2017 Browns Off Season Thread

Soda said:

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Right, the Redskins offered a great deal: Elite 22 year old CB (owed ~$1.4m over the next 2 years) and the #78 pick in the draft

What do people expect the Browns could've offered to trump that? The only player on the roster the Redskins would value over Fuller would probably be Garrett. Obviously he's off the table, as are #1 and #4. I doubt 33 and 35 would've been enough with that Redskins offer on the table.

natedagg said:

I don't disagree. From Smith's prospective though, a year wasted in Cleveland does nothing. From our perspective, Dorsey didn't want him in KC, why would he want to extend him now? From Washington's perspective, they decided to move on from Cousins (or Cousins decided he wasn't going to sign there long-term). Washington paid quite a bit, but they were looking goodlast year before a TON of injuries including to what's-his-name DT from Alabama who looked really good (game 3 or 5?), and their offensive line.

We don't know who else was bidding for Smith, but initially it looks like Washington gave up a bit too much. This is a team in the same division as the Eagles and the Zeke-drama-free Cowboys. However, they are getting a good QB and for a long time. The pundits will talk but it feels a bit like everyone won.

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Right, I just wanted to clarify that I don't think Alex Smith really had much say in the matter given his contract status. He was under contract next year and had previously been traded for by Dorsey--I think things would've been fine had we brought him on. I don't think his willingness to sign an extension with us or not was a factor we cared about anyway.

It's CLEVELAND who looked at him as more of a bridge until the #1 pick is ready, thus only offering what we offered. Not HIM deciding he didn't want Cleveland, and thus not ponying up said assets.

Just wanted to clarify. He's in Washington because they view him as their long-term franchise quarterback. They backed that up with the money they paid him. Thus, they were willing to give up "franchise quarterback" assets for him.

I think they made a very poor move, personally.

Urban said:

Right, the Redskins offered a great deal: Elite 22 year old CB (owed ~$1.4m over the next 2 years) and the #78 pick in the draft

What do people expect the Browns could've offered to trump that? The only player on the roster the Redskins would value over Fuller would probably be Garrett. Obviously he's off the table, as are #1 and #4. I doubt 33 and 35 would've been enough with that Redskins offer on the table.

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I also think giving up 33 or 35 for Alex Smith would've been a horrible move for Cleveland.

He's old enough that you still would want to take a franchise QB at #1. Hell, Dorsey JUST did the same thing with Alex Smith last year (when he was yet another year younger) by trading two firsts and a third to move for Mahomes.

You don't spend #35 on Smith and then #1 on a QB. That's too rich given the other holes on our roster. The only thing that would keep us from taking a QB at #1 is likely the event that we sign Kirk Cousins. That's it.

I'm just shocked the 'Skins gave Smith the same contract they probably could've kept Cousins for--who is 5 years younger and is probably better.

I really wonder what the plan is. I just don't see Cousins wanting to come here no matter what we pay him, unless a ton of it is guaranteed. I dont' see how we pass up on one of the QB's at #1 or #4, so maybe we would give a ton of money, but why would Cousin take it. With his age, I am sure he is going to want a long term deal and would want to be the man, not a bridge guy. I say Smith as the perfect bridge guy, but no way you give up what they did, and give that contract.

Smith wasn’t the right fit for multiple reasons.

Personally, I didn’t want to give up a 2nd round pick for a guy with one year left on his deal who would likely walk at the end of the season.

On the flip side...

I also didn’t want to give 70M guaranteed to a guy so he could block the kid we draft No. 1 overall.

It just wasn’t the right fit. No knock on Smith the player, just the situation wasn’t really suitable.

CBBI said:

Smith wasn’t the right fit for multiple reasons.

Personally, I didn’t want to give up a 2nd round pick for a guy with one year left on his deal who would likely walk at the end of the season.

On the flip side...

I also didn’t want to give 70M guaranteed to a guy so he could block the kid we draft No. 1 overall.

It just wasn’t the right fit. No knock on Smith the player, just the situation wasn’t really suitable.

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This times a million. I liked the option when I thought he might be cheap, but Dan Snyder strikes again with a stupid trade.

What free agent QB's are left and who needs a QB? There seems to be allot of extra bridge QB's this year in players like Keenum, Tyrod, etc. I think we will be acceptable at QB as long as Dorsey doesnt get cute and picks either Rosen or Donald. (hopefully Rosen, my concussion concerns are becoming less as i see the film)

I won’t really hit Dorsey hard for missing on Smith but the people calling him old, as a justification for not overpaying for him, are Dorsey aplogists in this instance IMO.

We’re operating in a league where two of the best QB’s, today, are 40 and 39. Saying Smith is 34, so we shouldn’t be overpaying for him, for a franchise that hasn’t won shit and been a disaster at the position forever is laughable.

Our answer to why we didn’t acquire him for damn sure should not be “he was 34”. If it is, then this regimen isn’t going to be any better than any of the others in the graveyard.

There are valid reasons for not acquiring him. His age, given the longevity we have seen at the position, is not one of them.

I'mWithDan said:

I won’t really hit Dorsey hard for missing on Smith but the people calling him old, as a justification for not overpaying for him, are Dorsey aplogists in this instance IMO.

We’re operating in a league where two of the best QB’s, today, are 40 and 39. Saying Smith is 34, so we shouldn’t be overpaying for him, for a franchise that hasn’t won shit and been a disaster at the position forever is laughable.

Our answer to why we didn’t acquire him for damn sure should not be “he was 34”. If it is, then this regimen isn’t going to be any better than any of the others in the graveyard.

There are valid reasons for not acquiring him. His age, given the longevity we have seen at the position, is not one of them.

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The reason you dont go all in on Smith is you dont get the extension he gave Washington so you are paying an early 2nd in a deep draft for 1 year of qb play, or 3 years of qb play with 2 franchise tags and you are back to square one like washington.

We are probably best just taking who is left in the QB shuffle and drafting Rosen/Donald

I'mWithDan said:

I won’t really hit Dorsey hard for missing on Smith but the people calling him old, as a justification for not overpaying for him, are Dorsey aplogists in this instance IMO.

We’re operating in a league where two of the best QB’s, today, are 40 and 39. Saying Smith is 34, so we shouldn’t be overpaying for him, for a franchise that hasn’t won shit and been a disaster at the position forever is laughable.

Our answer to why we didn’t acquire him for damn sure should not be “he was 34”. If it is, then this regimen isn’t going to be any better than any of the others in the graveyard.

There are valid reasons for not acquiring him. His age, given the longevity we have seen at the position, is not one of them.

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Really?

Because we're young as fuck. No reason we should be over-paying a 34 year old QB when the rest of the roster won't be ready to compete until he's 37.

I'mWithDan said:

I won’t really hit Dorsey hard for missing on Smith but the people calling him old, as a justification for not overpaying for him, are Dorsey aplogists in this instance IMO.

We’re operating in a league where two of the best QB’s, today, are 40 and 39. Saying Smith is 34, so we shouldn’t be overpaying for him, for a franchise that hasn’t won shit and been a disaster at the position forever is laughable.

Our answer to why we didn’t acquire him for damn sure should not be “he was 34”. If it is, then this regimen isn’t going to be any better than any of the others in the graveyard.

There are valid reasons for not acquiring him. His age, given the longevity we have seen at the position, is not one of them.

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Age is always a consideration. What world are you living in? Brady & Brees are the exception, not the rule.

Now, is that the only reason to not give up more than the Redskins did for him? Hell no. There are plenty of those to go around. But age always plays a part.

RG said:

Age is always a consideration. What world are you living in? Brady & Brees are the exception, not the rule.

Now, is that the only reason to not give up more than the Redskins did for him? Hell no. There are plenty of those to go around. But age always plays a part.

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The best QBs are 39 and 40. But Brees and Brady were also 2 of the best QBs when they 29 and 30. Smith has had a very uneven career even in his prime. Projecting him to age like Brees/Brady seems off.

Thinking a Rodgers or Luck ages well would be a better comparison.

RG said:

Age is always a consideration. What world are you living in? Brady & Brees are the exception, not the rule.

Now, is that the only reason to not give up more than the Redskins did for him? Hell no. There are plenty of those to go around. But age always plays a part.

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It amuses me how Brady and Brees are playing at a level, at age 39 and 40, that we haven't really seen at that age before and now people are trying to pass it off like it's the norm.

col63onel said:

The best QBs are 39 and 40. But Brees and Brady were also 2 of the best QBs when they 29 and 30. Smith has had a very uneven career even in his prime. Projecting him to age like Brees/Brady seems off.

Thinking a Rodgers or Luck ages well would be a better comparison.

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Alex Smith is in the top 25 All Time for career QB rating. He’s one of the most underrated QB’s of the last 10 years.

His past 7 seasons have all been 90+ ratings with absolutely elite TO% numbers. 5 of the last 6 he’s competed at least 65% of his passes.

What about his last 7 years indicates he can’t be a guy who can succeed late in to his career? Is he Aaron Rodgers? No....is he a QB you can win games with and flip apiss poor culture? Absolutely.

If we’re taking Rosen, then fine, I get it but the other guys are all multiyear projects. It would have been perfectly fine to sign Smith for what Washington did and then slowly develop a #1 QB behind him.

Would you have been overpaying a bit for a starter? Sure but that would be offset by developmental gains (both in studying under an accomplished player and far less pressure to rush a high draft pick).

Again, you can decide not to do things for many reasons but if the Browns intend to draft Allen, Darnold or Jackson, Smith would have been a great complient, even if he’s being overpaid. If we are drafting Rosen, then no, you don’t want a roadblock to his playing time.

Chris said:

It amuses me how Brady and Brees are playing at a level, at age 39 and 40, that we haven't really seen at that age before and now people are trying to pass it off like it's the norm.

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Brady - 40
Brees - 39
Rivers - 36
Big Ben - 36 (In March)

It is becoming more and more common. Plenty of other recent examples of other guys who played at a high level in to their late 30's (including late bloomers).

Smith won't turn 34 until May.....are you saying he doesn't have 3 seasons left? Where he would turn 37 at the end of that 3rd year?

I'm not even arguing the Browns should have absolutely acquired him....but on a front loaded contract with a 4th year that is easy to eject from? Absolutely.

You pay a premium in free agency or on an acquire / extend. The franchise tag for QB's is going to be north of $21 million per year in guaranteed money. If you think he has 3 good years left 60-70 mil guaranteed with a cliff at 4 seems like the market rate for a veteran QB who has been as good as Smith has been.