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2019 Browns Off Season/Roster Discussion

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Lee said:
Tunsil was a 70.4 last year, Robinson about a 60, Hubbard about a 65, but Tretter was a 72.4, so better than either tackle, but not better than most of the interior. By comparison Ziettler was 74.5 and Kush was 55.5.

So maybe you forgot Tretter, but I agree he might help the left side and strengthen our overall line. I expect Kush to grade out in the 60's with better coaching and play calling, but then again that would bring Tunsil up too.

What do you think he costs to bring in? He is owed a bit over 2 this year and a bit over 10 next. So basically if we bring him in we can afford him and Greg this year, but next year we have to decide between him and Robinson. Tunsil from what I know is pretty much a left tackle, I dont think he has the power to play right tackle.
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I don't really agree with PFF, especially when it comes to the way they rate offensive linemen.

I definitely include Tretter, but I admit that if someone wanted to argue and say that Tretter, as a C, is just as good as Tunsil is at T, it's not a point I'm willing to argue.

I honestly have no idea what he'd cost to bring in. I have a really hard time gauging trade values for offensive linemen.

I think Tunsil's a stronger body than Hubbard.

I think both Hubbard and Tunsil are better tackles than Robinson.

I wonder if Tunsil's athletic enough to move inside to guard. Probably not, but someone else would know better than I do.
 
Out of the Rafters at the Q said:
I don't really agree with PFF, especially when it comes to the way they rate offensive linemen.

I definitely include Tretter, but I admit that if someone wanted to argue and say that Tretter, as a C, is just as good as Tunsil is at T, it's not a point I'm willing to argue.

I honestly have no idea what he'd cost to bring in. I have a really hard time gauging trade values for offensive linemen.

I think Tunsil's a stronger body than Hubbard.

I think both Hubbard and Tunsil are better tackles than Robinson.

I wonder if Tunsil's athletic enough to move inside to guard. Probably not, but someone else would know better than I do.
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PFF does pretty good on offensive lineman ratings eventhough I disagree on how they get there sometimes. I think Tunsil has been decent but under performed expectations. Not Greg Robinson level, but I would rank Tunsil an average starting left tackle, maybe top 15 in the league...maybe while I think Tretter is a top 10 in the league center, but really splitting hairs on that one imo.

Tunsil is really athletic, but the same reason he wouldn't grade well at right tackle he wouldn't do well being moved inside, he really isn't a mauler. He is a decently strong finesse tackle. He has enough going for him though he might be able to be coached up into a top 10 left tackle, but like Robinson I don't see him at any other line spot. That said I agree LT is our weakest position and thus we wouldn't bring Tunsil in to play anywhere but LT.

Cost? Probably 6th round maybe 5th round pick. He is cheap for only 1 year more and could very well be a casualty of his 10 mill 2020 contract if he doesn't perform up to it which he hasn't quite at this point which is why he is probably available now.
 
Either way, this team’s gotta address the OL somehow. The run blocking has been piss poor.
 
Marcus said:
Either way, this team’s gotta address the OL somehow. The run blocking has been piss poor.
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Wait a minute. Are you suggesting that maybe, just maybe, Kush and Corbett and Hubbard and Robinson suck regardless of whether OBJ is on the field or not?

Insanity.
 
Tunsil or Williams would be such a massive addition to this offensive line right now. I don't hate Greg Robinson, but the Browns can and should find somebody better. Wouldn't mind him as a depth piece, or even trying him out somewhere else to see if it works out better. He's just average at best, and with this offense we really need to give Mayfield enough time, along with running room for Chubb and eventually Hunt.

Something tells me the Redskins are either not interested in trading Williams, or the asking price is just outrageous. Seems like Miami would be down to take a pick for Tunsil. I'd definitely consider it for a 2nd-round pick, maybe even a 1st-round pick if it means getting the help this line desperately needs before the season begins.

The Browns' 1st-round pick isn't going to be a top 5-10 selection anymore, so I'm perfectly fine giving up a later round 1st in order to nab a proven linemen right now.
 
King Stannis said:
I’m thinking they want to use a cost controlled draft pick rather than an expensive veteran there.
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Honestly, I wouldn’t mind an expensive veteran there for a couple seasons, given that all this team’s key pieces are either already under team control for several years (Landry, OBJ) or are currently on their rookie deals (Garrett, Baker, Ward, Chubb).

But, I get it. If I’m John Dorsey, I’m throwing all my draft capital at improving the offensive line for next season. It’s the only truly glaring weakness they have at this point (apart from kicker, and I’m hoping that Seibert continues to build upon his performance last night), but it is a significant one. Luckily the Browns have several great options in the short to intermediate passing game that can help open things up and keep defenses honest, but we saw what having even a single disruptive force like Suh was able to do in both the run and pass. On top of that, they’ve got one of the best offensive line coaches in the league, who I’m confident would be able to coach up whatever young, talented guys we have. While it’s starting to appear as though the writing is on the wall for Corbett as being nothing more than a rotational guard or center, the early returns on Forbes are positive.

Really, if they can get guys at tackle and right guard that are at least average, I think they’ll be able to survive this season.
 
CavsRules said:
Tunsil or Williams would be such a massive addition to this offensive line right now. I don't hate Greg Robinson, but the Browns can and should find somebody better. Wouldn't mind him as a depth piece, or even trying him out somewhere else to see if it works out better. He's just average at best, and with this offense we really need to give Mayfield enough time, along with running room for Chubb and eventually Hunt.

Something tells me the Redskins are either not interested in trading Williams, or the asking price is just outrageous. Seems like Miami would be down to take a pick for Tunsil. I'd definitely consider it for a 2nd-round pick, maybe even a 1st-round pick if it means getting the help this line desperately needs before the season begins.

The Browns' 1st-round pick isn't going to be a top 5-10 selection anymore, so I'm perfectly fine giving up a later round 1st in order to nab a proven linemen right now.
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I can’t imagine Miami would be willing to part with a good, young lineman who is on a very friendly deal when all indications are that they are likely to kick off their rebuild with whichever QB is ranked at the top of the 2020 draft. That’s a cornerstone piece for a rebuild.
 
The Athletic ran a piece that lists teams needs and surpluses.

Cleveland Browns ( Need: Tight end Surplus: Defensive back )

I am surprised that Zac Jackson didn't have offensive line on that list instead.

Two teams had a surplus of offensive linemen:
Dallas Cowboys ( Need: Tight end Surplus: Defensive line, offensive line )​
Philadelphia Eagles (Need: Edge rusher, linebacker, safety, tight end Surplus: Running back, offensive line, defensive tackle )​

Seems like the Eagles would be a good trading partner on paper.

The problem is that there are 12 other teams listed with needs at offensive line:
Arizona Cardinals: Offensive tackle​
Baltimore Ravens: Interior offensive line​
Buffalo Bills: Offensive tackle​
Cincinnati Bengals: Offensive tackle​
Indianapolis Colts: Offensive tackle​
Los Angeles Chargers: Offensive tackle​
Los Angeles Rams: Offensive line​
Miami Dolphins: Offensive line​
New Orleans Saints: Offensive tackle​
New York Giants: Offensive line​
Oakland Raiders: Guard​
San Francisco 49ers: Offensive tackle​
​
 
Before we get into need, let's take a second to talk about how amazing the defensive backfield looks right now.

I remember Mike Pettine carried something like nine defensive backs. When asked why he said, " You can never have enough over the course of the season." Pettine wasn't a head coach, but he is a good defensive coordinator. The depth that former defensive back Steve Wilks gets to work with is a force.

The top three of Ward, Greedy and Money Mitch are formidable and balanced. Ward is the speedy Pro Bowler. Greedy is young and a physical prototype at outside corner. Mitch is big, physical and gets his hand on a lot of passes.

Then we have almost forgotten about TJ Carrie, who earns starter money because he has been one of the best slot corners for the past few years. Gaines seems to have the inside track at fifth corner, and the Browns only have him because he was misscast as a starter and got cut.

The Browns have the best three Green Bay safeties from before they switched front offices, so they communicate and have experience in games working as a cohesive unit. Fourth is Eric Murray, who can play either safety or slot corner. His only drawback like Whitehead is less than ideal size and speed, but they are versatile and played in big games. The fifth will be Redwine, a rookie who has great strong safety skills but needs the passing game to slow down for him.

That's an amazing group considering how bad the Browns were in the backfield two years ago.
 
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Randolphkeys said:
Before we get into need, let's take a second to talk about how amazing the defensive backfield looks right now.

I remember Mike Pettine carried something like nine defensive backs. When asked why he said, " You can never have enough over the course of the season." Pettine wasn't a head coach, but he is a good defensive coordinator. The depth that former defensive back Steve Wilks gets to work with is a force.

The top three of Ward, Greedy and Money Mitch are formidable and balanced. Ward is the speedy Pro Bowler. Greedy is young and a physical prototype at outside corner. Mitch is big, physical and gets his hand on a lot of passes.

Then we have almost forgotten about TJ Carrie, who earns starter money because he has been one of the best slot corners for the past few years. Gaines seems to have the inside track at fifth corner, and the Browns only have him because he was misscast as a starter and got cut.

The Browns have the best three Green Bay safeties from before they switched front offices, so they communicate and have experience in games working as a cohesive unit. Fourth is Eric Berry, who can play either safety or slot corner. His only drawback like Whitehead is less than ideal size and speed, but they are versatile and played in big games. The fifth will be Redwine, a rookie who has great strong safety skills but needs the passing game to slow down for him.

That's an amazing group considering how bad the Browns were in the backfield two years ago.
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When did the Browns sign Eric Berry? School already got your brain that fried?
 
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