Poll for Decision on Rosario...

[KluberSociety]

In these kind of samples, for Rocchio I am looking more at BB / K rates (because these are an effective early indicator at a player getting overmatched at a new level) and assuming the other numbers are more likely to make their way back closer to his norms. Seeing that he is doing just fine in that it seems he has made the transition just fine, and while he was only a 114 wRC+ in AA, he can probably achieve something similar in AAA with his current skillset. If he's able to build on this with a solid contact profile he might be ready for MLB action mid-2023.

I know @CDAV45 already called out the cherry picking of Arias's stats but it's pretty bad for Rocchio too.

 

[Gson]

In these kind of samples, for Rocchio I am looking more at BB / K rates (because these are an effective early indicator at a player getting overmatched at a new level) and assuming the other numbers are more likely to make their way back closer to his norms. Seeing that he is doing just fine in that it seems he has made the transition just fine, and while he was only a 114 wRC+ in AA, he can probably achieve something similar in AAA with his current skillset. If he's able to build on this with a solid contact profile he might be ready for MLB action mid-2023.

I know @CDAV45 already called out the cherry picking of Arias's stats but it's pretty bad for Rocchio too.

or sooner than mid 2023...

 

[KluberSociety]

or sooner than mid 2023...

Yeah I think if he had to, he could but I honestly don't see him getting called up before estimated Super 2 cutoff, just because we already have enough other options that we still haven't got a huge look at (Arias, Freeman). I think we'd rather get an extended look at those 2 before rushing Rocchio up.

 

[CDAV45]

Yeah I think if he had to, he could but I honestly don't see him getting called up before estimated Super 2 cutoff, just because we already have enough other options that we still haven't got a huge look at (Arias, Freeman). I think we'd rather get an extended look at those 2 before rushing Rocchio up.

Worst case scenario is that Gimenez has to slide over to SS while one of Freeman or Miller occupy 2B for as long as it takes Arias and Rocchio to finish polishing their skillset in Columbus. Personally I think I don't foresee all of Arias, Freeman, Rocchio, Miller and whoever else not claiming a spot from the start.

 

[Lee]

Worst case scenario is that Gimenez has to slide over to SS while one of Freeman or Miller occupy 2B for as long as it takes Arias and Rocchio to finish polishing their skillset in Columbus. Personally I think I don't foresee all of Arias, Freeman, Rocchio, Miller and whoever else not claiming a spot from the start.

If it is Arias as middle infielder, arent we better with Gimenez at short and Arias at 2nd too?

 

[Gson]

If it is Arias as middle infielder, arent we better with Gimenez at short and Arias at 2nd too?

after watching Arias at 2B.. there could be some value to this comment.. perhaps they can remain interchangeable (ss for 2b and the reverse).. It would be very difficult to decide to move Gimenez off of second base at this point.. he's sooooo good at it..

 

[Lee]

after watching Arias at 2B.. there could be some value to this comment.. perhaps they can remain interchangeable (ss for 2b and the reverse).. It would be very difficult to decide to move Gimenez off of second base at this point.. he's sooooo good at it..

Yeah but Bimbo said he is a plus, plus defender at short also. I hare moving Giminez because he is an all star and gold glover at 2nd, but he might be that at short too.

Just think Arias might not be a middle infielder at the bigs, he might end up in the 1B mix and the Miller role at all infield positions. I think his bat comes along, but what do i know, lol

 

[Gson]

Yeah but Bimbo said he is a plus, plus defender at short also. I hare moving Giminez because he is an all star and gold glover at 2nd, but he might be that at short too.

Just think Arias might not be a middle infielder at the bigs, he might end up in the 1B mix and the Miller role at all infield positions. I think his bat comes along, but what do i know, lol

what you know?.. there was a note on that earlier in this forum thread.. some form/type of expertise of some kind.. I didn't follow completely there...

But. back to the question at hand.. he could be considered in that Miller role and or 1B.... but...

1B seems like an awful waste of that great arm..

-he's not going to move Hosey..
-that leaves corner OF.. and specifically RF..

thoughts?

 

[BimboColesHair]

Yeah but Bimbo said he is a plus, plus defender at short also. I hare moving Giminez because he is an all star and gold glover at 2nd, but he might be that at short too.

Just think Arias might not be a middle infielder at the bigs, he might end up in the 1B mix and the Miller role at all infield positions. I think his bat comes along, but what do i know, lol

I cannot state this enough for how some people are viewing his defensive struggles since he's been re-called.

It is incredibly hard to go from one side of the infield to the other defensively. It's why you aren't seeing Gimenez move to SS games where Rosario is out of the lineup, and instead watching them opt for a weaker SS in Freeman a handful of times.

Arias without a doubt can be a middle infielder at the bigs, but this early into his time as a utility guy bouncing to all 4 spots defensively in the infield in a given week, growing pains are expected. It's not an easy thing to do for most players used to one side of the diamond.

These 8 games he's played do nothing to change the 3000 innings of plus defense at SS he has played in his career.

 

[Lee]

I cannot state this enough for how some people are viewing his defensive struggles since he's been re-called.

It is incredibly hard to go from one side of the infield to the other defensively. It's why you aren't seeing Gimenez move to SS games where Rosario is out of the lineup, and instead watching them opt for a weaker SS in Freeman a handful of times.

Arias without a doubt can be a middle infielder at the bigs, but this early into his time as a utility guy bouncing to all 4 spots defensively in the infield in a given week, growing pains are expected. It's not an easy thing to do for most players used to one side of the diamond.

These 8 games he's played do nothing to change the 3000 innings of plus defense at SS he has played in his career.

Thanks for correcting me, you should of highlighted the what do I know part, lol.

My only issue with Arias is that there are so many incredible defenders behind him, but he does seem to have a very rare level of power for the SS position. I know its hard to guess production because Jose was unpredictable based off of minor league, and so was Kwan.

Over the last couple of years, because of this forum, I am trying to learn minor league to major better, not something I did in the past. Giminez is proof that sometimes these kids just suddenly put it together and never give up on a good prospect.

 

[BimboColesHair]

Thanks for correcting me, you should of highlighted the what do I know part, lol.

My only issue with Arias is that there are so many incredible defenders behind him, but he does seem to have a very rare level of power for the SS position. I know its hard to guess production because Jose was unpredictable based off of minor league, and so was Kwan.

Over the last couple of years, because of this forum, I am trying to learn minor league to major better, not something I did in the past. Giminez is proof that sometimes these kids just suddenly put it together and never give up on a good prospect.

I don't think you are incorrect if all you are watching is what the guy has been doing at the MLB level. He has not been good defensively since he's come back, so you aren't wrong. Just the context needs to be taken into account, as well as the other 99.9% of innings defensively he has played in his professional career that most fans did not see a single second of.

And there is only one really good defensive SS prospect behind him, and that is Rocchio.

The other ones (Freeman, Martinez, Tena) are better at 2B than they are at SS.

And the easiest thing I can tell people just getting into following their favorite teams' minor leagues and prospects coming up and how they could impact the MLB team in the future is this. Pay attention to how prospects fare in AA. If they have instant success, if they struggle and have to repeat, or if they all of a sudden suck. The only call up with a bigger jump in player quality than A ball to AA is the jump to the MLB. AA is the most predictive minor league level for MLB success or failure.

 

[sportscoach]

I don't think you are incorrect if all you are watching is what the guy has been doing at the MLB level. He has not been good defensively since he's come back, so you aren't wrong. Just the context needs to be taken into account, as well as the other 99.9% of innings defensively he has played in his professional career that most fans did not see a single second of.

And there is only one really good defensive SS prospect behind him, and that is Rocchio.

The other ones (Freeman, Martinez, Tena) are better at 2B than they are at SS.

And the easiest thing I can tell people just getting into following their favorite teams' minor leagues and prospects coming up and how they could impact the MLB team in the future is this. Pay attention to how prospects fare in AA. If they have instant success, if they struggle and have to repeat, or if they all of a sudden suck. The only call up with a bigger jump in player quality than A ball to AA is the jump to the MLB. AA is the most predictive minor league level for MLB success or failure.

I feel like anymore, if you have solid production at AA, you will get a chance in the bigs normally barring injury...

I always had Arias on the left side of the Diamond, he plays better on that side, in my mind. He is making some errors though that he should be making. You think that's just the pressure of trying to impress in the bigs?

 

[Lee]

I don't think you are incorrect if all you are watching is what the guy has been doing at the MLB level. He has not been good defensively since he's come back, so you aren't wrong. Just the context needs to be taken into account, as well as the other 99.9% of innings defensively he has played in his professional career that most fans did not see a single second of.

And there is only one really good defensive SS prospect behind him, and that is Rocchio.

The other ones (Freeman, Martinez, Tena) are better at 2B than they are at SS.

And the easiest thing I can tell people just getting into following their favorite teams' minor leagues and prospects coming up and how they could impact the MLB team in the future is this. Pay attention to how prospects fare in AA. If they have instant success, if they struggle and have to repeat, or if they all of a sudden suck. The only call up with a bigger jump in player quality than A ball to AA is the jump to the MLB. AA is the most predictive minor league level for MLB success or failure.

Thanks, that is great insight. I rarely even look at minor league stats. 162 games at the pro level plus playoffs (yeah Guardians) and all the minor league stuff, plus all my other sports, and prioritizing work AND my kids (or kid, my daughter is off in college, so now i have to follow U of Arizona's awful football team, lol)

I am trying to learn, but really use this place as a short cut, and seem to learn something every day, but huge insight into the AA thing, thanks again.

 

[CDAV45]

I feel like anymore, if you have solid production at AA, you will get a chance in the bigs normally barring injury...

I always had Arias on the left side of the Diamond, he plays better on that side, in my mind. He is making some errors though that he should be making. You think that's just the pressure of trying to impress in the bigs?

I'll take it a step further because it has happened and I expect it to become even more frequent. I think a dominant AA player doesn't need to play a single game in AAA. The talent is piled up in AA. It seems to be the place with the most talented, youngest players.

 

[CDAV45]

Sorry, wrong place.