BROWNS OFF-SEASON 2020

[CBBI]

We are talking pick 97 or 115. This is right on the top 100 range. The only way i would work a new contract with williams is if there were easy cuts after the first year and 2nd year. Because 100% without him having played in a year an a half i dont think its automatically worth a contract extension

You're also assuming that Trent Williams, who has literally already proven he's willing to sit out and simply not play football if he's unhappy with his situation, is even going to report to a new team without a new contract.

I just think that's wrong to assume.

 

[Surge]

Just had to look up Trent Williams age. I thought he was an old guy but he's only 31.

For comparison, Brandon Weeden is 36 right now but was drafted 2 years after Williams.

 

[bob2the2nd]

You're also assuming that Trent Williams, who has literally already proven he's willing to sit out and simply not play football if he's unhappy with his situation, is even going to report to a new team without a new contract.

I just think that's wrong to assume.

But teams arent allowed to talk to him about it, which is what reduces his draft value. Teams have no idea what they are trading for. Which is why that 97 and preferably 115 is what i feel like the browns should be willing to give up

 

[DJTJ]

But teams arent allowed to talk to him about it, which is what reduces his draft value. Teams have no idea what they are trading for. Which is why that 97 and preferably 115 is what i feel like the browns should be willing to give up

teams were allowed to discuss directly with his agent up until, I believe, Monday or Tuesday.

Teams should 100% know what they’re getting from a comp/salary perspective.

medicals in the other hand...

 

[bob2the2nd]

teams were allowed to discuss directly with his agent up until, I believe, Monday or Tuesday.

Teams should 100% know what they’re getting from a comp/salary perspective.

medicals in the other hand...

good to know. I thought the redskins had just shut down everyone

 

[DJTJ]

good to know. I thought the redskins had just shut down everyone

they did, but it wasn’t until this week.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Just had to look up Trent Williams age. I thought he was an old guy but he's only 31.

For comparison, Brandon Weeden is 36 right now but was drafted 2 years after Williams.

31 is old for an NFL player.

Of course, that doesn't mean he still can't be effective for several more years.

 

[FrontPageNews]

31 is old for an NFL player.

Of course, that doesn't mean he still can't be effective for several more years.

top level offensive lineman play into their mid 30s so I’m not too worried about his age.

 

[prf100]

top level offensive lineman play into their mid 30s so I’m not too worried about his age.

I'm much more concerned about him not playing for an entire year. It's not a physical concern though - more concerned about his motivation.

 

[Binkster]

Williams just scares the shit out of me. I worry that he's a guy just looking for one last payday, and then he'll just get fat and lazy as soon as that deal is signed. Really not looking forward to having another Keith Hernandez situation.

That's why - to me - you absolutely do not overextend yourself in any negotiations - trade, contract, or otherwise. Hardline, take it or leave it offers only. You can't afford to tie significant money or assets to a guy who hasn't played and is on the wrong side of 30.

All that said, I absolutely take a chance on him for the right price. He's one of the best (if not THE best) tackles in football when he's right. To me, that's worth a mid-round pick and a reasonable contract with a built-in escape clause.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

His injury and holdout was bizarre, but....

That's right where I stop. He's a 31 year old guy who chose to sit out an entire season, basically over money. A 31 year old player has to have a love for the game if you expect his performance not to drop, and guys who love playing the game don't do what he did. Now maybe we trade assets for him, give him a huge guarantee, and place all our faith in him for this upcoming season, and he comes through. Or maybe he doesn't, and we're screwed completely at that position. Maybe he's just looking for the cash, or maybe he's let himself go physically and is now more likely to be injured.

Especially when we can't meet with him, or give him a pre-trade exam to see where he is at physically, I don't want to put any significant assets into acquiring him. I just don't think that's a position where we should roll the dice to the degree inherent in acquiring Williams. Maybe the Browns feel differently and a deal gets done...but he still scares me.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

That's why - to me - you absolutely do not overextend yourself in any negotiations - trade, contract, or otherwise. Hardline, take it or leave it offers only. You can't afford to tie significant money or assets to a guy who hasn't played and is on the wrong side of 30.

Unless we already have a deal worked out with Williams and his agent that is acceptable, we can't trade for him.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

That's right where I stop. He's a 31 year old guy who chose to sit out an entire season, basically over money. A 31 year old player has to have a love for the game if you expect his performance not to drop, and guys who love playing the game don't do what he did. Now maybe we trade assets for him, give him a huge guarantee, and place all our faith in him for this upcoming season, and he comes through. Or maybe he doesn't, and we're screwed completely at that position. Maybe he's just looking for the cash, or maybe he's let himself go physically and is now more likely to be injured.

Especially when we can't meet with him, or give him a pre-trade exam to see where he is at physically, I don't want to put any significant assets into acquiring him. I just don't think that's a position where we should roll the dice to the degree inherent in acquiring Williams. Maybe the Browns feel differently and a deal gets done...but he still scares me.

Not being able to negotiate or do physicals is a major issue in regards to Williams.

He was already known to have some medical issues that the Redskins were very hush hush about. He sat out an entire year, and we have no idea what kind of shape he's in due to the coronavirus situation.

Under normal circumstances, I'd say if you could get him on a 3 year deal that's front loaded, averaged around $15-$18 mill per, with the last year non-guaranteed, I'm making a deal and seeing what happens. He could be off the books by the time all of these upcoming extensions hit and would provide a gap to let us draft someone in the later rounds to develop or aim to take a long-term solution in a year or two.

While him sitting out last could be an issue, there's a chance it could also mean that he's healthier than he's been in a while due to being away from the grind. Unfortunately there's no real way for us to know that at this point.

 

[Kbiz]

That's right where I stop. He's a 31 year old guy who chose to sit out an entire season, basically over money. A 31 year old player has to have a love for the game if you expect his performance not to drop, and guys who love playing the game don't do what he did. Now maybe we trade assets for him, give him a huge guarantee, and place all our faith in him for this upcoming season, and he comes through. Or maybe he doesn't, and we're screwed completely at that position. Maybe he's just looking for the cash, or maybe he's let himself go physically and is now more likely to be injured.

Especially when we can't meet with him, or give him a pre-trade exam to see where he is at physically, I don't want to put any significant assets into acquiring him. I just don't think that's a position where we should roll the dice to the degree inherent in acquiring Williams. Maybe the Browns feel differently and a deal gets done...but he still scares me.

I get this point but it is safe to say Dan Snyder is the worst owner in the league and risks his own players safety for the bottom line. Williams had a cancerous growth that he brought up to team doctors for years and they ignored it and told him it was nothing to worry about. An experience like that would suck out any love you have for the organization you play for. I am not sure that can be confused with losing his passion for the game. The problem is we won't know the answer to that question until he is with a new team.

With that said, we've also drafted our fair share of rookies who, on the surface had all the athletic ability, but no passion to get better.

We all assume that our FO would do enough diligence to get a solid understanding of one's passion for the game but history shows that isn't the case. I have a lot more faith in this FO than in past years but until Berry has a few wins under his belt, who really has any idea how competent this FO is.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I get this point but it is safe to say Dan Snyder is the worst owner in the league and risks his own players safety for the bottom line. Williams had a cancerous growth that he brought up to team doctors for years and they ignored it and told him it was nothing to worry about. An experience like that would suck out any love you have for the organization you play for. I am not sure that can be confused with losing his passion for the game. The problem is we won't know the answer to that question until he is with a new team.

We do know that he was willing to play for the Skins despite the injury issue as long as they were willing to pay him more money. And we know that money is still the holdup with him getting traded. I mean, it certainly makes Williams sound better if the issue was medical mistreatment rather than money, and that's why that's the story his agent spins. But the bottom line with them both is the money.

With that said, we've also drafted our fair share of rookies who, on the surface had all the athletic ability, but no passion to get better.
We all assume that our FO would do enough diligence to get a solid understanding of one's passion for the game but history shows that isn't the case. I have a lot more faith in this FO than in past years but until Berry has a few wins under his belt, who really has any idea how competent this FO is.

It's the lack on in-person contact and examination that makes Williams so risky. At least the rookies played very recently, were available at the combine, etc..