Tristan Thompson

[TitleTown]

You tell LBJ to play his best position and to rebound the ball better

And you get yourself a Battier. We still don't have a Battier

Sounds great. I'll also start wishing for a 10 inch cock and a billion dollars.

LBJ has made it clear, he doesn't want to play the PF. You try telling the best player on the planet he's wrong.

 

[TitleTown]

idk i think this is pretty simple

let him sign the QO, let his value plummet as love finally gets integrated into the offense and tristan returns to 6th man role and gets his 8/8 off the bench in 25mpg, and no one will consider giving him an offer close to the max

also i think tristan has gotta have a strong desire to play for the cavs, i'm 99% sure all this postulating is 100% paul and 0% tristan

His value was there before this years playoffs because his value has VERY LITTLE to do with how he performs.

Why do so many of you have no ability to understand supply/demand? TT's value has nothing to do with playing time. It'll be the same as 6th man.

We have insane cap inflation combined with an inability to replace what he provides the team.

Furthermore, our superstar loves him. Paul and TT are smart to leverage these things.

However, I also think the FO is smart to hold their ground.

What will happen? I have no fucking clue. But stop acting like there are simple solutions to this problem.

 

[Tendulkar]

His value was there before this years playoffs because his value has VERY LITTLE to do with how he performs.

Why do so many of you have no ability to understand supply/demand? TT's value has nothing to do with playing time. It'll be the same as 6th man.

We have insane cap inflation combined with an inability to replace what he provides the team.

Furthermore, our superstar loves him. Paul and TT are smart to leverage these things.

However, I also think the FO is smart to hold their ground.

What will happen? I have no fucking clue. But stop acting like there are simple solutions to this problem.

Why do so many of you think some nba teams will be stupid enough to pay him lot more than he is worth. What makes you think a FO with a team of professionals cannot see what we arm chair experts see. None is paying him max or near max next FA.
All the people here who think he will command near max because he will be a near max guy in the future. He is young. Apparently he has upside and never gets injured. And gonna be awesome with offensive rebounding and really shine in small ball line ups.
Reality is, he is damn good role player. Cap inflation or not, he won't get anything close to max.


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[Tendulkar]

The notion that a bad contract to TT will not hurt cavs except Gilberts pockets has to stop. We haggled over a month with JR and paid him 2 million less. Could have paid Delly 2 million more and secured him for couple more years. We cut Mike Miller to save money ( also to save a roster spot). Converted a first round pick into 2 second round picks to save money. May be we would have traded injury prone AV for Joe Johnson if not for huge tax bill, keeping in mind the tax hit because of TT. So yes over paying TT will and already has crippled cavs. Why do you care if TT earns 150 million or 200 million over the course of his career. If a bad contract is gonna hurt cavs title chances even a tiny bit, screw him.
Force him to take a QO and limit his minutes and sign him cheap next year.


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[Tendulkar]

In a way, last year's injuries in play offs are kinda boon to cavs. If none is injured and we won the title, there is no way in hell we would have retained all the pieces. Shump and Jr would have commanded 15-18 millions. Delly would have wanted around 5-7 million. TT would have commanded near max or max( funny to hear he still does). We would have never secured everyone. May be won't be able to sign mo, AL and Kaun. So the injuries were indeed blessing in disguise, that we were able to secure everyone and kept our title window longer.


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[Drifter]

The notion that a bad contract to TT will not hurt cavs except Gilberts pockets has to stop. We haggled over a month with JR and paid him 2 million less. Could have paid Delly 2 million more and secured him for couple more years. We cut Mike Miller to save money ( also to save a roster spot). Converted a first round pick into 2 second round picks to save money. May be we would have traded injury prone AV for Joe Johnson if not for huge tax bill, keeping in mind the tax hit because of TT. So yes over paying TT will and already has crippled cavs. Why do you care if TT earns 150 million or 200 million over the course of his career. If a bad contract is gonna hurt cavs title chances even a tiny bit, screw him.
Force him to take a QO and limit his minutes and sign him cheap next year.


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Not re-signing TT hurts the Cavs title chances in the future, IMO, more than signing him to an over-pay.
And Mike Miller was not a salary dump move. It was a getting rid of a horrible player move. Opened a roster spot and the Cavs were overjoyed to get rid of an empty-tank player who gave us nothing last year.

 

[TitleTown]

Why do so many of you think some nba teams will be stupid enough to pay him lot more than he is worth. What makes you think a FO with a team of professionals cannot see what we arm chair experts see. None is paying him max or near max next FA.
All the people here who think he will command near max because he will be a near max guy in the future. He is young. Apparently he has upside and never gets injured. And gonna be awesome with offensive rebounding and really shine in small ball line ups.
Reality is, he is damn good role player. Cap inflation or not, he won't get anything close to max.


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So you didn't read my post at all?

I specifically said that I DON'T KNOW what the FO will do.

I specifically said that I DON'T think this has anything to do with his value. Of course he's a role player--no shit.

That's not the problem. The problem is that even though he's a role player, it's a BIG role that he plays. He's always healthy on a team full of injury prone players, and he can play both the PF and the C.

This has NOTHING to do with TT's value. I think EVERY FUCKING PERSON on this board agrees that TT is NOT worth what he's asking.

EVERYONE agrees that he's NOT worth the ANYTHING NEAR the max.

So try thinking and reading before posting the same shit that has already been posted 10,000 times in this thread.

The problem is that outside of an unlikely trade, we can't replace him. He's just good enough that we need him, but just bad enough that he's not worth what he's asking. Add that to an insanely inflating cap, and we have a difficult valuation.

SO STOP PROPOSING OVERLY SIMPLISTIC SOLUTIONS TO A COMPLEX PROBLEM.

 

[Rich]

Not re-signing TT hurts the Cavs title chances in the future, IMO, more than signing him to an over-pay.
And Mike Miller was not a salary dump move. It was a getting rid of a horrible player move. Opened a roster spot and the Cavs were overjoyed to get rid of an empty-tank player who gave us nothing last year.

As part of the Haywood deal, they gave up draft picks to dump Miller. That's a classic example of a salary dump.

 

[Tornicade]

As part of the Haywood deal, they gave up draft picks to dump Miller. That's a classic example of a salary dump.

Is it that black and white?
The addition of Mo Williams and Richardson along with retaining Jr smith, delly and James Jones put Miller on the Block. Miller's unhappiness with his role sort of sealed the deal.

should The Cavs sign Thompson at 17 million that takes the Salary to 105 Million add in JR at less than 5 million
110-85= 25 million luxury Tax amount
at 3.75 for 20 million + .50 for hitting the 25 million threshold.
106.25 Tax. Thats approximately 216 million in Salary.

should the cavs somehow finish below the 25 million over tax lets say 24.9 for 109
Thats a 93.37 Tax
Thats 203 million salary. A savings of 13 Million

Realistically the difference in Tristans starting out this season at 16 million instead of 16.7 cutting out that 700 thousand could save the Cavs 13 million dollars.

the following season the Cavs will likely pay Lebron 26.7 million based on an 89 million cap. that is if Lebron takes 30% instead of 35%
so
Lebron 26.7 Million
Love 21.1
Thompson 17.2
Irving 17.6
Shumpert 9.6
Mo 2.1
JR 5.0

Thats 99.3 Million. with an 89 million cap from 70 million cap. thats a 21.5% increase. The Luxury tax level typically coincides with the cap increase so we will calculate it at 20%.
so approximately 101 Million luxury tax level.

Thats if its 89 which is a conservative projection. it could be more.

so lets say they retain mozgov for about 13 million
and spend about 5 million to round out the roster + 3 million for Delly
thats an estimated 120 million. about 19 million over the tax.
only paid the tax 2 of the previous 4 seasons so no repeater tax. under 20 million so its a 3.25 modifier
tax is an estimated 61.75 Million.
Thats a decrease from 203-216 to 181.75 Million

fast forward to the next season and you have a projected 102 Million cap. Another 23% increase
Ill calculate the tax level to be conservative at 20% again. thats around a 121 million tax level.
Lebron 30 Million
Love 22.6
Irving 18.8
Thompson 18.0
Shumpert 9.3
Estimated Mozgov 13.5
Estimated Delly 3.3
7 players guaranteed Estimated 115.5 cavs will need to stay within 4 million of the luxury tax so about 10 million to fill out the roster or 2 million per slot for a 13 man slot. Cavs can use the apron to stay out the tax for the next three seasons if things stay as they are. or with the new tv deal the tax structure is changed should the player elect to lock out.

Controlling cost and saving money just because you can are two different things.

This would only work if Lebron only takes 30% instead of 35%

 

[Paul]

Is it that black and white?
The addition of Mo Williams and Richardson along with retaining Jr smith, delly and James Jones put Miller on the Block. Miller's unhappiness with his role sort of sealed the deal.

should The Cavs sign Thompson at 17 million that takes the Salary to 105 Million add in JR at less than 5 million
110-85= 25 million luxury Tax amount
at 3.75 for 20 million + .50 for hitting the 25 million threshold.
106.25 Tax. Thats approximately 216 million in Salary.

should the cavs somehow finish below the 25 million over tax lets say 24.9 for 109
Thats a 93.37 Tax
Thats 203 million salary. A savings of 13 Million

Realistically the difference in Tristans starting out this season at 16 million instead of 16.7 cutting out that 700 thousand could save the Cavs 13 million dollars.

the following season the Cavs will likely pay Lebron 26.7 million based on an 89 million cap.
so
Lebron 26.7 Million
Love 21.1
Thompson 17.2
Irving 17.6
Shumpert 9.6
Mo 2.1
JR 5.0

Thats 99.3 Million. with an 89 million cap from 70 million cap. thats a 21.5% increase. The Luxury tax level typically coincides with the cap increase so we will calculate it at 20%.
so approximately 101 Million luxury tax level.

Thats if its 89 which is a conservative projection. it could be more.

so lets say they retain mozgov for about 13 million
and spend about 5 million to round out the roster + 3 million for Delly
thats an estimated 120 million. about 19 million over the tax.
only paid the tax 2 of the previous 4 seasons so no repeater tax. under 20 million so its a 3.25 modifier
tax is an estimated 61.75 Million.
Thats a decrease from 203-216 to 181.75 Million

fast forward to the next season and you have a projected 102 Million cap. Another 23% increase
Ill calculate the tax level to be conservative at 20% again. thats around a 121 million tax level.
Lebron 30 Million
Love 22.6
Irving 18.8
Thompson 18.0
Shumpert 9.3
Estimated Mozgov 13.5
Estimated Delly 3.3
7 players guaranteed Estimated 115.5 cavs will need to stay within 4 million of the luxury tax so about 10 million to fill out the roster or 2 million per slot for a 13 man slot. Cavs can use the apron to stay out the tax for the next three seasons if things stay as they are. or with the new tv deal the tax structure is changed should the player elect to lock out.

Controlling cost and saving money just because you can are two different things.

LeBron's salary for 2016-2017 will be 31.1 million. He will opt out and re sign for the max. You also left out Andy's 10 mil salary in 2016-2017. For comparison here's what I have for 2016-2017

2016-2017 Payroll:


Matthew Dellavedova 1.4 mil
Joe Harris 1.0 mil
Kyrie Irving 17.6 mil
LeBron James 31.1 mil
Kevin Love 21.2 mil
Timofey Mozgov 18.0 mil
Iman Shumpert 9.7 mil
JR Smith 5.0 mil
Tristan Thompson 17.0 mil
Anderson Varejao 10.4 mil
Mo Williams 2.2 mil
affordable player x 2.0 mil
affordable player y 2.0 mil
Sasha Kaun 1.4 mil

Total 140 mil Estimated salary cap 89 mil

 

[dmb]

Realistically moron gets out to Toronto

 

[Tornicade]

LeBron's salary for 2016-2017 will be 31.1 million. He will opt out and re sign for the max.

well the number isnt as definitive as you imply but i did calculate at 30% instead of 35%
2016-17 -89*.35 = 26.7 + 4.3 Million
2017-18-102 * .35 = 35.7 and the Bri usually comes out as a lower number than the cap and the 102 is a projection. so adjusting
thats 24 million over the cap at 3.75 so it comes to 90 million
90+124 million is 214 million so instead of 181 it would be about the same to keep lebron at max.

so theres no way the Cavs can stay under the tax if Lebron is geting 35% every year

 

[Kouki]

So you didn't read my post at all?

I specifically said that I DON'T KNOW what the FO will do.

I specifically said that I DON'T think this has anything to do with his value. Of course he's a role player--no shit.

That's not the problem. The problem is that even though he's a role player, it's a BIG role that he plays. He's always healthy on a team full of injury prone players, and he can play both the PF and the C.

This has NOTHING to do with TT's value. I think EVERY FUCKING PERSON on this board agrees that TT is NOT worth what he's asking.

EVERYONE agrees that he's NOT worth the ANYTHING NEAR the max.

So try thinking and reading before posting the same shit that has already been posted 10,000 times in this thread.

The problem is that outside of an unlikely trade, we can't replace him. He's just good enough that we need him, but just bad enough that he's not worth what he's asking. Add that to an insanely inflating cap, and we have a difficult valuation.

SO STOP PROPOSING OVERLY SIMPLISTIC SOLUTIONS TO A COMPLEX PROBLEM.

first off, drink a beer or something plz

second, you are the one talking about "supply and demand", and Mr. Tendunklar or whatever up there made the very astute, if not tired point that no other team is likely to offer TT a lot of money

so there's not a lot of demand

yes, the cavs need TT more than any other team right now, and sure that gives TT a bit of leverage, because we cannot replace him. we get that.

so what are the options here

1) cave and sign TT to a monster contract

2) let him sign the QO. and at the end of the season...things will probably be the same. the cavs will still need TT more than any other team, because we don't have any other options, but no other team is going to sign him to a monster contract. so we sign him.

you are talking about his value to our team, and we are talking about his value to every other team in the league. both matter just as much as one another. but ignoring the fact that he isn't worth near-max to any other team in the league is silly. that's called..........supply and demand.

i think we are always going to have the option to sign TT. if he goes out and gets an offer from toronto or whoever for stupid money, we can match it if we want to, or even undercut it a bit, because i'm pretty sure TT would prefer to stay in CLE.

 

[Paul]

well the number isnt as definitive as you imply but i did calculate at 30% instead of 35%
2016-17 -89*.35 = 26.7 + 4.3 Million
2017-18-102 * .35 = 35.7 and the Bri usually comes out as a lower number than the cap and the 102 is a projection. so adjusting
thats 24 million over the cap at 3.75 so it comes to 90 million
90+124 million is 214 million so instead of 181 it would be about the same to keep lebron at max.

so theres no way the Cavs can stay under the tax if Lebron is geting 35% every year

shouldnt it be 35% calculation for LeBron since he has 10 plus years in the league?

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q16

 

[Tendulkar]

Is it that black and white?
The addition of Mo Williams and Richardson along with retaining Jr smith, delly and James Jones put Miller on the Block. Miller's unhappiness with his role sort of sealed the deal.

should The Cavs sign Thompson at 17 million that takes the Salary to 105 Million add in JR at less than 5 million
110-85= 25 million luxury Tax amount
at 3.75 for 20 million + .50 for hitting the 25 million threshold.
106.25 Tax. Thats approximately 216 million in Salary.

should the cavs somehow finish below the 25 million over tax lets say 24.9 for 109
Thats a 93.37 Tax
Thats 203 million salary. A savings of 13 Million

Realistically the difference in Tristans starting out this season at 16 million instead of 16.7 cutting out that 700 thousand could save the Cavs 13 million dollars.

the following season the Cavs will likely pay Lebron 26.7 million based on an 89 million cap. that is if Lebron takes 30% instead of 35%
so
Lebron 26.7 Million
Love 21.1
Thompson 17.2
Irving 17.6
Shumpert 9.6
Mo 2.1
JR 5.0

Thats 99.3 Million. with an 89 million cap from 70 million cap. thats a 21.5% increase. The Luxury tax level typically coincides with the cap increase so we will calculate it at 20%.
so approximately 101 Million luxury tax level.

Thats if its 89 which is a conservative projection. it could be more.

so lets say they retain mozgov for about 13 million
and spend about 5 million to round out the roster + 3 million for Delly
thats an estimated 120 million. about 19 million over the tax.
only paid the tax 2 of the previous 4 seasons so no repeater tax. under 20 million so its a 3.25 modifier
tax is an estimated 61.75 Million.
Thats a decrease from 203-216 to 181.75 Million

fast forward to the next season and you have a projected 102 Million cap. Another 23% increase
Ill calculate the tax level to be conservative at 20% again. thats around a 121 million tax level.
Lebron 30 Million
Love 22.6
Irving 18.8
Thompson 18.0
Shumpert 9.3
Estimated Mozgov 13.5
Estimated Delly 3.3
7 players guaranteed Estimated 115.5 cavs will need to stay within 4 million of the luxury tax so about 10 million to fill out the roster or 2 million per slot for a 13 man slot. Cavs can use the apron to stay out the tax for the next three seasons if things stay as they are. or with the new tv deal the tax structure is changed should the player elect to lock out.

Controlling cost and saving money just because you can are two different things.

This would only work if Lebron only takes 30% instead of 35%

Shouldn't Mozgov be getting a max? I can't see how he will settle for less. If he walks, what assets do we have to replace him? Did you forget the supply/demand and all other sh*t?
All he has to do is hire rich Paul and according to current logic and trend, he is automatically eligible for Max right? You know given cavs situation.


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