WWE/NXT/AEW/NJPW Thread

[pr26]

Welp, I’m excited for dynamite tonight despite fantasy booking of doom going on here. Hoping for an All Out main event swerve in front of a hot Chicago crowd. Crossing my fingers for an MJF appearance. Also, Kingston vs Ishi on the pre-show is gonna slap hard on Sunday.

 

[Derek]

I don't even think it's gonna be that.

I think Moxley's gonna come out for his title celebration thing tonight and Punk's gonna come out limping or in a boot, or maybe even on crutches to sell it even harder, and say even though he's clearly not 100%, he desperately wants to give his hometown fans a show, so he's asking for his rematch this weekend in Chicago.

Moxley's gonna accept and I think Punk is just going to beat him clean in a longer match and end up being the triumphant babyface hero in his hometown.

Which, if that does happen, is going to make the Dynamite unification decision that much more silly and useless.

I know you think this because it’s in Chicago, but Punk has been full on heel since he returned. He may very well win and get cheered at All Out, but it seems highly unlikely that it’s the clean, triumphant babyface victory you’re predicting.

Did you see the look on his face when Mox was celebrating and the fans were going crazy?

 

[CBBI]

I know you think this because it’s in Chicago, but Punk has been full on heel since he returned. He may very well win and get cheered at All Out, but it seems highly unlikely that it’s the clean, triumphant babyface victory you’re predicting.

Except he hasn't

He ran in to save a group of babyfaces from a heel beatdown in his surprise return on 8/10. Hardly a heel move.

The next week he came out, cut a promo, and ultimately went into business for himself with a stupid remark about Page. But the fact that Punk is a moody, abrasive prick in his real life and has no hesitation to use opt for that "worked shoot" bullshit into his storyline promos doesn't mean he's been a heel in storyline.

The next week he lost a title match after getting "injured" and did a big sympathetic injury exit. Not a cartoonish stretcher job like MJF did.

It also just so happened, through no fault of Punk's own mind you, that Khan opted to put the interim title on a babyface while Punk was out. That wasn't a booking decision that had to be made. If Punk doesn't get hurt, his first challenger in Chicago of all places was almost assuredly not going to be babyface Moxley, right?

 

[Derek]

Except he hasn't

He ran in to save a group of babyfaces from a heel beatdown in his surprise return on 8/10. Hardly a heel move.

The next week he came out, cut a promo, and ultimately went into business for himself with a stupid remark about Page. But the fact that Punk is a moody, abrasive prick in his real life and has no hesitation to use opt for that "worked shoot" bullshit into his storyline promos doesn't mean he's been a heel in storyline.

The next week he lost a title match after getting "injured" and did a big sympathetic injury exit. Not a cartoonish stretcher job like MJF did.

It also just so happened, through no fault of Punk's own mind you, that Khan opted to put the interim title on a babyface while Punk was out. That wasn't a booking decision that had to be made. If Punk doesn't get hurt, his first challenger in Chicago of all places was almost assuredly not going to be babyface Moxley, right?

Man, we are interpreting these events very differently.

If they do the finish you’re predicting, I’ll criticize them, as will the majority of fans. I just haven’t seen any evidence that they’d go that direction.

 

[CBBI]

Man, we are interpreting these events very differently.

If they do the finish you’re predicting, I’ll criticize them, as will the majority of fans. I just haven’t seen any evidence that they’d go that direction.

I also think the amount of people who knew or even understood in the moment that Punk was delivering a "verbal receipt" to Page or has been "acting heel" on the mic by making worked shoot references about Moxley and Kingston is so small that it certainly isn't an audience that Khan should be trying to cater to.

I get that AEW is a "smart" crowd, but the amount of people who are plugged in to everything that's actually happening is a lot smaller than you seem to think.

People like Punk because he speaks like a real person would speak. He's quick on his feet and will throw zingers like a normal person would do in that situation. He has always felt very unscripted in a sea of scripted lines and predetermined storylines and angles. Of course wrestling isn't real, but emotionally you want it to feel real and Punk does that as good as anyone in the business.

When people hear Punk say "Eddie Kingston is the third best Eddie and second best Kingston I've ever been in the ring with" their immediate reaction is "Oh shit, he's talking about Eddie Guerrero and Kofi Kingston. Those guys are both awesome. He burned Eddie Kingston's ass!"

They certainly don't think "Oh my god why is babyface CM Punk taking an unprompted pot shot at fellow babyface Eddie Kingston who can't even verbally defend himself because he's been suspended in real life due to a backstage incident?! What an asshole! He must be a heel now!"

They laugh and pop at the zinger because it was a good zinger.

 

[Derek]

I also think the amount of people who knew or even understood in the moment that Punk was delivering a "verbal receipt" to Page or has been "acting heel" on the mic by making worked shoot references about Moxley and Kingston is so small that it certainly isn't an audience that Khan should be trying to cater to.

I get that AEW is a "smart" crowd, but the amount of people who are plugged in to everything that's actually happening is a lot smaller than you seem to think.

People like Punk because he speaks like a real person would speak. He's quick on his feet and will throw zingers like a normal person would do in that situation. He has always felt very unscripted in a sea of scripted lines and predetermined storylines and angles. Of course wrestling isn't real, but emotionally you want it to feel real and Punk does that as good as anyone in the business.

When people hear Punk say "Eddie Kingston is the third best Eddie and second best Kingston I've ever been in the ring with" their immediate reaction is "Oh shit, he's talking about Eddie Guerrero and Kofi Kingston. Those guys are both awesome. He burned Eddie Kingston's ass!"

They certainly don't think "Oh my god why is babyface CM Punk taking an unprompted pot shot at fellow babyface Eddie Kingston who can't even verbally defend himself because he's been suspended in real life due to a backstage incident?! What an asshole! He must be a heel now!"

They laugh and pop at the zinger because it was a good zinger.

I think you’re way off, but I guess we’ll find out tonight and Sunday.

 

[CBBI]

I think you’re way off, but I guess we’ll find out tonight and Sunday.

My main suggestion to Khan would be that if Punk is going to do a full blown turn heel on Sunday and take back the belt - and he's gonna get cheered no matter what because it's Punk in Chicago winning the belt, but that is what it is - that he does it through clear chicancery.

He has to cheat to win. Flat out. Like Punk comes out tonight and he challenges Moxley to a no DQ street fight and Punk beats Moxley with a nut shot, who cares? That's perfectly legal within the confines of the match and it really wouldn't be screwing the top babyface out of the belt.

If you're gonna do the turn, you gotta *really* do the turn and he's gotta steal it.

 

[Derek]

My main suggestion to Khan would be that if Punk is going to do a full blown turn heel on Sunday and take back the belt - and he's gonna get cheered no matter what because it's Punk in Chicago winning the belt, but that is what it is - that he does it through clear chicancery.

He has to cheat to win. Flat out. Like Punk comes out tonight and he challenges Moxley to a no DQ street fight and Punk beats Moxley with a nut shot, who cares? That's perfectly legal within the confines of the match and it really wouldn't be screwing the top babyface out of the belt.

If you're gonna do the turn, you gotta *really* do the turn and he's gotta steal it.

I 100% agree, and that’s my expectation if they end up having Punk win.

He might get cheered in Chicago, but I see Punk as a heel moving forward.

 

[Derek]

Predictions for the Casino Ladder Match on Sunday? No names announced yet.

Off the top of my head, Andrade or Orange Cassidy (assuming Best Friends aren’t in the trios finals) would be great picks.

Would love to see an OC/Heel Punk feud.

 

[pr26]

Predictions for the Casino Ladder Match on Sunday? No names announced yet.

Off the top of my head, Andrade or Orange Cassidy (assuming Best Friends aren’t in the trios finals) would be great picks.

Would love to see an OC/Heel Punk feud.

MJF as a surprise return if he doesn’t come back tonight. Adam Cole if he’s cleared. Samoa Joe return since Twisted Metal wrapped?

 

[Derek]

MJF as a surprise return if he doesn’t come back tonight. Adam Cole if he’s cleared. Samoa Joe return since Twisted Metal wrapped?

That’s kind of a let down of an MJF return though, in my opinion.

With the direction I believe they’re taking Punk, an “I told you so” return seems like the move. Maybe they could accomplish that with him returning in the ladder match; we’ll see.

If Cole is cleared, which I believe he is, I see UE costing the Elite in the trios tournament.

Joe is a possibility, but I don’t care for that option since he’s already holding a title.

 

[pr26]

That’s kind of a let down of an MJF return though, in my opinion.

With the direction I believe they’re taking Punk, an “I told you so” return seems like the move. Maybe they could accomplish that with him returning in the ladder match; we’ll see.

If Cole is cleared, which I believe he is, I see UE costing the Elite in the trios tournament.

Joe is a possibility, but I don’t care for that option since he’s already holding a title.

Agreed on MJF and Cole. I would love a heel Punk vs Joe mini feud, but I’m biased because Joe vs Punk in ROH is what got me into the Indy scene in the first place. Would be cool to see them run that back…but could be later when Joe drops the ROH title.

I bet Sammy is added to the ladder match for a few bumps.

 

[Derek]

Agreed on MJF and Cole. I would love a heel Punk vs Joe mini feud, but I’m biased because Joe vs Punk in ROH is what got me into the Indy scene in the first place. Would be cool to see them run that back…but could be later when Joe drops the ROH title.

I bet Sammy is added to the ladder match for a few bumps.

When I go through the roster, it seems like a lot of the top guys are involved in other matches right now. Maybe we get some NJPW guys involved?

 

[pr26]

When I go through the roster, it seems like a lot of the top guys are involved in other matches right now. Maybe we get some NJPW guys involved?

No idea if KOR is cleared…but seemed like he was getting a push prior to injury. Could see him added if he’s able.

I’m sure he’s likely going back to WWE with trips in charge now…but imagine the pop Wyatt would get as a joker in that match.

 

[Derek]

No idea if KOR is cleared…but seemed like he was getting a push prior to injury. Could see him added if he’s able.

I’m sure he’s likely going back to WWE with trips in charge now…but imagine the pop Wyatt would get as a joker in that match.

KOR vs Mox for the interim title was one of my favorite matches of the year