Game 2 | Cavaliers vs Raptors | October 28, 2009 | 7:00 PM EST

[glockcoma]

I think the absence of Delonte and Ben Wallace being gone proves just how much the intangibles mean to the game of basketball. Our team defense has gone from superior to one without an identity really. I was hoping Shaq's offense would nullify the loss of Big Ben on the defensive end but right now that doesn't seem to be the case.

That being said it's only 2 games. Hopefully Mike Brown & his staff gets these wrinkles ironed out.

 

[TAS]

Don't want to interrupt the witch hunt or try and rationalize with the negative nancies, but I just got home from work a while ago (before server crashed) and want to know what happened. I was updating every two seconds on my phone at work so I saw we crawled back from 21 down to tie it, but then let it all slide away.

What's the biggest issue? Poor rotations? Flat out inability to stop their runs? Lack of defensive intensity?

I'm obviously a little upset, but no need to write us off as a championship contender after two games. That is ridiculous. The 2005-06 Miami Heat (a team with, you guessed it, Shaquille O'Neal) went 2-3 in their first five games before winning an NBA championship much later that season. To be honest, with the obstacle of reworking Delonte West into the rotation ahead of us, I expect it to get worse before it gets better. Right now we have so many players adjusting to new roles. Parker and Shaq ripped from their teams and transplanted as starters on a new team this season. Anderson Varejao, despite starting the second half of last season, entering his first season as the starter out of training camp. Jamario Moon on a new team in a guaranteed reserve role (he was able to compete for the job and start in both Toronto and Miami). And the biggest move, Zydrunas Ilgauskas to the bench for the first time since 2002.

In fact, outside of LeBron, our biggest contributor that doesn't have to adjust is Mo Williams, who is only entering only his second season as a Cavalier (Daniel Gibson's role is seemingly redefined every year ). So it's going to be sloppy--understandably so. But to write off the team after two games and immediately call for the coach's head, Shaquille O'Neal to be traded, and to chastise our front office is downright dumb. Give it time, let these guys get worked into the system, let's see how we look with our heart (West) back in the rotation, and then criticize. But damn, 2 games?

- LeBron's conditioning isn't where he would want it to be. I am also not happy with the amount of ball handling he is doing. But again, his conditioning isn't ideal and playing 80 out of a possible 96 minutes on back-back nights does not help. BAD management by the coaching staff. He looked exhausted and drained in the 4th quarter. His layups were off, kept losing control of the ball during moves etc..
- Too much dribbling by players
- Taking low percentage shots
- Missing wide open jumpers
- Team Chemistry is still not there. LeBron was more comfortable when they went to a smaller lineup with Andy playing the 5 & LeBron at the 4.
- Mike Brown is trying to experiment a line up with Shaq & Z on at the same time.
- Mo Williams has been awful
- J.J continutes to pick up stupid fouls.
- Raptors point guard exploited Shaq on the pick & roll. I counted 10+ baskets where they picked on Shaq and it resulted in either a direct basket or a rotation basket.
- LeBron misses Delonte. LeBron likes to kick out after driving middle but Parker keeps moving.
- Bad / Lazy passes by the players. Especially on P&R with Z. He wasn't able to catch & shoot because the passes were thrown to his ankle.

 

[johnnycake44022]

To me there are a lot of fixable things (defensive effort), however the glaring exception is that we are not turning back the clock on Shaq and Z. These two really seemed to have lost a few steps this year and teams are going to continue to exploit that both by running and utilizing the pick and roll. I don't know how you fix that.

 

[The Common Man]

[Deleted]

 

[Rimage]

You know what pissed me off the most tonight? Trying to get on here, not being able to the whole game, and then finding out the reason was because of bunch you spazs were throwing huge overblown fits...this team is trying to find an identity and all I see is trade Z and fire brown....stupid.

 

[TAS]

Oh yeah & if forgot to add something.

The team still cannot score unless LeBron is creating for them. :thumbdown

 

[The Common Man]

[Deleted]

 

[Kongo Time]

I think that it is funny that some people said that we should play Z and Shaq at the same time and everyone made fun of them only to have mike brown play them together. Both game we were getting killed by the other teams shooting big and mike brown tries to counter that with putting two slow centers on the court. I think that not only should we NEVER play these two together, there should be times in the game we don't play either. Last year what made us good was when we could come out with Andy and LBJ as our bigs and just out run teams. I think we need to look at that at some parts of the game. Also i think that LBJ or Moon need to play more mins at the four with who ever is at center. Not only will we open up the paint for the guys to score inside (LBJ, Shaq) we also will be much faster on D which should help out on our rotation. If Delonte returns it will make this team so much better then people think just because of his D and it will give us two guys who can play the 3 while LeBron is at 4.

 

[dekethecreep]

I think that it is funny that some people said that we should play Z and Shaq at the same time and everyone made fun of them only to have mike brown play them together. Both game we were getting killed by the other teams shooting big and mike brown tries to counter that with putting two slow centers on the court. I think that not only should we NEVER play these two together there should be times in the game we don't play either. Last year what made us good was when we could come out with Andy and LBJ as our bigs and just out run teams. I think we need to look at that at some parts of the game. Also i think that LBJ or Moon need to play more mins at the four with who ever is at center. Not only will we open up the paint for the guys to score inside (LBJ, Shaq) we also will be much faster on D which should help out on our rotation. If Delonte returns it will make this team so much better then people think just because of his D and it will give us two guys who can play the 3 while LeBron is at 4.

Bwahahaha Love the avatar dude hahaha!!

 

[craig]

The only answer is to trade Z for Jack. Then start shaq at 5, moon at 4, lebron at 3 ,jack at 2, and mo at 1. 4 perimeter players and a big.That's the only way we can play.Then if you do come across a team with a 4 that moon and lebron can't check, then and only then do you play andy and shaq.But we have to go Orlando style, a center and 4 perimeter players.

 

[the critic]

Remember what Shaq said: "WIN NOTHING FOR THE KING!!!"

 

[Zog]

The only answer is to trade Z for Jack. Then start shaq at 5, moon at 4, lebron at 3 ,jack at 2, and mo at 1. 4 perimeter players and a big.That's the only way we can play.Then if you do come across a team with a 4 that moon and lebron can't check, then and only then do you play andy and shaq.But we have to go Orlando style, a center and 4 perimeter players.

I'm not sure that I agree that "then and only then" do you play Shaq and Andy, but I think we should go small more often.

If Powe can knock down a 15 foot jumper consistently when he comes back, we should start him. AV and Shaq simply do not work well together.

I'm also not so sure that we still don't need a PF more than we need another wing. Moon and Parker should be enough, assuming we also get Delonte back.

 

[Redz West is Best]

If you're counting on Delonte to turn this team around, don't get your hopes up, i can't imagine him re-joining us anytime soon, if at all. Too many mistakes into short of time, and I'd rather have a team that doesn't depend on somebody as undependable as him.

This is the first time he has missed games due to anything besides physical injury. What are you talking about?

Delonte will fix alot of things if he is a starting and Parker is coming off the bench. And then when Lebron is not in the game we can have the Mo/Delonte/Parker combinations at the guard spots or all three in the game 1 time.

 

[Green Lantern]

Check out the Spurs game if you want to see what an excellent coach can do with a bunch of new pieces. I'm sick and tired of Mike Brown.

It looks like MB is going with his experiment routine early..the big lineup with Shaq/Z does not work..it simply does not..the quicker lineup did..the Cavs were still settling for J's..instead of working the ball and taking better shots..

 

[DougHeil]

You know what pissed me off the most tonight? Trying to get on here, not being able to the whole game, and then finding out the reason was because of bunch you spazs were throughing huge overblown fits...this team is trying to find an identity and all I see is trade Z and fire brown....stupid.

My thoughts exactly. I could not access this place after half time. Either it timed out, or it opened and said "server too busy, try back later". Not acceptable. We need either more server space or more ram or both. But yes indeed; I've only read some of this thread so far but it looks like many are all "doom and gloom" after two games. I'm not. We NEED Delonte. We also don't need to play Shaq and Z together unless the other team has two slow bigs on the floor. That's one thing I do agree with.