Browns 2021 Off-Season Thread

[Jack Brickman]

Everyone has bad takes. Nobody gets it right.

To pretend that anyone on here "knows how to evaluate QB play" is just disingenuous. It's hard as shit to evaluate, and nobody gets it right consistently.

I'll give credit to the people who can actually admit their mistakes.

Reminder: Basically everyone on this board was convinced that Josh Allen was the worst of the top five QBs that draft year, and a lot of people lost their shit when we drafted Mayfield first overall. The majority thought that Rosen and Darnold were the top two guys.

Point being, no one can accurately predict the QB position with any kind of consistency and that's always been the case.

 

[bob2the2nd]

The place someone was drafted doesn't tell us a whole lot, especially when there's bias involved. There were also draft pundits out there who had Hurts as a first-round QB last year.

Ultimately, there is a reason Dak Prescott wasn't a highly-rated QB prospect. Ultimately, there is a reason Russell Wilson wasn't a highly-rated QB prospect. Ultimately, there is a reason Tom Brady wasn't a highly-rated QB prospect. Ultimately, there's a reason every other team passed on Aaron Rodgers before Green Bay...

The list goes on. It's a crutch argument. You can put Jalen's college numbers up against anyone and he's not that far behind. Here's him vs Baker:

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The dude is mobile, accurate, coachable and a leader. I'm not betting against him. He'll likely struggle in Philly with their lack of offensive line, and coaching regime changes. He might even fail. But I'm not going to quickly dismiss him.

Yeah as an oklahoma fan im familiar with the 2 of them. I dont pretend to be an NFL scout, but i can tell you that the difference in a feel for the game between Hurts and Baker is enormous. There is a reason that Hurts was run off from Alabama and why i dont think he would have survived more than 1 year at oklahoma. As I said Hurts on paper looks absolutely fantastic, but ultimately there is a reason there are knocks against him. Yes absolutely there are some players that perform better than where they fall in the draft. However we can also say that in the last 10+ years the likelihood of a non-first/very early 2nd round QB succeeding in the NFL is absolutely incredibly low. Generally if a team feels as though a QB has a decent chance of becoming an NFL starter he is going to go in the first round. Is this the end-all be all of the QB, no way in hell. But it does show a very steep mountain that needs to be climbed.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Reminder: Basically everyone on this board was convinced that Josh Allen was the worst of the top five QBs that draft year, and a lot of people lost their shit when we drafted Mayfield first overall. The majority thought that Rosen and Darnold were the top two guys.

Point being, no one can accurately predict the QB position with any kind of consistency and that's always been the case.

For sure. Heck, I thought Herbert was a sure-fire bust this past draft. I was lambasting the Chargers for ruining what I thought was a potential contender by drafting him.

Prospects change and develop, and their situation has more impact on their success than any of us like to admit.

I'm going to end up thinking that QB's can develop accuracy, like Allen and Herbert did. I'm going to think that athletic QB's who lack consistency at the college level can be awesome pros, like Mahomes, Allen, Herbert, etc. I'm going to think that runners like Lamar Jackson can dominate the league without really developing as a passer. Then as soon as I start to evaluate prospects with these new things in mind, I'm going to look like a complete ass and everything's going to change again

 

[Malacogary]

I watched quite a bit of Wentz this year - he gave me 2019 Baker vibes. Lots of hitching and second-guessing, not trusting his eyes, and panicking in the pocket. The Eagles having their o-line decimated by injuries certainly didn't help.

The Colts offer a chance to turn things around. Strong defense and strong o-line can bring him back. Of course - assuming he's not too broken.

I think Wentz is irredeemable. I think he does nothing to improve the Colts. He's a actually a downgrade from the 2020 version of Philip Rivers and I can see him costing them at least two games a season for as long as he stays there.

 

[MD13]

After all of the ego battles between coaches, FOs and ownership, Stefanski is a breath of fresh air.

 

[NorthCoastBias]

Honestly can't wait to see how the offense evolves from what we saw last season.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I'll give credit to the people who can actually admit their mistakes.

Also give credit to people who admit to uncertainty when they make their predictions in the first place, and don't put down others who disagree.

 

[MikeOC33]

Scheme evolution:"We will steal from everybody if it's a good idea."

The NFL. Where plagiarism will get you a raise and a promotion.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Also give credit to people who admit to uncertainty when they make their predictions in the first place, and don't put down others who disagree.

I'm sure this is directed at something specific.

I agree wholeheartedly to the first part. I'm about as wishy-washy and full of disclaimers as it comes.

I have a sneaking suspicion you're conflating someone criticizing a bad take for having no substance to back it up with "putting down others who disagree," but I guess you'll have to be less obtuse before anyone can come to that conclusion.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I'm sure this is directed at something specific.

I agree wholeheartedly to the first part. I'm about as wishy-washy and full of disclaimers as it comes.

I have a sneaking suspicion you're conflating someone criticizing a bad take for having no substance to back it up with "putting down others who disagree," but I guess you'll have to be less obtuse before anyone can come to that conclusion.

No. My point is that a lot of people give their opinions during the draft and tell anyone who disagrees with their conclusion that they don't know what they're talking about. That's common, and not directed at any one person. It would just be kind of nice if there was a bit of humility upfront, and an acknowledgement of the inexact nature of the entire process.

The most common reason for that is a kind of tunnel vision, where people somehow convince themselves that looking at some highlights and reading blurbs somehow makes them a quasi-expert. It doesn't. Even if you watch every snap of a player (although you still miss all of the practices....),there's a reason teams have larger scouting departments, and why even FO/scouting guys on the same team on a player can come to different conclusions despite having watched the exact same film.

Half the pissing contests on the board in general are between people who refuse to recognize that.

 

[Vee-Rex]

Also give credit to people who admit to uncertainty when they make their predictions in the first place, and don't put down others who disagree.

I think one of my pet peeves are the definitive, all-conclusive predictions/assertions and the subsequent put-down on anyone who has a different perspective. I'm pretty sure I've been guilty of this myself, and nothing really gets me fired up more than seeing this done pretty regularly. I try my best to use "IMO/IMHO/I believe/I think" as much as possible.

 

[Man Called X]

No. My point is that a lot of people give their opinions during the draft and tell anyone who disagrees with their conclusion that they don't know what they're talking about. That's common, and not directed at any one person. It would just be kind of nice if there was a bit of humility upfront, and an acknowledgement of the inexact nature of the entire process.

The most common reason for that is a kind of tunnel vision, where people somehow convince themselves that looking at some highlights and reading blurbs somehow makes them a quasi-expert. It doesn't. Even if you watch every snap of a player (although you still miss all of the practices....),there's a reason teams have larger scouting departments, and why even FO/scouting guys on the same team on a player can come to different conclusions despite having watched the exact same film.

Half the pissing contests on the board in general are between people who refuse to recognize that.

It'd be a lot easier if people just accepted that I'm right.

 

[Bkerr02]

Kyle Rudolph was just released. I assume we would have some interest there

 

[bigfoot5415]

Kyle Rudolph was just released. I assume we would have some interest there

I was thinking the same thing. If we move Njoku for an asset, it may be a net savings plus fit the scheme a little better.

That being said Njoku did a hell of a job when asked this year. I could actually see him being resigned with the intention of moving on from Hooper at some point.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I was thinking the same thing. If we move Njoku for an asset, it may be a net savings plus fit the scheme a little better.

That being said Njoku did a hell of a job when asked this year. I could actually see him being resigned with the intention of moving on from Hooper at some point.

Given how much Njoku improved as a blocker, I'd be happy to keep him. Dude also made some big catches for us and is a one of a kind athlete at the TE position who can high point the ball and make contested catches.

I know he asked for a trade last year, but perhaps we shouldn't be so quick to run guys like him out of town?