(No Longer) Joe Woods’ Defense

[Bob_The_Cat]

It was happening throughout the game, though. JOK and Delpit were arguing in one play on a 3rd and 8 completion. There was a 3rd and 4 (about 7 minutes left to go) where Emerson and Harrison both took the same guy and Garrett Wilson simply dropped the wide open pass, leading to a Jets punt.

Then after the Brissett sack on the Jets next drive Flacco wildly overthrew Corey Davis towards the sideline on a 3rd and 8, where Newsome + Emerson screwed up the communication and both took the flat. Jets punted with 2 and a half minutes left, we came down and scored.

There are other moments throughout the game too. Our defense was completely clueless.

We’re not talking about the entire game here. Also, I’ve already said multiple times I’m not a big fan of Woods. We’re talking about a single play where it seems only two guys don’t know what they’re doing, then they both just stand there and watch the ball sail through the air when they may have been able to run the WR down. Maybe they’re both doing what they’re supposed to do, but make a fucking effort to go run the guy down when you see no one is there.

If you’re a DL and you get beat badly/are out of position on a running play, you don’t just stop and watch the RB go running down the field. You run and try to chase down the RB because you never know what might happen. Maybe you’re the last line of defense when the RB cuts back. Maybe you can punch the ball out from behind. You just never know.

Maybe there was miscommunication. Maybe Woods called a shit defense. We’re never going to fully know that. However, we can clearly see neither guy even tried on the play, and making a slight extra effort could’ve won the game despite the other afformentioned issues.

 

[Real Deal]

I just need to know why in the fuck are we calling a cover 2 zone, protecting the flats when we should really be daring them to take the 10 yards under the coverage to erase precious seconds. It's football 101 and we fucked the game because Woods was inept. Few can blame the players all they want, I put this one on the coach.

You're at risk over the top on a cover 2, especially with our weird play on that side of the ball out of the shoot. There should've been some football 101 basic prevent shit going on while they kill seconds off the clock, hope they go over the middle and we get the tackle in bounds, then tighten up in the redzone. It's truly unbelievable the more and more you think about it.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Whole lot of game threads end in complaints about a straight-forward cover four prevent defense at the end of games... now same people are mad that the call was something besides a straight forward cover four with less than two minutes to go...

...Funny.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Whole lot of game threads end in complaints about a straight-forward cover four prevent defense at the end of games... now same people are mad that the call was something besides a straight forward cover four with less than two minutes to go...

...Funny.

I still don't think the 3rd and 10 where Wilson scored to win the game is excusable and haven't heard an excuse yet for it.

You can't give the offense "Have your #1 receiver beat a linebacker and you win the game." That's too easy.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I still don't think the 3rd and 10 where Wilson scored to win the game is excusable and haven't heard an excuse yet for it.

You can't give the offense "Have your #1 receiver beat a linebacker and you win the game." That's too easy.

Can't disagree - Jets schemed Wilson open, if the Browns were in the wrong defense for that offensive alignment, call a time out. Game is on the line.

 

[Bkerr02]

I knew woods was a dumb fuck last year when we punted and backed the patriots up at the half yard line and this dipshit trots out a nickel defense against there heavy package

 

[CBBI]

The point is, those guys aren’t rookies, nor are they new to the team. They’ve played plenty of NFL football. They’ve played for the same D co-ordinator for multiple years. Everyone else knew what they were supposed to be doing. The odds of whatever play being run in that situation being some new scheme they’ve never ran is slim-to-none.

You're kind of making my point for me.

If experienced and talented players are out there confused about what they are supposed to be doing on a given play, that IMO falls even more on coaching because these are guys who have shown in the past they can handle more than a typical head spinning rookie.

There should never be a situation literally ever when one (or more) of the 11 guys on the field simply has no clue what he's supposed to be doing.

That is on coaching. It should never happen.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

You're kind of making my point for me.

If experienced and talented players are out there confused about what they are supposed to be doing on a given play, that IMO falls even more on coaching because these are guys who have shown in the past they can handle more than a typical head spinning rookie.

There should never be a situation literally ever when one (or more) of the 11 guys on the field simply has no clue what he's supposed to be doing.

That is on coaching. It should never happen.

No, I’m really not. I just think it’s weird the players are getting completely absolved of wrong doing in this situation.

Players have mental lapses all the time. Are we just here to suddenly believe that players playing in the same defense for multiple seasons don’t know where they’re supposed to go because it’s a new season? Doesn’t make any sense. The logical assumption out of that would be either they heard different play calls, they didn’t communicate on the field/made a poor read, or they got lazy. Only so much of that can be attributed to the coach. The players still need to execute.

My point is no one wants to blame the players apparently, when despite a shit call, it looked pretty clear from the tape that if Ward or Delpit simply made an effort to run after the WR once the ball was thrown, they probably could’ve at least tackled him or forced him out of bounds prior to reaching the end zone. Instead, they were both damn near walking when the pass wound up being under thrown and the WR had to slow down to make the catch.

That’s all I’m saying. They compounded an error by not making any effort, and to me that’s way worse than a miscommunication problem (or whatever the fuck happened).

 

[CBBI]

No, I’m really not. I just think it’s weird the players are getting completely absolved of wrong doing in this situation.

Players have mental lapses all the time. Are we just here to suddenly believe that players playing in the same defense for multiple seasons don’t know where they’re supposed to go because it’s a new season? Doesn’t make any sense. The logical assumption out of that would be either they heard different play calls, they didn’t communicate on the field/made a poor read, or they got lazy. Only so much of that can be attributed to the coach. The players still need to execute.

My point is no one wants to blame the players apparently, when despite a shit call, it looked pretty clear from the tape that if Ward or Delpit simply made an effort to run after the WR once the ball was thrown, they probably could’ve at least tackled him or forced him out of bounds prior to reaching the end zone. Instead, they were both damn near walking when the pass wound up being under thrown and the WR had to slow down to make the catch.

That’s all I’m saying. They compounded an error by not making any effort, and to me that’s way worse than a miscommunication problem (or whatever the fuck happened).

Oh god no man. No one is absolving the players of anything. Ward and Delpit and Newsome and Johnson and every other guy who has been responsible for these busts deserve every piece of criticism they get.

But they're also all talented players with experience, so what's the common denominator? IMO it's coaching.

 

[Real Deal]

If Ward is told cover 2, he automatically knows his job, which is the flat. There's no 'if' Ward ran with the WR and made effort, Ward is going with the shit play call and doing his job (the flat). Why coach is putting his guys in position to 1 on 1 coverage on a deep out is beyond me. Life is so simple when you have a 13 point lead and the opposing team has 0 timeouts. Dime cover 4 or some man up and safety deep. Send only 4 and hope Myles can disrupt the QB. That was literally the worst play to call. If they are going to score, let them work for it against the prevent. Let the score come after 4 or 5 plays. That way there's only 20-30 secs left if they recover the onside kick.

 

[Ohio]

Whole lot of game threads end in complaints about a straight-forward cover four prevent defense at the end of games... now same people are mad that the call was something besides a straight forward cover four with less than two minutes to go...

...Funny.

Playing defense in a one score game in that situation is a whole lot different than playing defense in a two score game.

When you're up multiple scores in that situation, it calls for true Schottenheimer prevent defense. Simply don't get beat deep, give them their 10-15 yard completions and make them burn clock. You're playing the clock more than anything else. Literally the only thing you can't do is let them score right away by beating you deep. And, well....we all know what happened.

Denzel Ward (or literally anyone else for that matter) being responsible for the flat in that situation is a fireable offence in and of itself. Who gives a flying fuck about the flat when you're up 13 with 1:55 to go? You should want the offense to throw in the flat in that situation. The fact we were wasting a body, let alone our best DB, in the flat in that situation is inexcusable.

The more I digest this game, the more I place the blame on coaching. A casual Madden player could have called a better defense in this game. This is a double digit victory if the Browns do nothing but play 2 man under the entire game. The Jets did absolutely nothing to win this game; the Browns lost it completely on their own. It's sickening.

 

[Triplethreat]

Whole lot of game threads end in complaints about a straight-forward cover four prevent defense at the end of games... now same people are mad that the call was something besides a straight forward cover four with less than two minutes to go...

...Funny.

Those complaints happen when you’re not up 13 with 1:30 left…

..not funny at all

 

[Deezus]

Whole lot of game threads end in complaints about a straight-forward cover four prevent defense at the end of games... now same people are mad that the call was something besides a straight forward cover four with less than two minutes to go...

...Funny.

oh come on… speaking for myself, but I get pissed at prevent/cover 4 when the game is on the line and they just let the opposition drive straight down the field. When you’re up by 13 with 1:30 left, play the damn prevent.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

oh come on… speaking for myself, but I get pissed at prevent/cover 4 when the game is on the line and they just let the opposition drive straight down the field. When you’re up by 13 with 1:30 left, play the damn prevent.

Right, the strategy isn’t the same based on the situation. Up 13, under two minutes, and no timeouts. Just let the other team catch the ball in front of you and keep them inbounds. There’s not enough time on the clock for them to win unless you give up multiple big plays/a quick touchdown.

 

[Deezus]

Right, the strategy isn’t the same based on the situation. Up 13, under two minutes, and no timeouts. Just let the other team catch the ball in front of you and keep them inbounds. There’s not enough time on the clock for them to win unless you give up multiple big plays/a quick touchdown.

It’s almost like variables matter and blanket statements are dumb…