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2023 Cleveland Guardians Season Thread

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rcristal said:
I , absolutely admit that I was wrong. I love the young man's hustle and attitude. However, he has no plate discipline and his obvious natural athletic ability aside, his skills are not a fit at shortstop.
Having said that, I would definitely want him on my team in some role.
Rcristal
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Respect.
Shakezoula
 
The FO and Tito are in a tough spot.

They have made decisions, based upon a lot of long term info. They have a process they go thru. And they have a lot of confidence and trust in both the decision making and the process...and rightly so.

And they had a series of goals for this season. Those goals, no matter what they were, had priorities.

Now, as Tito says, they are being tested. Their confidence in their decision making is being tested. Their trust in their process is being tested. Their trust in the players they chose is being tested.

They certainly didn't expect Jose and Amed to have the worst seasons of their careers. They didn't expect the entire back end of the bullpen to falter badly in key situations at the same time. A third of the way thru the season, do they stick with the decisions they made, expecting a return to track records, or do they make wholesale changes? And how much money will ownership allow them to swallow to do so?

Is 4.5 games back at Memorial Day weekend...in a weak division...the proper time to raise the white flag...and in what could be Titos last season?

Should they make major new decisions and change course...like fans do...based upon 'what have you done lately' type thinking?

Just as importantly, do you move prospects up before the org collectively feels they are ready for one reason or another, and risk their futures...and start their clocks?

*****

A lot of sentiment on this forum to trade Bieber now as a way to acquire immediate offense....but teams interested in acquiring Bieber are in win now mode, and aren't gonna be interested in trading surefire impact offense.

The closest thing to trading Biebs was trading Bartolo Colon in late June, 2002. Great trade for Cleveland, but none of the prospects made any kind of impact until three years later...and only Grady. Trading Bieber is a move for 2026.

*******

Trading for even more prospects may sound reasonable, but what then do we do with all the prospects we now have on the 40 man and already backed up three levels?

******

All of these questions have to be weighed by the FO.
 
The season will get decided in the next 22 games either way. After this Cardinals series the Gards play 13 games in a row versus contenders followed by six game west coast road swing. Feels like the final plunge of this season is going down over the next three weeks.
 
CATS44 said:
The FO and Tito are in a tough spot.

They have made decisions, based upon a lot of long term info. They have a process they go thru. And they have a lot of confidence and trust in both the decision making and the process...and rightly so.

And they had a series of goals for this season. Those goals, no matter what they were, had priorities.

Now, as Tito says, they are being tested. Their confidence in their decision making is being tested. Their trust in their process is being tested. Their trust in the players they chose is being tested.

They certainly didn't expect Jose and Amed to have the worst seasons of their careers. They didn't expect the entire back end of the bullpen to falter badly in key situations at the same time. A third of the way thru the season, do they stick with the decisions they made, expecting a return to track records, or do they make wholesale changes? And how much money will ownership allow them to swallow to do so?

Is 4.5 games back at Memorial Day weekend...in a weak division...the proper time to raise the white flag...and in what could be Titos last season?

Should they make major new decisions and change course...like fans do...based upon 'what have you done lately' type thinking?

Just as importantly, do you move prospects up before the org collectively feels they are ready for one reason or another, and risk their futures...and start their clocks?

*****

A lot of sentiment on this forum to trade Bieber now as a way to acquire immediate offense....but teams interested in acquiring Bieber are in win now mode, and aren't gonna be interested in trading surefire impact offense.

The closest thing to trading Biebs was trading Bartolo Colon in late June, 2002. Great trade for Cleveland, but none of the prospects made any kind of impact until three years later...and only Grady. Trading Bieber is a move for 2026.

*******

Trading for even more prospects may sound reasonable, but what then do we do with all the prospects we now have on the 40 man and already backed up three levels?

******

All of these questions have to be weighed by the FO.
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Agreed….it’s a tough spot They are in.
 
CATS44 said:
Teams interested in acquiring Bieber are in win now mode, and aren't gonna be interested in trading surefire impact offense.

The closest thing to trading Biebs was trading Bartolo Colon...Trading for even more prospects may sound reasonable, but what then do we do with all the prospects we now have on the 40 man and already backed up three levels?
Click to expand...
Trading Bieber in July with 1.5 years left would net a really nice haul of prospects to add to the pile we already have.

This coming off-season, flush with prospects, we deal a package of them for an impact bat in the outfield. A Joe Carter for Alomar/Baerga, except this time the Joe Carter is coming our way. Kwan moves to center with Arias in right unless Oscar or Brennan beats him out.

The rotation would be McKenzie, Bibee, Allen, Williams, and Castillo, Gaddis, Morris, or Quantrill, whoever emerges.

Bo Naylor and Brayan Rocchio take over at catcher and short.
 
I really don't think they are in that tough of a spot. They have alternative guys at SS and catcher in the minors or on the bench that are ready to play. Play them. If they produce, your team got instantly better. If they struggle, nothing changed. They do have to decide on Bieber. I would move him at the deadline if the gap widens in the division but you have another 60 days to assess that. The hitting will improve just by accident with so many underachieving at the same time. The bullpen has disappointed but that part of the team can also be streaky.
 
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People realize this team has played the 3rd easiest schedule in the league right? And they think the team is going to play significantly better against a much tougher schedule? This isn't their year. Trade guys who aren't part of the future and build for the coming years. Team sucks this year.
 
HammerGold said:
Why are we playing a guy who has a great SS glove in RF? Shit makes 0 sense
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Arias should be playing SS every game when there's a righty on the mound. Then Brennan can play RF.

That config gives us both superior defense at both positions, and offense.
 
HammerGold said:
Why are we playing a guy who has a great SS glove in RF? Shit makes 0 sense
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images
 
PPark said:
Amed Rosario through today:

2022: .238, .287, .293, .580 66 wRC+
2023: .237, .275,.328, .603. 65 wRC+
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FWIW - it was about this time last year when Amed started going OFF and was arguably the best hitter in baseball for a month or so. Let's hope history repeats itself.

SplitGGSPAABRH2B3BHRRBISBCSBBSOBAOBPSLGOPSTBGDPHBPSHSFIBBROEBAbiptOPS+sOPS+
June2727119114214172212613170.3600.3780.5090.887584101000.406148145
 
If Amed does go on a roll the rest of the way maybe we should've just kept Owen Miller to play 2 months and then Amed plays the rest. Miller has been a notorious early starter, so that'd be a unique kind of platoon.
 
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