2024 Guardians Regular Season Thread

[Damage]

Nobody gives a shit about your sad amateur career, not sure why you keep referencing it.

Makes your argument sound even less credible.

That can’t be stressed enough, you and actual big league pitching programs have a gap the size of a canyon.


That is evident in your posts.

Jeez dude, ease up.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

Bibee, Williams and Allen combined for a 3.35 ERA in 349 1/3 innings, the lowest mark by a trio of rookie starters in the AL over the past ten years with at least 200 innings pitched. - Joe Nova

Best rookie class of starters in over a decade. Add Bieber, who is back to his Cy Young form, and McKenzie, who reports no arm discomfort and struck out seven batters in six innings in his final tuneup and I'm optimistic that we will have one of the top five rotations in the AL.

Bo [Naylor] turned it up down the stretch, batting .321 with seven home runs, 18 RBI and a 1.113 OPS in his final 28 games. He led the AL and was second in the majors in OPS during that stretch. The last Cleveland catcher to post a batting average of .320 or better and an OPS of 1.100 or better over a 28-game span was Victor Martinez in 2008-09. - Joe Noga

Having a legitimate bat at catcher this year is going to be a huge boost to the offense. I'm not predicting Bo will hit .321/1.113 for the season, but his production will far outpace what we got from Hedges, Maile, Gallegher, and Zunino last year. The catchers not named Naylor and Fry batted a combined .155 in 284 at-bats last year with 3 homers and 18 RBIs.

We will also get a big bump in offensive production in center field no matter who Vogt puts out there. I'm also confident we'll get more production from shortstop and right field and that Gimenez and Jose will bounce back from down years. We're going to surprise a lot of people if the starters stay healthy and the bullpen doesn't implode.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

The point being.. he did have an amateur career and didn't give a rat's ass about who was behind the dish.. thereby relying on himself and only himself.. therein lies the most obvious reason he had only an amateur career.. it takes a team..

You can't honestly believe that if this poster had just been willing to work with his catcher he would have been a professional baseball player?

I mean...do you even know what kind of stuff he had or how far he got? He might have been 2-13 as a sophomore at Mount St. Mary's and got cut the next year.

Anyway, Vogt says nobody gets a personal catcher so whether it's a good idea or a dumb idea we're not going to see it on the Guardians.

But for the sake of discussion, I think there is some merit to having a pitcher work with a veteran catcher who has caught him many times and knows him like the back of his hand. From familiarity that catcher can pick up on which pitch is working that night and which one is a little flat and adjust his pitch calls accordingly. He may be better at reading the hitters and knowing what pitch to call. He may be better able to pick up on a small mechanical flaw and correct it if he's really familiar with the pitcher's delivery.

Finally, just having a catcher that the pitcher is very comfortable with and confident in probably helps him relax and throw a better game. So I don't think a personal catcher is bad idea but ideally both catchers should be familiar with all the pitchers and be able to help them equally.

 

[eChameleon]

Vogt is just 920 wins away from tying Tito for most wins as Cleveland manager!

 

[thestatman]

Nobody gives a shit about your sad amateur career, not sure why you keep referencing it.

Makes your argument sound even less credible.

That can’t be stressed enough, you and actual big league pitching programs have a gap the size of a canyon.


That is evident in your posts.

lol...chapped ass again I see. Maybe you never played sports at all? So tell me Mr Internet bad ass, why does Stephen Vogt agree with me and not you?

How's Arias doing these days?

Do you ever get one right?

 

[CBBI]

Tbh the fact that Hedges *isn't* Bieber's personal catcher and Vogt simply wanted to split the catching duties 2/2 in the first series is probably worse than Shane just having his preferred guy back there

 

[Gson]

You can't honestly believe that if this poster had just been willing to work with his catcher he would have been a professional baseball player?

I mean...do you even know what kind of stuff he had or how far he got? He might have been 2-13 as a sophomore at Mount St. Mary's and got cut the next year.

Anyway, Vogt says nobody gets a personal catcher so whether it's a good idea or a dumb idea we're not going to see it on the Guardians.

But for the sake of discussion, I think there is some merit to having a pitcher work with a veteran catcher who has caught him many times and knows him like the back of his hand. From familiarity that catcher can pick up on which pitch is working that night and which one is a little flat and adjust his pitch calls accordingly. He may be better at reading the hitters and knowing what pitch to call. He may be better able to pick up on a small mechanical flaw and correct it if he's really familiar with the pitcher's delivery.

Finally, just having a catcher that the pitcher is very comfortable with and confident in probably helps him relax and throw a better game. So I don't think a personal catcher is bad idea but ideally both catchers should be familiar with all the pitchers and be able to help them equally.

a complete and total stretch of what was said.. taken to the extreme..

I have no idea what his talent level was.. or any mitigating circumstances that would have permitted or created an obstacle to having more than an amateur career.. YOU DON'T EITHER..

Vogt decides who plays on what day.. as was stated..

Agree with working with a catcher who is familiar with the knucklehead on the hill with the pill.. and all that that implies..

 

[thestatman]

You lost this one.

Hedges may not be Bieber’s personal catcher, but every pitcher cares who the catcher is and there really is no dispute about it.


The majority of managers would laugh in your face, like we all do here.

You are obviously dead wrong and you were never a pitcher. If you were you were you would never make such an idiotic statement that "every pitcher cares who the catcher is". Typical of you. I repeat, most pitchers AT EVERY LEVEL, high school, college, pro. don't give a shit who their catcher is. I sure didn't.

You are embarrassing yourself now.

 

[thestatman]

hmm... sort of disagree with some of this.. The sad amateur career stuff isn't salient to the point.. and you know that..

The point being.. he did have an amateur career and didn't give a rat's ass about who was behind the dish.. thereby relying on himself and only himself.. therein lies the most obvious reason he had only an amateur career.. it takes a team.. Pitchers (usually not lefties) know this and follow it.. it's a confidence thing more than anything..

Thoughts?

The point I made is a simple one..for the final time. Most pitchers...as in 90% or more, at any level don't have a preferred catcher. They just don't. They call their own pitches by shaking off whenever they want and they throw it where they want. AZ thinks 100% of pitchers have a preferred catcher. That is pure bullshit.

 

[thestatman]

Jeez dude, ease up.

That's who he is. He loves to thread shit.

 

[AZ_]

lol...chapped ass again I see. Maybe you never played sports at all? So tell me Mr Internet bad ass, why does Stephen Vogt agree with me and not you?

How's Arias doing these days?

Do you ever get one right?

Nobody agrees with you.

Arias is on a big league roster, but I haven’t been the one you’ve been going back and forth with on that one.


Nor have I made any predictions about him.

Once again, you’re losing.

You are obviously dead wrong and you were never a pitcher. If you were you were you would never make such an idiotic statement that "every pitcher cares who the catcher is". Typical of you. I repeat, most pitchers AT EVERY LEVEL, high school, college, pro. don't give a shit who their catcher is. I sure didn't.

You are embarrassing yourself now.

Just a genuinely stupid thing to say, makes no sense.

Typical “casual fan” take, leaning on your high school experience instead of watching and learning from professionals.

 

[AZ_]

The point I made is a simple one..for the final time. Most pitchers...as in 90% or more, at any level don't have a preferred catcher. They just don't. They call their own pitches by shaking off whenever they want and they throw it where they want. AZ thinks 100% of pitchers have a preferred catcher. That is pure bullshit.

Just making up numbers at this point.

Embarrassing for a former player like yourself, if you even played at all.



Real ball players know better.

 

[DJTJ]

Pretty sure pitchers want to make more money, and a guy who gets you more Ks with framing or is better at keeping dirt balls in front is probably preferred over a guy who doesn’t considering all of that directly relates to making more money.

 

[AZ_]

Pretty sure pitchers want to make more money, and a guy who gets you more Ks with framing or is better at keeping dirt balls in front is probably preferred over a guy who doesn’t considering all of that directly relates to making more money.

Could be, but on the other hand a guy standing on his little league playing experience made up a number that claims otherwise with no evidence.

Have to respect both sides of the argument —




He could give these professionals some pointers.

 

[petes999]

The point I made is a simple one..for the final time. Most pitchers...as in 90% or more, at any level don't have a preferred catcher. They just don't. They call their own pitches by shaking off whenever they want and they throw it where they want. AZ thinks 100% of pitchers have a preferred catcher. That is pure bullshit.

How many times do you see a pitcher shake the catcher off anymore???? Yes, it does happen but 5% or less of the time. Thus, it is the catcher calling 95% or more of the pitches. And, they get on the same page between innings and pre-game on how to attack each hitter (collaboration). I am sure Bieber plays more of a pre-game role with his catcher than a Bibee does. But, still pitch by pitch, the catcher controls most of it.

And, if a catcher doesn't know where the pitch is or where it is generally going or the type of pitch (curve/fastball), I assure you that the catcher is going to be moving his glove so much that it will affect 5% of balls and strike calls. Catchers are trained to know the spin and location to do subtle movements to bring a boarder line pitch back into the zone in their catching motion. The most obvious that most see is good catchers start from the dirt and bring a low knee pitch up to the zone. It would look high if he had to bring that all the way up to the belt at the last second as he called a low strike and the pitcher wanted to do his own thing and throw it high.