it was at 27, in that of course it is different. My temptation is to tell you that Kluber will come back and pitch at a high level because the time off was a happy accident for him, and in the only other instance in his career when an injury knocked him out for any length of time, he returned as the best pitcher in the American League.
But Kluber doesn’t think the injury might have helped. He believes only in today, and the idea that he’s unlikely to string together six months of bad todays. I declared in the press box that Kluber was back after a beautiful fastball on the inside corner in the fourth inning. He allowed the homer two pitches later.
Kluber would stick more to the idea that he never left.
“I think regardless of whether I was injured or not, I would have expected myself to turn it around,” Kluber told me Tuesday night after throwing 60 pitches. "I wouldn’t have expected to keep pitching poorly even if I would have stayed healthy. I believe I would have been able to to turn things around.



"No pitcher that I ever talked to has gone through an entire season feeling great the whole time. Things get out of whack and part of a six-month season is trying to get out of those lulls and then riding out the highs as long as you can.
“I don’t know if I necessarily believe that the injury this year or that year was why I turned things around.”
Jose Ramirez couldn’t hit for two months and turned things around without an injury. Why? The best answer is probably something like, “because he’s Jose Ramirez.” Apply the same logic here. Kluber has never relied on pure power, so maintaining his status as one of the best pitchers in the game at age 33 and beyond is possible. Not because that’s typical, but because he’s elite.
This is a simple comparison, and the idea that most pitchers decline with age is obvious. But in the four seasons between 2015-18, pitchers 32 and younger had 60 seasons with 200 strikeouts. Pitchers 33 and older had eight seasons of 200 strikeouts, four by Justin Verlander.
Over the last 20 years, there have been 189 seasons of 200 strikeouts from pitchers 32 and younger. There have been 29 seasons of 200 strikeouts from pitchers 33 and older, and only six pitchers did it at least twice -- Randy Johnson (5), Verlander (4), Roger Clemens (3), Cliff Lee (2), Curt Schilling (2) and Roy Halladay (2). I gave Kluber a rough outline of some of those numbers and expressed the idea that it would make sense for him to join a group like that.



“To me, my age doesn’t affect the belief I have in myself,” Kluber said. “You have to go out there each day with what you have that day and you have to figure out a way to get the job done. Whether that’s a guy who’s 40 years old throwing 85 miles an hour, his job that day is to figure out a way to get the job done.”
Throwing 92 at age 33 is a long way from throwing 85 at 40. But my advice is to not let a bad April make you change how you view Kluber. Don’t go only by the context -- guy getting older has a rough start to the season. Go by the individual -- diligent professional attacks his job the same way.
The context matters some. In this case, the person matters more. Kluber is trying to make the best out of a bad break, but he would have done that anyway. He’s pitching differently now than he did when he won his first Cy Young at age 28, but he also pitches different on Sunday than he did on Tuesday.
“I don’t believe in comparing a season now to five years ago or seven years ago,” Kluber said. “There are so many things that are different. ... My stuff may not be as good as when I was 27, but I feel like I’m a more intelligent pitcher than when I was 27. I can work my way through a game better than I could then. There’s a give and take and I have more experience than when I was young, and that’s just the way it is."



Kluber never changes his preparation, but he always changes himself, and the result has been the same guy for five years. I don’t think that’s over. He won’t get to 200 strikeouts in his age 33 season, obviously. But he could pitch in September like a 200-strikeout guy, and he could get there at age 34 or 35.
You can view the previous five seasons -- 1,091 1/3 innings and 1,228 strikeouts -- as a burden or as proof. He’s done so much, how can he keep it up? He’s done so much, why wouldn’t he keep it up? Kluber views it as neither. He doesn’t view it all.
“I guess you can choose how to look at it,” Kluber said. “I can choose to say, I’ve done X,Y, Z and if things don’t go my way, I can fall back on that. Or I can choose to say I’ve done X, Y, Z but that doesn’t matter today.”
You don’t have to ignore it. He can choose to ignore it. The result should get fans and the pitcher to the same place.
He’s Corey Kluber -- still Kluber and always Kluber. Don’t give up on that yet.
 
Won’t lie, I was totally wrong about Wood/Verdugo not being enough for Kluber.
 
We did discuss his velocity in the off season to be honest when he was in the rumor mill about being traded and we did analyze his numbers and issues going forward. Now that being said @JDailey23 wasnt really around in the off season chatting about the roster/rumor mill of it. If the poster who replied paid attention to who was saying that, then they should have known he isn’t a frequent poster in here so he was never apart of the off season discussion about Kluber and probably wouldn’t remember all his numbers and all he needed to do was reply, hey, Kluber has only been 92-93 the last couple seasons so his velocity right now isn’t an issue (and maybe sent a link to the info as well).

Personally I am still worried about Kluber since pitching will put pressure on his arm so hopefully it’s 100% healed and strong, but we shall see!

I always look to see who made the post since I know who is in here all the time, who is a reader and lurker and who is only in here once in awhile since that does matter when responding to someone.

This makes zero sense. His velocity slowly declining is irrelevant considering the guy has never consistently thrown over 94 mph. Kluber has been a fixture in the rotation since 2013. He's been a household name for Indians fans since he won the Cy Young in 2014. When watching games, the mph shows on the screen after every single pitch.

To think 93 mph is way down for him suggests that person doesn't pay much attention to the Indians or watch many of Kluber's starts; 93 is par for the course for him. It doesn't take a "MPH Guru" or frequent poster of this section to know this.

Won’t lie, I was totally wrong about Wood/Verdugo not being enough for Kluber.

Wood has only made 4 starts this year and is a UFA.
 
This makes zero sense. His velocity slowly declining is irrelevant considering the guy has never consistently thrown over 94 mph. Kluber has been a fixture in the rotation since 2013. He's been a household name for Indians fans since he won the Cy Young in 2014. When watching games, the mph shows on the screen after every single pitch.

To think 93 mph is way down for him suggests that person doesn't pay much attention to the Indians or watch many of Kluber's starts; 93 is par for the course for him. It doesn't take a "MPH Guru" or frequent poster of this section to know this.



Wood has only made 4 starts this year and is a UFA.

As I’m more of a casual fan and boxscore watcher, I don’t recall Kluber ever consistently pitching over the 93 mph norm. I guess 5-6 years ago I can recall an occasional fastball reaching 95, but he’s always been in that 89-93 range. At least I thought he was.
His pitch selection and accuracy was his strength during his dominate stretch IMO. Guys had no idea what he was doing, and his movement was excellent.
 
Klubers changeup and three seam forkball are his out pitches so venlocity prob not the most important thing anyways.
 
As I’m more of a casual fan and boxscore watcher, I don’t recall Kluber ever consistently pitching over the 93 mph norm. I guess 5-6 years ago I can recall an occasional fastball reaching 95, but he’s always been in that 89-93 range. At least I thought he was.
His pitch selection and accuracy was his strength during his dominate stretch IMO. Guys had no idea what he was doing, and his movement was excellent.

Right, I am not too concerned if his velocity is slightly down so long as his command is on point.
 
From Cliff Corcoran of The Athletic's most recent "AL Awards Watch" column. Indians players getting love in all three major categories:

Most Valuable Player
5. Carlos Santana, 1B, Cleveland Indians

143 wRC+ (512 PA), 2.4 FR, 0.2 BR

.287/.410/.536, 27 HR, 88 BB, 77 K, 4/4 SB

How happy are Santana and Cleveland to be reunited? Rescued from a bad fit in Philadelphia via the Mariners and a pair of December trades that sent Jean Segura to the Phils and redistributed Yandy Díaz, Edwin Encarnación and Jake Bauers about the league, Santana is in the midst of a career year at the age of 33. A first-time All-Star this July, he got to play the game and participate in the Home Run Derby in his home park, and his bat has helped lead Cleveland back into the thick of an AL Central race they seemed to relinquish after an otherwise disappointing offseason and a variety of injuries, underperformance, and even a trade of some of their biggest stars from a year ago.

That’s a great narrative, but it’s not why Santana completes my list. He completes it because of the production of that career year at the plate, his surprising athleticism without a bat in his hand (remember, Santana is a 33-year-old former catcher who is built like a mailbox), and his reliability. With 88 more plate appearances, Santana will become the only player to have come to the plate at least 600 times in each of the last nine seasons.

Cy Young
2. Shane Bieber, RHP, Cleveland Indians

3.27 ERA, 146 ERA+, 3.31 FIP, 3.29 DRA,

6.06 K/BB, 11.1 K/9 (200 K), 1.8 BB/9, 1.3 HR/9, 1.01 WHIP, 6.4 IP/GS, 162 1/3 IP, 25 GS, 26 G

All-Star Game MVP Bieber has outstanding peripherals and trails Verlander by a single out for the league lead in innings pitched. A look at his game logs suggests an excess of weak opponents, against whom the bulk of his success has come. However, Baseball Prospectus’s opponent-quality figures actually tell us that Bieber has faced tougher-than-average competition. He is just so good that, when he faces the likes of the Blue Jays, Orioles and Tigers, he is especially dominant. Bieber has two of the five best game scores in the majors this season, the only pitcher who can make that claim, with those starts coming against the Blue Jays (94 on July 24) and the Orioles (92 on May 19). However, he has also pitched very effectively in three starts and one relief appearance against the rival Twins, who are on pace to set the single-season home run record for a team, and in both of his starts against the first-place Astros.

Rookie of the Year
5. Oscar Mercado, CF, Cleveland Indians
91 wRC+ (324 PA), 1.3 FR, 2.4 BR

.270/.317/.429, 9 HR, 17 BB, 59 K, 9/12 SB

While keeping an eye on shortstop Bo Bichette, thus far the most exciting member of a Blue Jays rookie class that has otherwise disappointed, I’ll give Mercado the final spot. Acquired from the Cardinals in a minor deal at last year’s non-waiver deadline, Mercado made his major-league debut on May 14 and took over center field on a full-time basis for Cleveland in late June. He has since proven to be a capable defender and an exciting baserunner, but his bat is flagging and there is little reason to expect the 24-year-old to rally in that regard any time soon.
 
This makes zero sense. His velocity slowly declining is irrelevant considering the guy has never consistently thrown over 94 mph. Kluber has been a fixture in the rotation since 2013. He's been a household name for Indians fans since he won the Cy Young in 2014. When watching games, the mph shows on the screen after every single pitch.

To think 93 mph is way down for him suggests that person doesn't pay much attention to the Indians or watch many of Kluber's starts; 93 is par for the course for him. It doesn't take a "MPH Guru" or frequent poster of this section to know this.



Wood has only made 4 starts this year and is a UFA.

I still take that trade every day of the week.
 
From Cliff Corcoran of The Athletic's most recent "AL Awards Watch" column. Indians players getting love in all three major categories:

Most Valuable Player
5. Carlos Santana, 1B, Cleveland Indians

143 wRC+ (512 PA), 2.4 FR, 0.2 BR

.287/.410/.536, 27 HR, 88 BB, 77 K, 4/4 SB

How happy are Santana and Cleveland to be reunited? Rescued from a bad fit in Philadelphia via the Mariners and a pair of December trades that sent Jean Segura to the Phils and redistributed Yandy Díaz, Edwin Encarnación and Jake Bauers about the league, Santana is in the midst of a career year at the age of 33. A first-time All-Star this July, he got to play the game and participate in the Home Run Derby in his home park, and his bat has helped lead Cleveland back into the thick of an AL Central race they seemed to relinquish after an otherwise disappointing offseason and a variety of injuries, underperformance, and even a trade of some of their biggest stars from a year ago.

That’s a great narrative, but it’s not why Santana completes my list. He completes it because of the production of that career year at the plate, his surprising athleticism without a bat in his hand (remember, Santana is a 33-year-old former catcher who is built like a mailbox), and his reliability. With 88 more plate appearances, Santana will become the only player to have come to the plate at least 600 times in each of the last nine seasons.

Cy Young
2. Shane Bieber, RHP, Cleveland Indians

3.27 ERA, 146 ERA+, 3.31 FIP, 3.29 DRA,

6.06 K/BB, 11.1 K/9 (200 K), 1.8 BB/9, 1.3 HR/9, 1.01 WHIP, 6.4 IP/GS, 162 1/3 IP, 25 GS, 26 G

All-Star Game MVP Bieber has outstanding peripherals and trails Verlander by a single out for the league lead in innings pitched. A look at his game logs suggests an excess of weak opponents, against whom the bulk of his success has come. However, Baseball Prospectus’s opponent-quality figures actually tell us that Bieber has faced tougher-than-average competition. He is just so good that, when he faces the likes of the Blue Jays, Orioles and Tigers, he is especially dominant. Bieber has two of the five best game scores in the majors this season, the only pitcher who can make that claim, with those starts coming against the Blue Jays (94 on July 24) and the Orioles (92 on May 19). However, he has also pitched very effectively in three starts and one relief appearance against the rival Twins, who are on pace to set the single-season home run record for a team, and in both of his starts against the first-place Astros.

Rookie of the Year
5. Oscar Mercado, CF, Cleveland Indians
91 wRC+ (324 PA), 1.3 FR, 2.4 BR

.270/.317/.429, 9 HR, 17 BB, 59 K, 9/12 SB

While keeping an eye on shortstop Bo Bichette, thus far the most exciting member of a Blue Jays rookie class that has otherwise disappointed, I’ll give Mercado the final spot. Acquired from the Cardinals in a minor deal at last year’s non-waiver deadline, Mercado made his major-league debut on May 14 and took over center field on a full-time basis for Cleveland in late June. He has since proven to be a capable defender and an exciting baserunner, but his bat is flagging and there is little reason to expect the 24-year-old to rally in that regard any time soon.

Not exactly a ringing endorsement of Mercado, but I think we've all noticed his performance slipping over the last month.
 

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