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2021 NBA Draft Safari

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Less than 24 hours and this conversation gains a lot more parameters and really kicks into high gear.

The discussion and options if we are picking 1-5 is going to be so so different than if we are picking 6-9
 
Just did the tankathon sim for the first time. Guess who got first overall? Cavs. Hope the same happens tomorrow.
 
Ever since we won the game against Boston where many got upset, for some reason I feel we are getting in top 4 this year.
 

Hollinger has it...

1) Cunningham
2) Mobley
3) Barnes
4) Sengun
5) Green
6) Suggs
7) Wagner
8) Kuminga
9) Jalen Johnson
10) Giddey
11) Jared Butler
12) Kispert
13) Bouknight
14) Moody
15) Garuba
16) Davion Mitchell
17) Miles McBride
18) Keon Johnson
19) Duarte
20) Springer

Sleepers
21) Prkacin
22) Queta
23) Herb Jones

I REALLY vibe with this list. Pretty close to how I would have it. I think Hollinger would get along with @Nathan S, @I'mWithDan, and their spreadsheets

Oh, and this is well worth a read if you have a sub. Great breakdown of each player and the perfect primer for tonight.
 

Hollinger has it...

1) Cunningham
2) Mobley
3) Barnes
4) Sengun
5) Green
6) Suggs
7) Wagner
8) Kuminga
9) Jalen Johnson
10) Giddey
11) Jared Butler
12) Kispert
13) Bouknight
14) Moody
15) Garuba
16) Davion Mitchell
17) Miles McBride
18) Keon Johnson
19) Duarte
20) Springer

Sleepers
21) Prkacin
22) Queta
23) Herb Jones

I REALLY vibe with this list. Pretty close to how I would have it. I think Hollinger would get along with @Nathan S, @I'mWithDan, and their spreadsheets

Oh, and this is well worth a read if you have a sub. Great breakdown of each player and the perfect primer for tonight.

Thanks for the share.

I'll be interested to see if this is the shift that takes place, as I think Hollinger is ahead of the curve in having Sengun, Barnes and Wagner in his top 7 and Kuminga at 8......who is a defacto top 5 pick in all these mock drafts. I additionally appreciate him dropping Keon, which also seems against consensus for some unknown reason. Close to draft time, I suspect boards will settle in this range but we'll see.
 

Hollinger has it...

1) Cunningham
2) Mobley
3) Barnes
4) Sengun
5) Green
6) Suggs
7) Wagner
8) Kuminga
9) Jalen Johnson
10) Giddey
11) Jared Butler
12) Kispert
13) Bouknight
14) Moody
15) Garuba
16) Davion Mitchell
17) Miles McBride
18) Keon Johnson
19) Duarte
20) Springer

Sleepers
21) Prkacin
22) Queta
23) Herb Jones

I REALLY vibe with this list. Pretty close to how I would have it. I think Hollinger would get along with @Nathan S, @I'mWithDan, and their spreadsheets

Oh, and this is well worth a read if you have a sub. Great breakdown of each player and the perfect primer for tonight.

Flip Suggs and Green at 5&6 then flip Wagner and Kuminga at 7&8 and that's pretty much my top 10 right now. People are sleeping on Sengun because they think he doesn't have three point range. Judging by his free throw percentage and age, that's right around the corner. He's PF #1 for me with the ability to switch 3-5.

Herb Jones deserves more love as well - he could crack the back end of a rotation right away.
 
Thanks for the share.

I'll be interested to see if this is the shift that takes place, as I think Hollinger is ahead of the curve in having Sengun, Barnes and Wagner in his top 7 and Kuminga at 8......who is a defacto top 5 pick in all these mock drafts. I additionally appreciate him dropping Keon, which also seems against consensus for some unknown reason. Close to draft time, I suspect boards will settle in this range but we'll see.
I wouldn't be surprised at all if this is where it ends up heading. He's much closer to front offices than some kid writing for Tankathon or Bleacher Report.
 
Worth reading ALL the write ups.....but thought Hollinger's insight on Cade was especially spot on:

1. Cade Cunningham, SG/SF, Oklahoma State, Freshman

The default that Cunningham is the best player in this draft has perhaps not been challenged enough. I ended up with him No. 1 as well, but reasonable people can disagree among the top four players on my board.

Ultimately, the best reason to pick Cunningham is that his elite shooting gives him the highest floor of any player in the draft. Cunningham shot 40 percent from 3-point range and 84.6 percent from the line, and many of those 3s were tough looks off the dribble. His catch-and-shoots look perfect, and he has the size to shoot over any closeout. That perimeter skill set, from a big wing who can handle and pass, makes Khris Middleton-type outcomes seem reasonably likely.

Finding big wings with skill of any stripe is also the most difficult thing for any NBA team to pull off. These players are massively valuable — as the playoffs are once again showing us — and should be the priority of any team’s draft process.

Where I push back is the idea that Cunningham can be “The Man,” the guy you give the keys to the offense on Day 1 and never look back. For me, he’s much more of a secondary creator who can weaponize his shooting threat rather than the guy you play on the ball for 60 trips a game.

In particular, Cunningham’s game off the bounce strikes me as wildly overrated. He has a loose handle that gets away from him fairly often, particularly with his left hand. He also constantly forces passes and rarely makes deliveries that make you go “ooh!” (They’re in there if you look hard enough, but man, there’s a lot of chaff in between the wheat.) He can throw crosscourt passes with his right hand, but they’re not laser beams; the defense has a chance to recover.

Between the lost dribbles and wayward passes, Cunningham had a sky-high turnover rate for a prospect of this magnitude (or any prospect, really), giving it away seven times per 100, and a meh assist rate of five per 100. In fairness, we should allow some for context: The surrounding roster was not exactly an offensive juggernaut and was particularly deficient in 3-point shooting, limiting Cunningham’s operating space and assist options.

As a scoring threat on the ball, he really struggled to get by defenders. Attempts to blow by bigs on switches often ended with him dribbling straight into a defender’s chest, and he rarely got all the way to the basket. Overall he shot only 46.1 percent on 2s. Again, the limited spacing on this roster didn’t help. I like Cunningham a lot better if he starts with a half-step advantage or can leverage his shooting threat against a closing defender. Luka Doncic he ain’t.

Defensively, he’s good enough. He uses his length well and can slide his feet, but he’s not a disruptor or somebody who anticipates for steals. He won’t be NBA All-Defense or anything, but he’ll be able to switch across positions and hold his own. Again, a floor as a high-level 3-and-D guy is pretty darned good. It’s just may not be what we’re used to for the top overall pick.

Cunningham is also a cool, unflappable customer with a penchant for big shots. He is clearly an NBA starter from Day 1, and the possibilities of elite shooting gives him Jayson Tatum upside. His inability to beat defenders off the dribble may not matter if he’s rising up for 30-footers against them.

Overall, he’s my pick here. But it’s not the home run some make it out to be, and I’m hoping the team drafting him has another playmaker.
 

Hollinger has it...

1) Cunningham
2) Mobley
3) Barnes
4) Sengun
5) Green
6) Suggs
7) Wagner
8) Kuminga
9) Jalen Johnson
10) Giddey
11) Jared Butler
12) Kispert
13) Bouknight
14) Moody
15) Garuba
16) Davion Mitchell
17) Miles McBride
18) Keon Johnson
19) Duarte
20) Springer

Sleepers
21) Prkacin
22) Queta
23) Herb Jones

I REALLY vibe with this list. Pretty close to how I would have it. I think Hollinger would get along with @Nathan S, @I'mWithDan, and their spreadsheets

Oh, and this is well worth a read if you have a sub. Great breakdown of each player and the perfect primer for tonight.

Hollinger and Tankathon have a drastically different take on Suggs (#1 vs #6). That's interesting!

Anyway, it seems like we can get a solid prospect even if we draft at #9 (0.6% chance).

What would you do with #1 or #2 pick?
A. Draft Cade/Mobley, or
B. Try to offload Love by packaging with the pick for a mid first-rounder, if possible (salary match might be an issue), or
C. Trade down, if possible, for multiple high picks (may be #5 and #8 from OKC, just a hypothetical situation), or
D. Something else?
 
Last edited:
Worth reading the write ups.....thought Hollinger's insight on Cade was spot on:

1. Cade Cunningham, SG/SF, Oklahoma State, Freshman

The default that Cunningham is the best player in this draft has perhaps not been challenged enough. I ended up with him No. 1 as well, but reasonable people can disagree among the top four players on my board.

Ultimately, the best reason to pick Cunningham is that his elite shooting gives him the highest floor of any player in the draft. Cunningham shot 40 percent from 3-point range and 84.6 percent from the line, and many of those 3s were tough looks off the dribble. His catch-and-shoots look perfect, and he has the size to shoot over any closeout. That perimeter skill set, from a big wing who can handle and pass, makes Khris Middleton-type outcomes seem reasonably likely.

Finding big wings with skill of any stripe is also the most difficult thing for any NBA team to pull off. These players are massively valuable — as the playoffs are once again showing us — and should be the priority of any team’s draft process.

Where I push back is the idea that Cunningham can be “The Man,” the guy you give the keys to the offense on Day 1 and never look back. For me, he’s much more of a secondary creator who can weaponize his shooting threat rather than the guy you play on the ball for 60 trips a game.

In particular, Cunningham’s game off the bounce strikes me as wildly overrated. He has a loose handle that gets away from him fairly often, particularly with his left hand. He also constantly forces passes and rarely makes deliveries that make you go “ooh!” (They’re in there if you look hard enough, but man, there’s a lot of chaff in between the wheat.) He can throw crosscourt passes with his right hand, but they’re not laser beams; the defense has a chance to recover.

Between the lost dribbles and wayward passes, Cunningham had a sky-high turnover rate for a prospect of this magnitude (or any prospect, really), giving it away seven times per 100, and a meh assist rate of five per 100. In fairness, we should allow some for context: The surrounding roster was not exactly an offensive juggernaut and was particularly deficient in 3-point shooting, limiting Cunningham’s operating space and assist options.

As a scoring threat on the ball, he really struggled to get by defenders. Attempts to blow by bigs on switches often ended with him dribbling straight into a defender’s chest, and he rarely got all the way to the basket. Overall he shot only 46.1 percent on 2s. Again, the limited spacing on this roster didn’t help. I like Cunningham a lot better if he starts with a half-step advantage or can leverage his shooting threat against a closing defender. Luka Doncic he ain’t.

Defensively, he’s good enough. He uses his length well and can slide his feet, but he’s not a disruptor or somebody who anticipates for steals. He won’t be NBA All-Defense or anything, but he’ll be able to switch across positions and hold his own. Again, a floor as a high-level 3-and-D guy is pretty darned good. It’s just may not be what we’re used to for the top overall pick.

Cunningham is also a cool, unflappable customer with a penchant for big shots. He is clearly an NBA starter from Day 1, and the possibilities of elite shooting gives him Jayson Tatum upside. His inability to beat defenders off the dribble may not matter if he’s rising up for 30-footers against them.

Overall, he’s my pick here. But it’s not the home run some make it out to be, and I’m hoping the team drafting him has another playmaker.

Largely agree with this take. Only quibble is that, as with most scouting reports, this is 90% about his offense and 10% about his defense...and I think whether Cade's a good or merely average defender makes worlds of difference here. Like, if it's not clear that he's going to be an above average defender, then you can't say his floor is a "high-level 3-and-D guy," and I don't think it's clear that he's going to be an above average defender.
 
Hollinger and Tankathon have a drastically different take on Suggs (#1 vs #6). That's interesting!

Anyway, it seems like we can get a solid prospect even if we draft at #9 (0.6% chance).

What would you do with #1 or #2 pick:
A. Draft Cade/Mobley
B. Try to offload Love by packaging with the pick for a mid first-rounder, if possible (salary match might be an issue)
C. Trade down, if possible, for multiple high picks (may be #5 and #8 from OKC, just a hypothetical situation)
D. Something else?

I really don't want to draft 9. Let's not entertain that. :chuckle:

A. #1 or #2.......I'm taking Cade or Mobley.

B. I'm definitely not using a top 2 pick to offload Love. Don't compound the mistake.

C. In a trade down......I do it for #5 and #6. Once you get to #7, you reallllly need to like Wagner / Kuminga for the math to work there. A package for #8? I just think that isn't enough value. But if I could forgo Cade or Mobley for Barnes and Suggs or Green and Barnes, etc, etc......I just like the pairs in that scenario more.

D. How about the OKC trio.......at what pick do you trade for lets says #6, #16 and #18? #3? If OKC makes the Justice Winslow offer?
 
My big takeaway is that if Barnes is the guy we fall in love with as the best fit for our team.... there's a non-zero chance we have to get to 3 tonight to get him
 
I really don't want to draft 9. Let's not entertain that. :chuckle:

A. #1 or #2.......I'm taking Cade or Mobley.

B. I'm definitely not using a top 2 pick to offload Love. Don't compound the mistake.

C. In a trade down......I do it for #5 and #6. Once you get to #7, you reallllly need to like Wagner / Kuminga for the math to work there. A package for #8? I just think that isn't enough value. But if I could forgo Cade or Mobley for Barnes and Suggs or Green and Barnes, etc, etc......I just like the pairs in that scenario more.

D. How about the OKC trio.......at what pick do you trade for lets says #6, #16 and #18? #3? If OKC makes the Justice Winslow offer?

I feel like we'll have our board and that trading top 2 for a package including #6/#7 comes down to what tier we have the top guys in. That Cade report had me wanting to trade with someone who wants him, but it's impossible to tell without knowing the tiers of the players. Also, I believe (anyone know?) that we could take the higher player and then wait to see who was drafted at 6/7 (if that player falls) before trading. If that's the case, we can take some guess work out of it.
 
I feel like we'll have our board and that trading top 2 for a package including #6/#7 comes down to what tier we have the top guys in. That Cade report had me wanting to trade with someone who wants him, but it's impossible to tell without knowing the tiers of the players. Also, I believe (anyone know?) that we could take the higher player and then wait to see who was drafted at 6/7 (if that player falls) before trading. If that's the case, we can take some guess work out of it.

Sometimes.

Let's say a team like OKC is at #5 & 6 and they love Cade. They also don't think Barnes will be available at #5.

The draft falls:

Cade / Mobley / Green / Kuminga.

It is possible someone just falls in love with Kuminga's tools, ditto for Green.

Suddenly, OKC has Suggs and Barnes kind of just fall in their lap in an unexpected way and they possibly just pass on that trade.

You typically need to leverage the unknown IMO to extract maximum value, I think more so with polarizing players like Cade.

If OKC loves Cade and thinks he's a generational player, it doesn't matter who falls........but in a scenario where they really like but don't love a player, giving them a view of the draft board can certainly lead to negative outcomes for the team trading the player drafted at #1. Especially in drafts that offer more quality in the middle of the lottery, like this one.
 

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