eChameleon
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Guardians get Murphy.
Athletics get a new stadium.
Who says no?
Athletics get a new stadium.
Who says no?
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Changing RCF's index page, please click on "Forums" to access the forums.
2023 Guardians Offseason Thread!
- Thread starter sportscoach
- Start date
I think the author of that article got the offer wrong. I’m sure they were asking for one of nootbar/Donovan and the pitching prospect. That is logical and still tough for stl.
That’s like asking for kwan and Williams. Not happening
That’s like asking for kwan and Williams. Not happening
Criznit
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Oakland says no, get them outta here!
Oakland is doing what it should do at this point in time. Its what I would do. CBBI is correct.
But there are two risks. The first is that the suitors will move on. The second is that Murphy is at the peak of his value, and that value will drop the moment the 2024 season begins.
Murphy as a player offers no value to Oakland, because the A's aren't anything near a contending team. Whether he plays for them or not makes zero difference. His sole value is in trade.
Oakland loses if they don't trade him by opening day. So they have to time it perfectly right....thread the needle to maximize his value before losing it.
Much like our FO has to do with all our prospects. We threaded the needle perfectly when we traded kids like Mejia, Frazier, and Sheffield. We held on too long with kids like Zimmer and Jones.
The flip side is that those teams truly interested in him, and with a legit shot at landing him, have to thread the needle between waiting Oakland out and addressing their needs with a lesser, more economical option.
I don't know how many legit trade partners there are for Murphy, but surely not all the teams being rumored.
Arizona? Really?
Houston, a division rival? Highly doubtful.
St Louis has already moved on. It appears that Vazquez will sign soon, eliminating another team.
And then there are the Blue Jays with three tradeable catchers.
Supply and demand works both ways.
********
The Guardians can attack their needs in different ways. They've already filled the need for a 1B/DH to pair with Naylor. They could fill catcher with a big splash and back fill somewhere else. Or they could make a big splash somewhere else and go with a defense only answer at catcher.
The Guardians REALLY NEEDED a big bat, and it had to come at 1B, RF, DH, or catcher. Signing Bell made the need for offense behind the plate smaller. Perhaps landing another major bat eliminates the need for an offensive catcher totally.
We focus a lot on offense, so let's look at it a bit. Without a single offensive addition to what we have, it will be better than 2022.
Bell certainly is an improvement over Miller-Arias-Naylor vs lefties. Only one player, Gimebez, is a realistic candidate for regression. But Straw is a candidate for positive regression to the norm. Naylor will be healthier, which should improve his offense. I'm not sure that Oscar is for real, but at worst we are looking at Oscar/Brennan as opposed to 450 PAs from Mercado-Palacios-Jones-Call-Benson.
********
Its a long way until opening day, but on paper we've moved forward, while Chicago and Minnesota have moved backwards.
But there are two risks. The first is that the suitors will move on. The second is that Murphy is at the peak of his value, and that value will drop the moment the 2024 season begins.
Murphy as a player offers no value to Oakland, because the A's aren't anything near a contending team. Whether he plays for them or not makes zero difference. His sole value is in trade.
Oakland loses if they don't trade him by opening day. So they have to time it perfectly right....thread the needle to maximize his value before losing it.
Much like our FO has to do with all our prospects. We threaded the needle perfectly when we traded kids like Mejia, Frazier, and Sheffield. We held on too long with kids like Zimmer and Jones.
The flip side is that those teams truly interested in him, and with a legit shot at landing him, have to thread the needle between waiting Oakland out and addressing their needs with a lesser, more economical option.
I don't know how many legit trade partners there are for Murphy, but surely not all the teams being rumored.
Arizona? Really?
Houston, a division rival? Highly doubtful.
St Louis has already moved on. It appears that Vazquez will sign soon, eliminating another team.
And then there are the Blue Jays with three tradeable catchers.
Supply and demand works both ways.
********
The Guardians can attack their needs in different ways. They've already filled the need for a 1B/DH to pair with Naylor. They could fill catcher with a big splash and back fill somewhere else. Or they could make a big splash somewhere else and go with a defense only answer at catcher.
The Guardians REALLY NEEDED a big bat, and it had to come at 1B, RF, DH, or catcher. Signing Bell made the need for offense behind the plate smaller. Perhaps landing another major bat eliminates the need for an offensive catcher totally.
We focus a lot on offense, so let's look at it a bit. Without a single offensive addition to what we have, it will be better than 2022.
Bell certainly is an improvement over Miller-Arias-Naylor vs lefties. Only one player, Gimebez, is a realistic candidate for regression. But Straw is a candidate for positive regression to the norm. Naylor will be healthier, which should improve his offense. I'm not sure that Oscar is for real, but at worst we are looking at Oscar/Brennan as opposed to 450 PAs from Mercado-Palacios-Jones-Call-Benson.
********
Its a long way until opening day, but on paper we've moved forward, while Chicago and Minnesota have moved backwards.
cliffdawg
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Signing or Trading for a catcher definitely, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they trade one or both of Plesac and Civale and maybe bring in a solid number 2 starters ……..The GM on this site would have you think Rosario is definitely on the trading block, wouldn’t surprise me on opening day ,Rosario is our starting SS and battling 2……
Criznit
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Don't know if I agree with the notion Sean Murphy has hit peak value. If the A's believe he can move from an above average hitter to a league "leading" type hitter, aka his OPS sits at/goes north of .800 a 2023 deadline trade of Murphy should pull quite a haul, equal to if not better than one during the current off-season.
Oakland is playing their hand very hard, and it seems more bluff than substance... If they aren't trading Muprhy this off-season they are assuming a fair amount of risk for a questionable payoff.
If we end up going the Zunino/Vazquez route and don't end up trading for a solid #2-3 type pitcher I will be disappointed.
Oakland is playing their hand very hard, and it seems more bluff than substance... If they aren't trading Muprhy this off-season they are assuming a fair amount of risk for a questionable payoff.
If we end up going the Zunino/Vazquez route and don't end up trading for a solid #2-3 type pitcher I will be disappointed.
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sportscoach
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The A's they still want Espino on top of that lol
CBBI
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I would say...
STEP 1: Acquire a catcher
This can come via free agency or it can come via cashing in some prospects in a trade for a big name like Murphy or perhaps one of the Toronto guys. Regardless of how they do it, they have to bring in a catcher not named Austin Hedges who they feel confident can play at least 50% of the time in case Bo simply isn't ready to be a 100-120 game catcher as a rookie.
STEP 2: Acquire a starting pitcher
This one, IMO, is more directly tied to step 1. If the Guardians just sign a C like Vazquez or Zunino, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they then pivoted and used some of the assets they were willing to give up for a stud catcher on a starting pitcher. If they cash in a bunch of trade chips on a guy like Murphy, I'd guess they stick with what they have (Bieber/McKenzie/Quantrill/Plesac/Civale/Morris as the top 6).
I really don't think Rosario is going anywhere, even if there are reasons why moving him would make sense.
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Hate to beat this horse again, but to clarify I dont have a problem with Rosario, I like him, its just that at 9 million thats probably 10% or more of the total salary. Seems like it would be better spent. Two, you gotta give Freeman/Arias a crack at it before Rocchio/Martinez are ready.
Criznit
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I believe once another big name SS come off the board, we will take some Rosario calls. Doesn't mean we will be trading him by any means, but come at us with a creative offer late in the game and we may move on it.
sportscoach
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He's got a point though... it would be Kwan, Williams plus OGonz...
Either way, it's way, way too much lol
DCTribefan
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Oakland’s mayor.
DCTribefan
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Hate to say this but Kwan is also a candidate for regression.