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Cleveland Guardians Offseason Discussion 2021-22

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CATS44 said:
Glad to discuss...

1) TMac is already in the rotation.

2) Zimmer isn't a starting OF on this team.

3) Our FO isn't stupid enough to trade Plesac for either Adell or Haniger.

4) The above kinda shatters the theoretical.

Morgan isn't in the same stratum as Plesac....a giant step backward. So to trade Plesac we would need an immediate giant step forward offensively...not yet another load of maybe prospects.
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If Morgan sincerely gets something like the slider to be a plus pitch... with I believe he added a cutter, which moves differently than his fastball and a random curveball added in here and there, I think he could become better than Tomlin, which puts him better than a BOR but not exactly a MOR. I think he could be one scary guy with that pitch if he can get it to be a plus pitch. If not, he is likely the best spot starter/swingman in baseball...
 
Obscured By Clouds said:
The vast majority of prospects, regardless of their prospect ranking, need time to adjust to the majors, and have multiple call ups and send downs. He only turns 23 in a few days here.
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I'm not an Adell fan, but there was a moment where uber prospect Bryan Buxton looked like a complete bust. Though injuries are zapping him, when he is on...
 
Tondo said:
Zimmer not in the lineup - good
Kwan in the lineup - good
Gimenez at SS - good
Chang starting at 2B vs RHP - bad

3 out of 4 ain't terrible, I guess, but I hope Kwan hits over Chang in the lineup at least.

Prediction:
Shaw
Rosario
Ramirez
Reyes
Bradley
Kwan
Chang
Hedges
Gimenez
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Who would you rather than Chang?
 
Criznit said:
I'm not an Adell fan, but there was a moment where uber prospect Bryan Buxton looked like a complete bust. Though injuries are zapping him, when he is on...
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He is a good example of a top prospect that took like 4 seasons to finally start living up to the ranking.

At the same time, Twins invested a lot of money into someone that has only played over 100 games 1 time in 7 years, despite his talent, I'd not of done that. Some players are just too injury prone to invest that kind of years and money into.
 
Is there something about Zach Plesac Im missing here? 27 year old with two mediocre/bad seasons sandwiching a short good season primarily against weak competition, and he’s not a bat misser (by today’s standards). Why is he regarded so highly in this forum?
 
Bailivia said:
Is there something about Zach Plesac Im missing here? 27 year old with two mediocre/bad seasons sandwiching a short good season primarily against weak competition, and he’s not a bat misser (by today’s standards). Why is he regarded so highly in this forum?
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Per an insider here, the covid protocol break with Clevenger put him in the dog house. As in, when it comes time to a move a starter, he'd be the first on the pecking order.

I'm guessing with this info, people are now using that as trade proposals.

I'm pretty sure he would be the first due to said insiders track record, but not any time soon.
 
Bailivia said:
Is there something about Zach Plesac Im missing here? 27 year old with two mediocre/bad seasons sandwiching a short good season primarily against weak competition, and he’s not a bat misser (by today’s standards). Why is he regarded so highly in this forum?
Click to expand...

Plesac is a mix, he has a ton of moxie and attitude when he is on the mound. His uncle played in the pros as a pitcher so he has some of that going for him as well. He will always do better than his FIP in my mind and he could win a gold glove as well at his position... He also has been in the doghouse a few times, so he has hurt himself cause of that. I think he will be legit big leaguer, he has everything talent wise as long as he doesn't mess his career up...
 
Plesac is entertaining as Hell due to his unreal athleticism.
He may, however, be a douchebag.

This is not really a problem for me.
 
sportscoach said:
Plesac is a mix, he has a ton of moxie and attitude when he is on the mound. His uncle played in the pros as a pitcher so he has some of that going for him as well. He will always do better than his FIP in my mind and he could win a gold glove as well at his position... He also has been in the doghouse a few times, so he has hurt himself cause of that. I think he will be legit big leaguer, he has everything talent wise as long as he doesn't mess his career up...
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He already is a legit big leaguer and I doubt his attitude/disposition is an issue or he would already be gone. You won't find a better athlete on the mound and I agree that he will always outpitch his FIP which I have little faith in anyway. I also think that while he may be a bit ornery his work ethic outweighs any minor flaws in his personality. He's a workhorse and he hasn't peaked yet. You put way too much emphasis on his behavior which isn't as bad as you make it out to be.
 
CDAV45 said:
He already is a legit big leaguer and I doubt his attitude/disposition is an issue or he would already be gone. You won't find a better athlete on the mound and I agree that he will always outpitch his FIP which I have little faith in anyway. I also think that while he may be a bit ornery his work ethic outweighs any minor flaws in his personality. He's a workhorse and he hasn't peaked yet. You put way too much emphasis on his behavior which isn't as bad as you make it out to be.
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He broke protocol during covid and we don't have the actual story about the injury last season. He's not a cancer, but not the person you want a leader though on your team. If he hasn't grown up, I doubt he is long for this team...
 
sportscoach said:
If Morgan sincerely gets something like the slider to be a plus pitch... with I believe he added a cutter, which moves differently than his fastball and a random curveball added in here and there, I think he could become better than Tomlin, which puts him better than a BOR but not exactly a MOR. I think he could be one scary guy with that pitch if he can get it to be a plus pitch. If not, he is likely the best spot starter/swingman in baseball...
Click to expand...
Undoubtedly he could be better than Tomlin, but he still has little room for error if he misses on the plate. I see Eli as a good #4 or #5, but I don't see him as a MOR SP. I'd be more than happy to be wrong about that.
 
sportscoach said:
He broke protocol during covid and we don't have the actual story about the injury last season. He's not a cancer, but not the person you want a leader though on your team. If he hasn't grown up, I doubt he is long for this team...
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If he can inspire his teammates to work as hard as he does and play with the energy that he demonstrates then I'd take an entire team of Zach Plesacs. I don't give a shit about "covid protocol" that changed seemingly by the day.
 
Bailivia said:
Is there something about Zach Plesac Im missing here? 27 year old with two mediocre/bad seasons sandwiching a short good season primarily against weak competition, and he’s not a bat misser (by today’s standards). Why is he regarded so highly in this forum?
Click to expand...
In 313 IP starting when he was a 24 yr old he has a career ERA of 3.93 which is heavily influenced by last season that saw him miss significant time with a broken thumb. He's just entering his prime, has excellent control, and induces a lot of weak contact allowing him to pitch deep into games with regularity. Yeah, you're missing something and I'd venture to say that he's highly regarded not only in this forum, but throughout the league. He's a very solid major league SP and those don't grow on trees.

Edited to say that no pitcher in MLB controls the running game better than Plesac.
 
Criznit said:
I'm not an Adell fan, but there was a moment where uber prospect Bryan Buxton looked like a complete bust. Though injuries are zapping him, when he is on...
Click to expand...
I'm a fan of the athleticism and upside, but his failure to find success in MLB has certainly hurt his stock. The only SP I'd be willing to deal for Adell is Allen Sr or Morgan and I doubt the Angels would be willing to do that. I know I wouldn't.
 
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