Your 2019 Cleveland Indians

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

You say that we have youth in the wings to replace Kipnis production

The issue of course is we do not know if they can replace his current production?

Critics of players and trade lovers fail to see that these moves do not happen in a vacuum .. Arroyo and Chang or a vet in/up mean that two go

Kip and Freeman have been huge helps ... if we step away from bias we have to own that or have you and others forgotten we have best record in baseball since early June

By the way I will own that I am warming to Puig ... but still no dings from he and Reyes

Please don't try and paint me as a "Kipnis basher" with a bias against him. If you're going to come in here and be disingenuous from the opening, don't expect anyone to engage you.

 

[Urban]

EDIT (can't actually edit my posts right now for some reason): found it on Fangraphs, what's the difference in how FG calculates their WAR compared to everyone else?

Main difference is Fangraphs uses FIP (for pitching) and UZR (for fielding), while Baseball Reference uses ERA and DRS. Batting and baserunning formulas are relatively similar, if I am not mistaken

 

[daddywags]

I'm not in the clubhouse, but from reading over the years and watching player interactions I believe that Kipnis has more overall value than what he brings on the field. He strikes me as a leader of sorts and helps keep the team loose but focused. I don't think they'll pick up his option but I won't be surprised to see him back somehow. If he leaves I think it will be felt in the clubhouse.

 

[jack hammill]

Please don't try and paint me as a "Kipnis basher" with a bias against him. If you're going to come in here and be disingenuous from the opening, don't expect anyone to engage you.

I believe that I used plural terms throughout

I will concede at this point that I wish I would have simply said what proof do you and others have that Arroyo Chang or another vet would put up what Kipnis and Freeman have done this season

As for disingenuous I believe both of you and I have been sincere ...

Do I want them to spend 16 mill ... not if they do not see it in the budget but Lindor is a chemistry guy and like others here I believe Kipnis adds to that chemistry

 

[BMAN]

I believe that I used plural terms throughout

I will concede at this point that I wish I would have simply said what proof do you and others have that Arroyo Chang or another vet would put up what Kipnis and Freeman have done this season

As for disingenuous I believe both of you and I have been sincere ...

Do I want them to spend 16 mill ... not if they do not see it in the budget but Lindor is a chemistry guy and like others here I believe Kipnis adds to that chemistry

Wait, you know Arroyo and Chang are different people right? Or did you forget a comma?

 

[Real Deal]

So who in the world saw Gio Urshela hitting 3rd in the Yankees lineup totalling up 16 HRs with a +900 OPS while hitting 2 Hrs a piece in back to back games. In no way am I discrediting the Indians, tough luck, Yankees got extremely lucky. Baseball will always be weird.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

So who in the world saw Gio Urshela hitting 3rd in the Yankees lineup totalling up 16 HRs with a +900 OPS while hitting 2 Hrs a piece in back to back games. In no way am I discrediting the Indians, tough luck, Yankees got extremely lucky. Baseball will always be weird.

I'm happy for him.

If he helps the Yankees advance in the playoffs, I'll be less happy for him.

 

[EdMonix11]

The option amount is only 2 million more than what he made this year. What are you guys hypothetically doing with that money instead?

FWIW, declining Kipnis' option wouldn't even cover the combination of raises due to Santana, Lindor, Kluber, Carrasco, Hand, Ramirez, R. Perez and Clevinger.

Essentially, Kip's option money is likely earmarked to keep the this core together for longer. If you're dead set on the Indians redistributing that money into the FA market, and signing a significant piece, you're gonna be disappointed. Hell, the increases in salary are gonna cut way into the Bauer savings as well.

Clev is gonna get paid in arbitration. Lindor is gonna get PAID in arbitration. Modest increases to the rest of the guys signed long term ($500k-$2.50M).

 

[EdMonix11]

Also, it's absolutely INSANE how cheap Jose Ramirez's contract is.

The dude has been worth an average of 6.4 wins over the past three years and signed a contract with an AAV of $6.5M?

He would've easily earned more money in his three arbitration years than the entirety of his six year extension-- which I'm including his two team options.

Crazy lucky for the Indians FO. They're basically getting three prime Jose Ramirez seasons for free.

 

[jack hammill]

Wait, you know Arroyo and Chang are different people right? Or did you forget a comma?

You know you and others are not the least bit original ...

This is not the first forum that individuals have taken joy in ridiculing somebody with Rookie status or a low post count ... You would think one and others with your wisdom could have given a logical answer

I at least fell on my sword and owned I may be wrong about Puig

 

[NorthCoastBias]

 

[BMAN]

You know you and others are not the least bit original ...

This is not the first forum that individuals have taken joy in ridiculing somebody with Rookie status or a low post count ... You would think one and others with your wisdom could have given a logical answer

I at least fell on my sword and owned I may be wrong about Puig

I was honestly being kind of serious. Why are you so testy?

 

[bob2the2nd]

Who???

 

[Kevalier]

I would be stunned if Zimmer is ever a regular player for the Tribe again.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

You know you and others are not the least bit original ...

This is not the first forum that individuals have taken joy in ridiculing somebody with Rookie status or a low post count ... You would think one and others with your wisdom could have given a logical answer

I at least fell on my sword and owned I may be wrong about Puig

Where the fuck did @BMAN say anything about your low post count or status???

You wrote down "Arroyo Chang" buddy.

Most people would just respond with a "whoops! Forgot the comma!"rather than an all out attack that ends with some masturbatory celebration of" falling on your sword"