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2012-2013 Indians Red Hot Offseason Thread (Bourn signed post 1940)
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shoes22
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It all depends on how well he performs in Cinci this year. If he performs similarly to how he did in Cleveland, he should be able to command a pretty big contract. But we all know how much Choo struggles under pressure.
macbdog
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
What pressure? You mean when he got hurt and got a DUI two years ago and was awful? You understand that DUI was a huge issue for him back in South Korea, with politicians there talking about revoking his military exemption (which would have effectively ended his career)? Please.
Choo is going to hit leadoff, in a rinky dink stadium, for a contending team with a middle of the order already in place. All he has to do is Choo things- get on base, hit the ball into the gap, and get picked off for every 3 stolen bases- and he sets himself up for a big payday. One or both of the NY teams will need to spend next offseason and he will end up there. No reason he will have to settle for less than Swisher.
What pressure? You mean when he got hurt and got a DUI two years ago and was awful? You understand that DUI was a huge issue for him back in South Korea, with politicians there talking about revoking his military exemption (which would have effectively ended his career)? Please.
Choo is going to hit leadoff, in a rinky dink stadium, for a contending team with a middle of the order already in place. All he has to do is Choo things- get on base, hit the ball into the gap, and get picked off for every 3 stolen bases- and he sets himself up for a big payday. One or both of the NY teams will need to spend next offseason and he will end up there. No reason he will have to settle for less than Swisher.
Steve_424
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
Lastoria looks at the Indians' payroll
The Indians made a pretty big investment on Sunday when they agreed to terms with free agent outfielder Nick Swisher on a four year $56 million deal that includes a vesting option for $14 million in 2017 if he gets 550 or more plate appearances in 2016 and passes an end of season physical. His deal should become soon once he is able to take a physical, possibly later this week.
The Indians also officially signed first baseman Mark Reynolds to a one year $6 million deal last week. They have also agreed to terms on a minor league deal with left-handed pitcher Scott Kazmir that will probably include a lot of incentives if he makes a Major League roster this season. Terms of Kazmir’s deal are unknown at this point, but since he is a minor league signing he should not have any effect on the Indians’ payroll situation at the moment.
The Indians also completed two big trades a few weeks earlier where they sent away Major League salaries from the likes of Shin-Soo Choo, Tony Sipp, and Esmil Rogers and received in return Major League salaries from players like Drew Stubbs, Mike Aviles, Trevor Bauer, and Mitch Albers.
So where, after all that, where does the Indians payroll situation currently stand?
As the Indians move forward in their pursuit to sign a veteran starting pitcher – their number one focus at the moment – they still have some room to make another signing or two. The updated payroll chart on the site shows the payroll at about $67.7 million, which includes the projections for the seven arbitration eligible players on the Indians roster and other amounts which affect payroll.
It should be noted that this payroll amount includes the known or projected salaries of 12 players expected to be on the opening day 25-man roster. The other 13 spots at the moment will be taken up by players like Vinnie Pestano, Michael Brantley, etc that all will make around the Major League minimum next season (about $500K), so if you add in an additional $500K for the other 13 spots, that is an additional $6.5 million of unaccounted for payroll. Also the Indians sent $3.5 million to the Reds to complete the Choo trade and the Indians paid Hafner a buyout close to $3 million when they did not pick up his option. So this is how the payroll number at the moment gets to the $67.7 million amount.
Going into the offseason the Indians said they would spend about the same on payroll as they did in 2012. If that is the case, well, they are pretty close to what they spend last year. But some things have changed this offseason with the impending sale of SportsTime Ohio to News Corp (Fox Sports) which should give them some extra money to play with. They also may have intended to spend a little more all along, around $75 million, so there could be some room to play with in their payroll.
Of course, the Indians could still trade the likes of Chris Perez or Asdrubal Cabrera to help free up some salary on their payroll. Cabrera looks more and more like he will remain with the team, but Perez could become someone that teams are more aggressive in pursuing this offseason now that the backend relief market is starting to shake out after the Joel Hanrahan trade earlier this week.
The Indians still want that veteran starter, which is going to cost them anywhere from $5 to $12 million or more in free agency on their 2013 payroll. It does not look like they have the room, but then again, they were prepared to sign both Swisher and Edwin Jackson last week, so they obviously either have the room in the budget or they have something else planned to help offset the cost.
In addition a veteran starter, the Indians also need a veteran lefty for their bullpen and may still be looking to add one more bat to add depth to the lineup and help fill the designated hitter role. Those are still secondary needs at this point and could just be filled internally.
Lastoria looks at the Indians' payroll
The Indians made a pretty big investment on Sunday when they agreed to terms with free agent outfielder Nick Swisher on a four year $56 million deal that includes a vesting option for $14 million in 2017 if he gets 550 or more plate appearances in 2016 and passes an end of season physical. His deal should become soon once he is able to take a physical, possibly later this week.
The Indians also officially signed first baseman Mark Reynolds to a one year $6 million deal last week. They have also agreed to terms on a minor league deal with left-handed pitcher Scott Kazmir that will probably include a lot of incentives if he makes a Major League roster this season. Terms of Kazmir’s deal are unknown at this point, but since he is a minor league signing he should not have any effect on the Indians’ payroll situation at the moment.
The Indians also completed two big trades a few weeks earlier where they sent away Major League salaries from the likes of Shin-Soo Choo, Tony Sipp, and Esmil Rogers and received in return Major League salaries from players like Drew Stubbs, Mike Aviles, Trevor Bauer, and Mitch Albers.
So where, after all that, where does the Indians payroll situation currently stand?
As the Indians move forward in their pursuit to sign a veteran starting pitcher – their number one focus at the moment – they still have some room to make another signing or two. The updated payroll chart on the site shows the payroll at about $67.7 million, which includes the projections for the seven arbitration eligible players on the Indians roster and other amounts which affect payroll.
It should be noted that this payroll amount includes the known or projected salaries of 12 players expected to be on the opening day 25-man roster. The other 13 spots at the moment will be taken up by players like Vinnie Pestano, Michael Brantley, etc that all will make around the Major League minimum next season (about $500K), so if you add in an additional $500K for the other 13 spots, that is an additional $6.5 million of unaccounted for payroll. Also the Indians sent $3.5 million to the Reds to complete the Choo trade and the Indians paid Hafner a buyout close to $3 million when they did not pick up his option. So this is how the payroll number at the moment gets to the $67.7 million amount.
Going into the offseason the Indians said they would spend about the same on payroll as they did in 2012. If that is the case, well, they are pretty close to what they spend last year. But some things have changed this offseason with the impending sale of SportsTime Ohio to News Corp (Fox Sports) which should give them some extra money to play with. They also may have intended to spend a little more all along, around $75 million, so there could be some room to play with in their payroll.
Of course, the Indians could still trade the likes of Chris Perez or Asdrubal Cabrera to help free up some salary on their payroll. Cabrera looks more and more like he will remain with the team, but Perez could become someone that teams are more aggressive in pursuing this offseason now that the backend relief market is starting to shake out after the Joel Hanrahan trade earlier this week.
The Indians still want that veteran starter, which is going to cost them anywhere from $5 to $12 million or more in free agency on their 2013 payroll. It does not look like they have the room, but then again, they were prepared to sign both Swisher and Edwin Jackson last week, so they obviously either have the room in the budget or they have something else planned to help offset the cost.
In addition a veteran starter, the Indians also need a veteran lefty for their bullpen and may still be looking to add one more bat to add depth to the lineup and help fill the designated hitter role. Those are still secondary needs at this point and could just be filled internally.
Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
I'd like to see the Indians make a run at Joe Saunders. He offers something we don't have in a left handed starter and he pitched pretty well in the playoffs last year.
Masterson
Bauer
Jimenez
Saunders
Carrasco
McAllister
Gomez
Kluber
Kazmir
That rotation certainly has "potential" to be pretty solid. If not, we have some solid depth in McAllister and Gomez.
Daisuke is one to watch. I'm not sure what kind of relationship Francona had with him but he would come cheap and maybe he can rebound a bit this year. Wouldn't shock me if we signed him.
I'd like to see the Indians make a run at Joe Saunders. He offers something we don't have in a left handed starter and he pitched pretty well in the playoffs last year.
Masterson
Bauer
Jimenez
Saunders
Carrasco
McAllister
Gomez
Kluber
Kazmir
That rotation certainly has "potential" to be pretty solid. If not, we have some solid depth in McAllister and Gomez.
Daisuke is one to watch. I'm not sure what kind of relationship Francona had with him but he would come cheap and maybe he can rebound a bit this year. Wouldn't shock me if we signed him.
Steve_424
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
The Indians could also do a sign-and-trade according to Olney:
Olney says teams have already internally discussed a modified sign-and-trade scenario, and he uses the Indians as an example. Since Cleveland has a protected first round pick and forfeited their second rounder to sign Nick Swisher, the next compensation free agent they sign will cause them to lose just a third rounder. They could sign a compensation free agent, then trade that player to another club in a pre-arranged deal, preumably for something deemed a bit more valuable than a third round pick.
The Indians could also do a sign-and-trade according to Olney:
Olney says teams have already internally discussed a modified sign-and-trade scenario, and he uses the Indians as an example. Since Cleveland has a protected first round pick and forfeited their second rounder to sign Nick Swisher, the next compensation free agent they sign will cause them to lose just a third rounder. They could sign a compensation free agent, then trade that player to another club in a pre-arranged deal, preumably for something deemed a bit more valuable than a third round pick.
Steve_424
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
Saunders has been linked to the Tribe, so it's a definite possibility. Matsuzaka would be an interesting option to keep in mind.
A few other names I think we could see mentioned:
- Shawn Marcum
- Kyle Lohse
- Dallas Braden
- Jair Jurrjens
- Brett Myers
- J.P. Howell
- Mike Gonzalez
- Carlos Lee
- Lance Berkman
- Delmon Young
- Jim Thome
- Travis Hafner
- Grady Sizemore (I still think he signs a minor league deal here)
Saunders has been linked to the Tribe, so it's a definite possibility. Matsuzaka would be an interesting option to keep in mind.
A few other names I think we could see mentioned:
- Shawn Marcum
- Kyle Lohse
- Dallas Braden
- Jair Jurrjens
- Brett Myers
- J.P. Howell
- Mike Gonzalez
- Carlos Lee
- Lance Berkman
- Delmon Young
- Jim Thome
- Travis Hafner
- Grady Sizemore (I still think he signs a minor league deal here)
AZ_
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
They're going to acquire a starting pitcher, I think it's inevitable.
I also think they sign a bat to a low level deal, Lance Berkman would be great but it seems as though he'll either sign with Houston or retire.
Brett Myers wants to start again, and Cleveland could offer him that opportunity.
Sign one of Joe Saunders, Brett Myers, Shaun Marcum...then add a hitter such as Thome or Hafner on a $1-2 million dollar deal. Should put them right around $75 million.
They're going to acquire a starting pitcher, I think it's inevitable.
I also think they sign a bat to a low level deal, Lance Berkman would be great but it seems as though he'll either sign with Houston or retire.
Brett Myers wants to start again, and Cleveland could offer him that opportunity.
Sign one of Joe Saunders, Brett Myers, Shaun Marcum...then add a hitter such as Thome or Hafner on a $1-2 million dollar deal. Should put them right around $75 million.
Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
I think our lineup is essentially complete. The Indians might snag a vet guy ala a Damon type to fill in at DH and play in the field once in awhile. But I think the Indians are fairly comfortable with what they have.
LF Brantley- I think he ends up in left. Brantley will likely man center on days that Stubbs rests.
CF Stubbs- I think a change of scenery will help him a bit.
RF Swisher- Excited to have him. Won't put up monster numbers but will be a solid gamer with power.
3B Chisenhall- Big year for him. Can he emerge as a top young player and stay healthy?
SS Cabrera- Could still be traded but I think he returns.
2B Kipnis- I think he becomes a more consistent player this year.
1B Reynolds- Sort of surprised we only signed him for one year. Will provide much needed pop from the right side.
C Santana- Is it too early to designate a player as being the key to the season? If Santana puts it together he could make this team a playoff contender by himself.
Bench/DH
Aviles- Solid bench player. Right now the leading contender to serve as DH most games.
Carrera-His speed will find him a place on the team I think. Fedroff will battle him for the 4th OF spot. Neal might make a play as well.
McGuiness- I think the Indians will give him more room for error than most considering he must be on the 25 man roster if we are to keep him. Now if he looks terrible, we will cut him loose. But he might be a decent bat at 1B, DH, and LF. A left handed Shelley Duncan?
Gomes- I think he beats out Marson for backup catcher duties.
Diaz? I'm not sure at this point. Perhaps some non-roster invitee shines in spring training. Maybe we sign a more full time DH type like Hafner. We could use more infield depth up the middle.
Opening day lineup projection:
Interestingly, it looks like we will be facing R.A. Dickey. Tough way to start facing a knuckleballer.
Brantley LF
Swisher RF
Cabrera SS
Santana C
Reynolds 1B
Kipnis 2B
Stubbs CF
Chisenhall 3B
Aviles DH
I think our lineup is essentially complete. The Indians might snag a vet guy ala a Damon type to fill in at DH and play in the field once in awhile. But I think the Indians are fairly comfortable with what they have.
LF Brantley- I think he ends up in left. Brantley will likely man center on days that Stubbs rests.
CF Stubbs- I think a change of scenery will help him a bit.
RF Swisher- Excited to have him. Won't put up monster numbers but will be a solid gamer with power.
3B Chisenhall- Big year for him. Can he emerge as a top young player and stay healthy?
SS Cabrera- Could still be traded but I think he returns.
2B Kipnis- I think he becomes a more consistent player this year.
1B Reynolds- Sort of surprised we only signed him for one year. Will provide much needed pop from the right side.
C Santana- Is it too early to designate a player as being the key to the season? If Santana puts it together he could make this team a playoff contender by himself.
Bench/DH
Aviles- Solid bench player. Right now the leading contender to serve as DH most games.
Carrera-His speed will find him a place on the team I think. Fedroff will battle him for the 4th OF spot. Neal might make a play as well.
McGuiness- I think the Indians will give him more room for error than most considering he must be on the 25 man roster if we are to keep him. Now if he looks terrible, we will cut him loose. But he might be a decent bat at 1B, DH, and LF. A left handed Shelley Duncan?
Gomes- I think he beats out Marson for backup catcher duties.
Diaz? I'm not sure at this point. Perhaps some non-roster invitee shines in spring training. Maybe we sign a more full time DH type like Hafner. We could use more infield depth up the middle.
Opening day lineup projection:
Interestingly, it looks like we will be facing R.A. Dickey. Tough way to start facing a knuckleballer.
Brantley LF
Swisher RF
Cabrera SS
Santana C
Reynolds 1B
Kipnis 2B
Stubbs CF
Chisenhall 3B
Aviles DH
AZ_
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
Would really be disappointed to see McGuinness or Diaz make this roster, I think the odds are really stacked against them and neither of them appear to be big league talents.
Would really be disappointed to see McGuinness or Diaz make this roster, I think the odds are really stacked against them and neither of them appear to be big league talents.
Huber.
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
Out of Aviles, McGuiness, Neal, Gomes, Fedroff and McDade who would you rather have at DH or in the field when another player gets DH day off? After what Fedroff did in the minors the last two years I would like to see what he has before they cut ties with him. All these guys seem like lifetime 25+ minor league players though.
Out of Aviles, McGuiness, Neal, Gomes, Fedroff and McDade who would you rather have at DH or in the field when another player gets DH day off? After what Fedroff did in the minors the last two years I would like to see what he has before they cut ties with him. All these guys seem like lifetime 25+ minor league players though.
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AZ_
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
Santana
Aviles
Cabrera
Chisenhall
Reynolds
Kipnis
Brantley
Stubbs
Swisher
Marson/Gomes
One free agent hitter (Thome, Hafner, ect)
That leaves two spots:
Carrera can play all three outfield spots, has speed off the bench, plays great defense and is out of minor league options. Put him in the guarantee category IMO.
Gomes, McGuinnes, McDade would be in the running. I'm trying to convince myself that they'll keep one of these guys on the opening day roster, but I'm just not ready to admit that yet. Maybe they'll bring in someone else.
Santana
Aviles
Cabrera
Chisenhall
Reynolds
Kipnis
Brantley
Stubbs
Swisher
Marson/Gomes
One free agent hitter (Thome, Hafner, ect)
That leaves two spots:
Carrera can play all three outfield spots, has speed off the bench, plays great defense and is out of minor league options. Put him in the guarantee category IMO.
Gomes, McGuinnes, McDade would be in the running. I'm trying to convince myself that they'll keep one of these guys on the opening day roster, but I'm just not ready to admit that yet. Maybe they'll bring in someone else.
RealKingofCleve
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AZ_
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Re: 2012-2013 Indians Offseason Thread (Mark Reynolds signed, Francona hired)
Ill spend the 1-2 to spare us Mike Aviles as what basically amounts to the DH.
Ill spend the 1-2 to spare us Mike Aviles as what basically amounts to the DH.