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2012 NFL Draft Rumor Thread

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Can you please post a scouting report that says his arm strength is mediocre? I would be interested to see it since every one I have read says the opposite.

Weeden has just average arm strength. He throws a tight catchable ball, but you seldom see him “drive” the ball.

He does have very good accuracy and his ball placement is above average. One of my main concerns is his lack of mobility. He is very stationary. While he has a quick release he does not show the skills to extend plays or make plays with his feet. This is a trait that will not improve.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Is-Brandon-Weeden-a-premium-draft-choice.html




You're drafting this guy hoping he can be an average NFL starter.....In the first round.

What the fuck is the point of that? You should be drafting HIGH CEILING PLAYERS in the early rounds, not a guy who might be slightly better than Colt McCoy because you missed out on the actual good quarterback prospects in this draft.

It's a huge reach, and just the type of move I expect the Browns to make which will continue their cycle of mediocrity.
 
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Is-Brandon-Weeden-a-premium-draft-choice.html


You're drafting this guy hoping he can be an average NFL starter.....In the first round.

What the fuck is the point of that? You should be drafting HIGH CEILING PLAYERS in the early rounds, not a guy who might be slightly better than Colt McCoy because you missed out on the actual good quarterback prospects in this draft.

It's a huge reach, and just the type of move I expect the Browns to make which will continue their cycle of mediocrity.

ummm WTF is the national football post? any article that says weeden has anything but good to very good arm strength has either a huge bias against the guy or just flat out doesnt know what they are talking about. anyone on this board that questions weedens arm strength should have never supported the draft of colt mccoy anywhere in a round before the 7th.
 
ummm WTF is the national football post? any article that says weeden has anything but good to very good arm strength has either a huge bias against the guy or just flat out doesnt know what they are talking about. anyone on this board that questions weedens arm strength should have never supported the draft of colt mccoy anywhere in a round before the 7th.

What makes the National Football Post any more, less credible than Mel Kiper?

Everyone has an opinion...and while some are seemingly fixated on his arm strength...the BROADER point is that he is a low ceiling QB with very little room for growth.

What is the point of taking low ceiling at this position right now?

Just to be marginally better than McCoy?

All these scouting reports you're so enamored with have this guy as an average NFL starter at best, and that is a fucking joke to take in the first round or early in the second.
 
What makes the National Football Post any more, less credible than Mel Kiper?

Everyone has an opinion...and while some are seemingly fixated on his arm strength...the BROADER point is that he is a low ceiling QB with very little room for growth.

What is the point of taking low ceiling at this position right now?

Just to be marginally better than McCoy?

All these scouting reports you're so enamored with have this guy as an average NFL starter at best, and that is a fucking joke to take in the first round or early in the second.

This is the scouting report on Weeden from the very same site. It shows a bit of a different interpretation of his arm qualities and other skills.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=38638

A strong, well put together quarterback with a live arm and the ability to make all the throws with ease. Is a former second round pick of the Yankees in 2002, but his baseball career ended in 2005 due to an arm injury. Enrolled at Oklahoma State in 2007 and took over as the starter in 2010. Plays in a spread and takes nearly all of his snaps from the gun. Displays sneaky athleticism for his size and exhibits a natural feel inside the pocket. Keeps his eyes down the field when he feels an outside rush, can maintain balance when stepping up and throw absolute darts all over the field. However, gets too upright at times in his drop, causing him to struggle to quickly re-set his feet and really stride toward his target. Will fall off his fair share of throws when he feels pressure inside causing his accuracy and decision making to struggle because of it. When he does have more time does a much better job bending at the knees and really transferring his weight well, generating good torque from his lower half. Can really spin the football on all levels of the field and exhibits good accuracy and ball placement both in the intermediate and vertical passing game. Anticipates routes well down the field, snaps his head around quickly when working off play action from the gun and can fit the ball in tight areas on time with receivers. Also, displays "plus" touch vertically down the field, routinely drops the football into the outstretched arms of his target and looks comfortable using the same throwing motion.

Will drop his arm angle down a bit underneath in the short passing game where he gets lazy with his plant foot and his ball placement will struggle because of it. Is a smart kid who does a nice job recognizing defenses with his pre snap read and as the year went on did a better job looking off safeties and working through his progressions across the field. Gets a bit unbalanced with his footwork when working his way across the field because he gets upright at times, but should improve with more experience. Will throw blind when going back across the field and get himself into some trouble with interceptions because of it. Is a good enough athlete to throw on the move, isn't going to be dynamic by any sense in the open field, but can create time for himself when flushed from the pocket and scamper for additional yards.

An older prospect who will turn 28 years old in October.

Impression: His age will likely keep him from going as early in the draft as his talents deserve. But there isn't a throw this guy can't make and he has the skill set and mental make-up to mature into a potential starter with some time.
 
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Is-Brandon-Weeden-a-premium-draft-choice.html




You're drafting this guy hoping he can be an average NFL starter.....In the first round.

What the fuck is the point of that? You should be drafting HIGH CEILING PLAYERS in the early rounds, not a guy who might be slightly better than Colt McCoy because you missed out on the actual good quarterback prospects in this draft.

It's a huge reach, and just the type of move I expect the Browns to make which will continue their cycle of mediocrity.

There are many more reports that call his arm a notch below elite. I've watched almost every ok state game this season, there is nothing indicating a mediocre arm. You said he had a marginally better arm than Colt, which is flat out ludicrous. I understand some of the other knocks against him. Age, injury, problems under pressure, footwork, fine. Those are all legitimate concerns, arm strength is not one of them.

Also, I don't thin anybody here wants him in the 1st round, so what you said about that is also flat out untrue.
 
We'll agree to disagree on his arm strength...but again, nobody can even admit to the fact his ceiling is average starter.

That's the broader point here.

You're basically saying "well, we know this guy will probably be average at best...but since Colt sucks we'll throw away an early pick on an incremental upgrade"

It's just a poor draft pick, there's no other way to say it.

You want guys with potential, not a guy who projects to be average.
 
We'll agree to disagree on his arm strength...but again, nobody can even admit to the fact his ceiling is average starter.

That's the broader point here.

You're basically saying "well, we know this guy will probably be average at best...but since Colt sucks we'll throw away an early pick on an incremental upgrade"

It's just a poor draft pick, there's no other way to say it.

You want guys with potential, not a guy who projects to be average.

I would agree that his ceiling is probably an average starting QB in the NFL. There are 32 starting QBs in the league so the average guys are somewhere between 10-20 in a given category. Here are the average guys in the NFL last year (use any metric you like to examine it, I chose passer rating)
Roethlisberger
Rivers
Matt Moore
Jay Cutler
Michael Vick
Cam Newton
Matt Hasselbeck
Kevin Kolb
Joe Flacco
Carson Palmer
Andy Dalton

No metric is going to be perfect but my point is still the same. The 'average' QBs in this league are no slouches. I would take most of those guys on that list as my QB tomorrow. So when we say Weeden's ceiling is an average QB, I don't see why that's a knock. I'd take that out of a 2nd round pick.
 
I would agree that his ceiling is probably an average starting QB in the NFL. There are 32 starting QBs in the league so the average guys are somewhere between 10-20 in a given category. Here are the average guys in the NFL last year (use any metric you like to examine it, I chose passer rating)
Roethlisberger
Rivers
Matt Moore
Jay Cutler
Michael Vick
Cam Newton
Matt Hasselbeck
Kevin Kolb
Joe Flacco
Carson Palmer
Andy Dalton

No metric is going to be perfect but my point is still the same. The 'average' QBs in this league are no slouches. I would take most of those guys on that list as my QB tomorrow. So when we say Weeden's ceiling is an average QB, I don't see why that's a knock. I'd take that out of a 2nd round pick.

I think I'd put Roethlisberger and Rivers in the top 10..
 
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Is-Brandon-Weeden-a-premium-draft-choice.html


You're drafting this guy hoping he can be an average NFL starter.....In the first round.

What the fuck is the point of that? You should be drafting HIGH CEILING PLAYERS in the early rounds, not a guy who might be slightly better than Colt McCoy because you missed out on the actual good quarterback prospects in this draft.

It's a huge reach, and just the type of move I expect the Browns to make which will continue their cycle of mediocrity.

Thanks for posting that scouting report. It is indeed the first I've seen that questions his arm strength.

I have never advocated using a first-round pick on Weeden; you're putting words in my mouth. I don't even think we should take him at No. 37 (but would not freak out if we did). I think he would be a fine pick in the third round, though. If he is an average player, it's no big loss. But according to the majority of scouting reports, he does have potential in the NFL, even at his age. It's a low-risk/high-reward pick in the third round.
 
ummm WTF is the national football post? any article that says weeden has anything but good to very good arm strength has either a huge bias against the guy or just flat out doesnt know what they are talking about. anyone on this board that questions weedens arm strength should have never supported the draft of colt mccoy anywhere in a round before the 7th.

The National Football Post is a pretty good site, even though their most recent mock has us taking Tannehill at No. 4. They do a pretty good job in scouting and ranking prospects.
 
We'll agree to disagree on his arm strength...but again, nobody can even admit to the fact his ceiling is average starter.

That's the broader point here.

You're basically saying "well, we know this guy will probably be average at best...but since Colt sucks we'll throw away an early pick on an incremental upgrade"

It's just a poor draft pick, there's no other way to say it.

You want guys with potential, not a guy who projects to be average.

Here's the thing though, I actually think he has the potential to be a pretty good player in this league. Do I think he'll be elite? No probably not, but I think he'll be more than a decent starter in this league for 7-8 years. He's fairly NFL ready too, he won't need as much time to develop as someone like Tannehill will.

I'd take "pretty good" for 7 years at the most important position on the field, in the late second early third, all day long. Especially compared to the horse shit we've been trotting out for the last decade.
 
I don't see why he's anymore NFL ready than the average 22-24 year old QB coming out this year, and those guys all have room for improvement...whereas Weeden is pretty much maxed out potential wise for his age.

You draft guys who you feel can be come high level, elite players in the early rounds.

Not guys you hope to compare to Matt Hasselbeck one day...as a best case scenario.
 
Reuben Frank
‏ @RoobCSN
A source tells me Eagles & Browns talk all the time and 4th pick has come up but chances of an Eagles trade from 15 to 4 are slim to none
.
 
I think I'd put Roethlisberger and Rivers in the top 10..

Yes I agree with you on Ben and Rivers but I think you missed my point. Like I said I chose last year's passer rating as my metric. Choose yds, completion %, TDs and the names will change a bit but the point remains, those average QBs are pretty good.
 
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